Billion dollor idea....( for some great brain)

[rkumar]

Hi Friends,

I am very sensitive to problems around me and try my best to address them in a most economic way. Now we have water problem every where and at the same time lots of pure water goes waste. How to address this problem. I have one idea ( may sound stupid though) ;

Sugarcane juice has 80% water, 10% sugar and 10% other impurities and minerals by weight. The water is purest form of water. This water is removed by heating. look at the tragedy, again we need to put water in sugar for any thing we prepare, be it tea, coffee, for that matter anything.. So is there anyway that we can retain water and sugar and can remove only other impurties and minerals ? Water may have been cheap in olden days when sugar yechnology was invented. However, now water and sugar cost almost same. Like water is transported long distances, this purified perserved sugar solution can also be transported and can be used for all applications thereby saving precious water. Whole thing makes great economics sense and will be a billion dollor industry. Any taker?....I am sure this has to happen some day, some where by some one..we can not let the water go waste from any resource...including urine...

Rajendra

[amanpoonia]

namaste rajender uncle
i do agree with u . we have to think abt this matter bcoz the drinkable water is running out very fast n may be in half century of something we wount have enough water to drink .so its time to think n preserve water as much as we can.i would like to tell that i just read yesterday that in making 500 million tons of food we create 3500 milloin tons of waste in which most of the thing is harmful to environment.also i would like to tell in Australia n especially in Sydney every day 250 litres of water is supplied for each person out of which the person uses only 3 litre for drinking n rest he waste.so u can think easily how much drinking water is wasted .
i would like to say that we should save each n every drop of water .genearlly we dont give importance to things which r easily available like water but i would like to ask my freinds for a little test .dont drink water for one day n then see what value it has ...i m sure from that day u will start taking responsibility.if we can change ourself ,its more than enough.think abt it
aman

[rsdalal]

Rajender Ji,
Good Topic and idea but some constraints.
You have Water +Sugar +Impurities
Take out impurities and water, remains dry sugar.

What you are suggesting is take out just impurities and we will be left with water + sugar. Seems to be good, as we add water anyway later on when we need to use sugar. But this solution may not be cost effective to store for long term, as dried sugar can be stored for long term, without any addition. But this solution(watre+sugar) will definitley need some kind of preservative to keep it good for some time. that may end up costlier than the dried sugar. That may be one of the reason that this did not happen yet.
Just a thought, please do not take it otherwise.

[rkumar]

Ranvir Singh Dalal (May 16, 2003 06:58 a.m.):
Rajender Ji,
Good Topic and idea but some constraints.
You have Water +Sugar +Impurities
Take out impurities and water, remains dry sugar.

What you are suggesting is take out just impurities and we will be left with water + sugar. Seems to be good, as we add water anyway later on when we need to use sugar. But this solution may not be cost effective to store for long term, as dried sugar can be stored for long term, without any addition. But this solution(watre+sugar) will definitley need some kind of preservative to keep it good for some time. that may end up costlier than the dried sugar. That may be one of the reason that this did not happen yet.
Just a thought, please do not take it otherwise.

This was the reason in past, I agree. But now when pure water is selling at Rs 12 per litre and sugar also at Rs 13 per kg, both are equally important. I know there are problems and this is why I have put up this question. All problems need to be taken care off..

Dalal Sahib, take it from me, there won't be water for irrigation, cattle feeding and for may other needs...We are heading for real trouble. Water at Rs 12 per litle is a multi billion dollor industry already.. and then we need water for sewage disposal and for so many other needs..
where is the water...? Jats have a greater interest in water than others as we need it for many more things...Anyway, let us keep working , I am sure we will reach some where.

Rajendra

[srajdeep]

good idea but think if we could separate water from sugarcane why not do it from sea water (which is lot lot more than number of sugarcane in the world) and will be cheaper to produce.

[rkumar]

Rajdeep Singh Saroha (May 16, 2003 12:05 p.m.):
good idea but think if we could separate water from sugarcane why not do it from sea water (which is lot lot more than number of sugarcane in the world) and will be cheaper to produce.

Agree my friend. But what I am suggesting is to retain the water and remove only the impurities..

Rajendra

[sanjaychhikara]

this link is somewhat diffrent then the topic going on but its very informative about water and related topics

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/6308_0,00160011.htm

[akdabas]

This link is different but good and informative. I think the public must start considering all these other options to retain the ground water level.

[scsheorayan]

Very interesting subject but needs more research. Let us have some facts and then evaluate them scientifically and economically.

FACT 1.
Bottled water sells for Rs. 12 per litre. But billions of litres flows from ground to sea and lost through evaporation. It is more economical to conserve this water than to produce from sea water.
FACT2.
Wheat crop requires atleast 7 soaks of water and if the price of one litre is taken at even 12 paise it will be economically unviable.
FACT3.
The cost of water to Jats is much less hence the agriculture still survives.
FACT4.
Those who pay Rs. 12 per litre have probably more money to spare for indulgence or out of fear for their health.
FACT5.
It has been shown a few times that bottled water some times is no better than tap water.
It is an industry which thrives on fear.
FACT6,
Yes it is possible to keep sugar in liquid form but will be more expensive for which no one is willing to pay.

Thanks for sharing the idea but let us selve it for the time being because water is still affordable. Yes conservation and water management are essential probably we can discuss about them.

[sweet]

good idea......................


cheers..........................

[rkumar]

Shubha Chand Sheorayan (May 16, 2003 11:19 p.m.):
Very interesting subject but needs more research. Let us have some facts and then evaluate them scientifically and economically.

Thanks for sharing the idea but let us selve it for the time being because water is still affordable. Yes conservation and water management are essential probably we can discuss about them.

Thank you Shubha Chand Ji. I differ with your concluding remarks simply because;

1. If we seriously start working on the type of ideas I am presenting, it won't be before decades that any viable solution will be found.

2. As of now we have enough petrol but still almost all auto manufaturers are working on alternative fuel vehicles.

3. When you speak of billions of litres flowing into sea, the assumption is that we have enough rain. With changing climatic conditions, the regularity of rain is not sure any more.

4. Hope you know how fast the ground water level is going down in villages? Trust me, every year the farmers have to dig deeper and deeper.

I agree with you, there are many alternatives to having water. Rain water certainly is the purest and mot economic source of water. But unfortunately that too needs to be stored and no one is doing any thing on that. Most of the village ponds and other water bodies have been encroached upon by people. Look at even in national capital. Do we have enough storage reservoirs on the way of yamuna? Certainly no. Watre is goingto be the commodity of reginal, national and international disputes and polotics from now on ( look at karnatka vd Tamilnadu, haryana vs Panjab, India vs Bangladesh..). As far as I am concerned, I can see the writings on the wall. In last 35 years I have seen water table going down by almost 35 feet in my own village. In next 30 yeasr it will go down by 50 feet I am sure...with no reliable electric supply and fuel cost rising one can imagine how the water is going to be puped out even for drinking, what to speak of irrigation.

So in capital letters I will say that, " IF AT ALL THERE IS SOMETHING TO WORRY ABOUT, IT IS THE WATER." Every possible source of water need to be looked into seriously.

Rajendra

[scsheorayan]

Dear Rajender ji,

Agree with you that water table is going down and rains are scarce. But worrying does not solve any thing. Somewhere on this site only I have seen a posting about Gujarat Sarpanch who took the initiative and changed the whole village through water conservation. The problem is more deeper than the tube well. It is one of cultural change whereby incresing number of people have made indulgence their top priority instead of sacrifice of labour. Mechanisation has helped accelerate the process and I think science can provide the best solutions. There are three areas we can consider;
1.Use less water
2.Make more water available
3.Both 1 and 2 above.

How can we use less water is in itself a vast subject and can be learnt from other countries who have adopted Water Management technics.For example drip irrigation in Israel, Murray River Project in Australia. There must be many more examples which can be explored.Voters can make it an issue and pressure the Govt in allocating necessary resources. More on this subject later.

[rkumar]

[quote]Shubha Chand Sheorayan (May 17, 2003 08:41 a.m.):
Dear Shubha Chand ji,

Agree with you on all the following

1.Use less water
2.Make more water available
3.Both 1 and 2 above.

Problem is that in theory we seem to know more than everybody but fail when it comes to implimenting some thing. Can we make some real efforts on ground and educate people and make them take part in all what we know..Time has for action and debate alone won't take us too far.

Rajendra

[s_barala]

Dear Rajender Ji
This is great Idea. Now the thing is this that inspite of getting details of why the water is not retained, let's work on the ideas which will prove that this can also happen. I am fuly with you and willcertainly spare sometime in this.
BUT there is one thing. I MODERATE IDEA ACTED UPON IS BETTER THAN GREAT IDEA LEFT IN JUNK.

[rkumar]

Sanjeev (May 20, 2003 10:36 a.m.):
Dear Rajender Ji
This is great Idea. Now the thing is this that inspite of getting details of why the water is not retained, let's work on the ideas which will prove that this can also happen. I am fuly with you and willcertainly spare sometime in this.
BUT there is one thing. I MODERATE IDEA ACTED UPON IS BETTER THAN GREAT IDEA LEFT IN JUNK.

Agree Sanjeev. I have been reading a lot on Sugar technology lately and notice that very little advances have taken place in India in last 50 years. Gur technology remains as old as 2000 years and there is hardly anything substantial done on sugarcane juice preservation. I think as a first step, there is great potential if sugarcane juice can be preserved at least for a week if not more..Served chilled in summer, it is a great source of both energy and water..

Rajendra

[anilkc]

Buy sugar cane.
Juice it at home.
Make tea (or use it instead of sugar in whatever u add sugar)
drink (eat) it.
---u will get ur ans.

[vivek]

I am the engineering manager for Muskegon County wastewater system. A brief overview of the system is given in our website

http://www.co.muskegon.mi.us/wwtf.htm

I believe the concept can be applied to the sandy arid soils west of Delhi, and we can have renewable resource along with clean water.

The concept is simple. We collect all the sewage in muskegon county. The primary treatment consists of adding oxygen to the water, and the the separating the solids. The effluent from this is then sprayed over crops. Originally the area had poor sandy soils. The soil filters the water, and the crops use nitrogen and phosphorus in the water as nutrients, and further clean the water. We then collect the water through a system of underground perforated piping. the water collecetd is as clean as any spring in Michigan. The crops we grow (alpha alpha, soyabean, and corn) are sold as feed crop and lower the cost of treatment. Over time this sandy soil that grew nothing has become quite arable.

[bnashier]

Well, some 40 years ago people did store sugarcane juice minus impurities - in the form of syrup. But you can't keep it for long at room temperature. You can freeze it. To freeze it, you need electric power - which needs water to produce it. That sends you from the pan into the fire!