Does God Exists?? [Archive]

narendra81

March 8th, 2009, 09:25 PM

this is generic post however i would like to reply.
let me try to answer the second question first. I would say i believe in death because i ve seen others die. So it looks OK to believe smthing if u ve experienced or smone else has experienced it :).

Now abt sample test.
First of all we use/buy things only if we need it. I dont feel any need of believing in GOD in my life. Also i dnt see any impact or diffrence in my life(not beliving in GOD) and my other friends( who believe in GOD).
Again, i agree that 'there are many things we use/believe/buy without a SAMPLE TEST or TEST DRIVE' in that case after using the thing we can come to know if it was good or bad. But in this case, even if I believe, how can I know if it really exists. Soon or later I should know what difference it makes believing in GOD and not beliving.

There is a limit to experimenting, there are many things we use/believe/buy without a SAMPLE TEST or TEST DRIVE. Can you say i'll believe in DEATH only after i die:)

regards,
narendra

shekhar_nehra

March 9th, 2009, 12:01 AM

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

It all depends on how you want to see the things and the unseeable as well. Maano to sab kuch hai na maano to kuch nhai

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

Please : Now Oranges are being compared with Apples here. Faith/belief in God and his existence may not be compared with buying a car. If the only point you want to make here is about lack of verifiable evidence. May be ! ... but again example if not apt. Probably if I know what a car is and how it should work and not bothered about color, other details of car and have faith on you that you would provide me something that can be used travel from say point A to B, I might buy that car :confused:

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

We are naive only by following the instructions without understanding them why they are being given and also who is giving them.

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Because one does not live long enough to experiment and verify everything so one needs to believe some things and not all. There is a thin line between truth and the untrue and you need to judge what to believe and what not to believe and not to work according someone else s belief.

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??

Who tells you to believe only in the things that you can express , feel and is within your intellect. It is not a concept, its fact , though you may live in denial forever.

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

Now you are questioning the very existence of life. God is not a fear or love alone. What is fear ? What is Love ? Your personal experience may be different from anyone else s

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??

How do you find that ? What is the lie ?

Its becoming a trend now to days to challenge the well established facts or things just in search of new perspective or a feeling of doubt being confused.

Before we discuss about God, Deepak ji please come out how you perceive him. What has been told about him that you do not approve/agree. What is your point of view ? What makes you say God exists or does not exist. Just initiating a thread and let others decide it for you would not be fair as you have stated why believe that is told to you.

Regards
Shekhar

deepika

March 9th, 2009, 02:52 AM

Very true.Its not necessary that what's not visible doesn't really exist.For example if your parents are strict and dont show any visible gesture to shower their love it won't really change the fact that they love you.About God's existence i would sayiIf a particular religion does it then u can doubt his existance.But you will find people worship,all over world, that divine and supreme power(name may vary ofcourse).If you try to be practical and want it to be approved scientifically it will be difficult.You can experiment with what we(Human beings)can see but not with which we can't touch but can only feel.Sometimes we can't buy a logic given by science as well for example i read somewhere that presence of high levels of a particular harmone leads one to infidelity.But it will be sheer madness if someone cheats on his/her life partner and gives(if caught) this excuse that it happened because of high levels of harmones:DNobody would buy this.Lot of things are beyond the reach of science.So sometimes what has been proved in science laboratories fails to make us digest facts explained and mentioned.So it depends on individual to individual how they think about certain things.They have their own reasons to believe or not to believe it.

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

It all depends on how you want to see the things and the unseeable as well. Maano to sab kuch hai na maano to kuch nhai

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

Please : Now Oranges are being compared with Apples here. Faith/belief in God and his existence may not be compared with buying a car. If the only point you want to make here is about lack of verifiable evidence. May be ! ... but again example if not apt. Probably if I know what a car is and how it should work and not bothered about color, other details of car and have faith on you that you would provide me something that can be used travel from say point A to B, I might buy that car :confused:

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

We are naive only by following the instructions without understanding them why they are being given and also who is giving them.

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Because one does not live long enough to experiment and verify everything so one needs to believe some things and not all. There is a thin line between truth and the untrue and you need to judge what to believe and what not to believe and not to work according someone else s belief.

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??

Who tells you to believe only in the things that you can express , feel and is within your intellect. It is not a concept, its fact , though you may live in denial forever.

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

Now you are questioning the very existence of life. God is not a fear or love alone. What is fear ? What is Love ? Your personal experience may be different from anyone else s

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??

How do you find that ? What is the lie ?

Its becoming a trend now to days to challenge the well established facts or things just in search of new perspective or a feeling of doubt being confused.

Before we discuss about God, Deepak ji please come out how you perceive him. What has been told about him that you do not approve/agree. What is your point of view ? What makes you say God exists or does not exist. Just initiating a thread and let others decide it for you would not be fair as you have stated why believe that is told to you.

Regards
Shekhar

Dear Friends,

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??:D

Warm regards,

Deepak

kulduhan

March 9th, 2009, 03:29 AM

Off course I do believe in omnipotent supreme power thts divine Spirit control the whole universe all around us,e.g Heated cosmic bodies , Planets, Atmosphere, Super-terrestial space, Suns , Stars. If nobody control this system then here is it possible to sustain a single moment on earth? why these all are working and revolving in a order,

God may not be provable through mathematical formulae or on the basis of Test drive you mentioned as a masterpiece example in my knowledge !!! There is no reason not to believe in God, and there is every reason to believe in Him. , but we live in an era where the evidence of an Intelligent Designer is all around us who designed this universe and now controlling . I think so, without the existence of this supreme power it is complicated to understand the order in cosmological, stellar, planetary, chemical and biological systems .

-Kuldeep Duhan
------------------------------------------------------------------------

[quote=deepakchoudhry;202799]Dear Friends

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??:D

navingulia

March 9th, 2009, 09:01 AM

why does one want to know the existence of God?

Nishantrathi82

March 9th, 2009, 09:14 AM

I don't know whether God exsists or not. But beleive in God give me some kind of peace and releif and above all it keeps me away from wrong things by saying that god is watching me if do wrong he will punish me. And most importantly my Mom always feel happy if do worship of God that's more than important for me. But i don't beleive in any kind of Dhoong and dekahva by saying that its god's worship.

rakeshsehrawat

March 9th, 2009, 09:27 AM

:D:D

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

Warm regards,

Deepak
This is matter of trust only. I bought my first car only because my cousin was using that and he told me it is nice car i don't want to sell it out but i am buying a new one so you buy it. I bought that and i found it really nice. I bought another but i am not that much satisfied with that??

What if you testdrive a used car and buy it as soon as you reach home it broke down then what?
All is in your mind when you are in trouble then only you remember God. If something bad happens to you , you yourself declare it as fault of God. If everything running smooth things going well you are doing that.
Have you seen something bad or good?
How can you distinguish between the two the thing you are saying bad is good for others or Viceversa.

God never says believe in me.

Well i made my point i want you to seek answer of my question You have heard about lot of religions and found one word either Bhagwan, Allah, God, Sache pathsah where all these originated from when nothing like that is there?Why every religion
I was not thinking to reply but........
your example made me to reply. Are you selling out your car? is it good? Which model and make? how much you are asking for that ? i have few persons who are willing to buy car:D

jagmohan

March 9th, 2009, 11:08 AM

A couple of comments by philosophers over the years, reproduced below.

"We donot know nor does anyome esle"

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but is not able? Then He is not Omnipotent.
Is He able but unwilling? Then He is Malveolent.
If He is both able and willing? Then whence cometh Evil? If He is neither able nor willing? The why call him God? ..... Epicurus

"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities".... Voltaire

Personally, I believe there is some unseen power that controls much more than what we believe it does.

Baki, sab drama hai...

Regards,

JS Malik

anilsinghd

March 9th, 2009, 10:55 PM

Here is what summarises my take on the subject:

Even though there is no direct physical evidence of God , one is better off having faith that God exists than sufferinf the potential consequences of being a non - believer : Pascal Wager !

In Financial Jargon this might be called : "Tail Hedging of the Portfolio called Life! " :)

narendra81

March 9th, 2009, 11:21 PM

thatz quite logical nishant. If believing in smthing makes us feel relieved or give u sm kind of peace or strength then we shouls go for it. And I love this "GOD is watching" concept, it works well more almost everyone :).
What i think is itz like if a lie does sm good for smone then letz go for it.

I don't know whether God exsists or not. But beleive in God give me some kind of peace and releif and above all it keeps me away from wrong things by saying that god is watching me if do wrong he will punish me. And most importantly my Mom always feel happy if do worship of God that's more than important for me. But i don't beleive in any kind of Dhoong and dekahva by saying that its god's worship.

cooljat

March 9th, 2009, 11:24 PM

Concur word by word with Great Jaggu Uncle ! :)

To add, I also firmly believe that there is certainly an invisible power (super soul) that govern this universe and we all have one tiny part of that inside of us (soul, inner conscience).
Thats why I always say, Am Spiritual not Ritual !!

But I kind of admit that, am not totally Atheist rather am lil Agnostic.

Rock on
Jit

A couple of comments by philosophers over the years, reproduced below.

"We donot know nor does anyome esle"

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but is not able? Then He is not Omnipotent.
Is He able but unwilling? Then He is Malveolent.
If He is both able and willing? Then whence cometh Evil? If He is neither able nor willing? The why call him God? ..... Epicurus

"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities".... Voltaire

Personally, I believe there is some unseen power that controls much more than what we believe it does.

Baki, sab drama hai...

Regards,

JS Malik

sunillathwal

March 9th, 2009, 11:55 PM

No..... :)

anilsinghd

March 10th, 2009, 12:09 AM

No..... :)

Prove it my friend :) ! At least i did not expect an irrational comment from you ....

sunillathwal

March 10th, 2009, 02:57 AM

Prove it my friend :) ! At least i did not expect an irrational comment from you ....

:)

ok, here i go:
When i was a kid, i believed in many things such as God, gods, goddesses, ghosts and many more. Andhere mein akele jane mein bhi dar lagta tha. A creature called “hhaauu” used to live in dark rooms…supposedly. :D Most of these thing evaporated out of ‘my world’ and simply because I never found them anywhere and I had no reason to believe that they do exist. (btw there are many kids who are still afraid of dark) :)
I feared ‘samshan-ghat’ a.. a.. a.. lot. I remember the day I ditched the concept of ghost and samshan-ghat and associated superstitions. (Though horror movies still frighten me but thats a different thing :o )
This GOD thing, i don’t when, where, why and how I ditched this concept but i can NOT fathom that there is something which controls my life and everything in this universe!! :)

I am sure all of us have discussed this topic many many times somwhere. Well, I am not the exception either. had numerous arguments over this with a variety of ppl. This discussion always ended somewhere here:

-----
Perosn X: “See, the thing is: to draw even a straight line, there has to be some creativity, some brain, some controlling power… now u tell me how these planets were formed??”

Me: “Well, Big-bang might have happened.”

Person X: “there has to be something/somebody behind all of this to happen. No?? And that is God my friend.”

Me: “so u mean for anything to happen, there has to be something behind it. Right??”

Perosn X: “Right.”… (1)

Me: “Ok, so to create a big- bang, we need to have some power because to carry out such a huge task we need a ‘creative- entity’ called God.”

Person X: “bang-on.”

Me: “then, who created God??”

Person X: “m not following you??”

Me: “see it takes creativity and hence a ‘supreme power’ to create a big-bang. Then to create that ‘supreme power’ we need another supremely ‘supreme power’ because according to u it always takes ‘something’ to create anything (Ref. eq. (1))
Now extend the same logic further where we will end?? :)
-------

In the end it is all about stretching the boundaries of God’s intervention. Many find it offensive that i ridicule the supremacy of God. They label me ignorant/arrogant or plain freak but the truth is, i too find it highly offensive when someone claims/doubts the self-sustainability of any biological/ecological system as god’s grace. :(

My take: if ‘God’ can happen on its own so can do ‘everything’ else. :)

sunillathwal

March 10th, 2009, 03:07 AM

Another set of arguments concluded:

What God does: Everything yet Nothing. :confused:

Where is God: Everywhere yet No where. ;)

Only logical/reasonable/appropriate gist, my little/ tiny/ small/ mortal brain can infer from the above mutual contradictory statements is that the thing called ‘God’ doesn’t exist!! As simple as that.:p

True, there is a lot that is unsolved for human-kind, there are lot of things which are beyond our control BUT if the progress made by human-kind in solving the mysteries of world/life is any indicator then God’s sphere of intervention is shrinking which in a way supports the non-existence of God (not other way round). :)

P.S. i’ll definitely and happily accept the ‘concept of God’ if i ever had a teeny-tiny doubt about the non-existence of the same. :)

Nishantrathi82

March 10th, 2009, 09:20 AM

ok, here i go:
When i was a kid, i believed in many things such as God, gods, goddesses, ghosts and many more. Andhere mein akele jane mein bhi dar lagta tha. A creature called “hhaauu” used to live in dark rooms…supposedly. :D Most of these thing evaporated out of ‘my world’ and simply because I never found them anywhere and I had no reason to believe that they do exist. (btw there are many kids who are still afraid of dark)
I feared ‘samshan-ghat’ a.. a.. a.. lot. I remember the day I ditched the concept of ghost and samshan-ghat and associated superstitions. (Though horror movies still frighten me but thats a different thing :o )
This GOD thing, i don’t when, where, why and how I ditched this concept but i can NOT fathom that there is something which controls my life and everything in this universe!!

I am sure all of us have discussed this topic many many times somwhere. Well, I am not the exception either. had numerous arguments over this with a variety of ppl. This discussion always ended somewhere here:

-----
Perosn X: “See, the thing is: to draw even a straight line, there has to be some creativity, some brain, some controlling power… now u tell me how these planets were formed??”

Me: “Well, Big-bang might have happened.”

Person X: “there has to be something/somebody behind all of this to happen. No?? And that is God my friend.”

Me: “so u mean for anything to happen, there has to be something behind it. Right??”

Perosn X: “Right.”… (1)

Me: “Ok, so to create a big- bang, we need to have some power because to carry out such a huge task we need a ‘creative- entity’ called God.”

Person X: “bang-on.”

Me: “then, who created God??”

Person X: “m not following you??”

Me: “see it takes creativity and hence a ‘supreme power’ to create a big-bang. Then to create that ‘supreme power’ we need another supremely ‘supreme power’ because according to u it always takes ‘something’ to create anything (Ref. eq. (1))
Now extend the same logic further where we will end??
-------

In the end it is all about stretching the boundaries of God’s intervention. Many find it offensive that i ridicule the supremacy of God. They label me ignorant/arrogant or plain freak but the truth is, i too find it highly offensive when someone claims/doubts the self-sustainability of any biological/ecological system as god’s grace. :(

My take: if ‘God’ can happen on its own so can do ‘everything’ else. :)

Another set of arguments concluded:

What God does: Everything yet Nothing. :confused:

Where is God: Everywhere yet No where. ;)

Only logical/reasonable/appropriate gist, my little/ tiny/ small/ mortal brain can infer from the above mutual contradictory statements is that the thing called ‘God’ doesn’t exist!! As simple as that.:p

True, there is a lot that is unsolved for human-kind, there are lot of things which are beyond our control BUT if the progress made by human-kind in solving the mysteries of world/life is any indicator then God’s sphere of intervention is shrinking which in a way supports the non-existence of God (not other way round). :)

P.S. i’ll definitely and happily accept the ‘concept of God’ if i ever had a teeny-tiny doubt about the non-existence of the same. :)

You are correct my dear brother if are going to be scientific u can't prove the Exsistence of God. But still there are certain incidents which are still far away from scientific theories or we can say the logics for those incidents yet to proved and found.
Ask them whose child was not been treated by any best medical threatment when all the medical sciences has given the negative answer and then some magic which we can call god had make that child healthy they can tell you about the exsistense of God.:)

sidchhikara

March 10th, 2009, 10:34 AM

I have the typical position: There is no proof for the existence of God. I wish we as humans did not come up with this concept of God .... lots of problems in the world are related to it. It does more harm than good.
Most Gods are more than 2000 years old before science, origins of universe, evolution.
In software speak, would you use Windows 95 on your computer?

Most scientists are agnostics. I would believe them over the word of panda or priest mullah etc.

vijay

March 10th, 2009, 11:08 AM

In software speak, would you use Windows 95 on your computer?

This example seems wrong here as Computer still works on the principle of thousands years old digits 0,1 and will work on this system forever. :p

DOS or Windows Vista and don't know what next , hardly matters :)

jitendershooda

March 10th, 2009, 11:19 AM

Dear Friends,

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Once I asked the same question to a south indian devotee person. He was IIT chenai pass out (just to clear that he was educated one).

He asked me: What is Science? Aaj jo proved hai wo science hai aur jo aaj proved hai wo kal tak science nahi thi? Is it so?
Then why dont we have some space to a thought that there might be things which are beyond science?

sachinb

March 10th, 2009, 11:25 AM

Exactly,,,,I am also saying the same thing,,,,,it is beyond the reach of Logics, questions, proofs,,,,,jahaan ye sab khatam ho jaatein hain vahaan se God ke existence ka pata chalna shuru ho jaata hai,,,,jaise mujhe pata hai,,,,,,I have an uncanny habit of thinking beyond LOGIC:rock:rock

Once I asked the same question to a south indian devotee person. He was IIT chenai pass out (just to clear that he was educated one).

He asked me: What is Science? Aaj jo proved hai wo science hai aur jo aaj proved hai wo kal tak science nahi thi? Is it so?
Then why dont we have some space to a thought that there might be things which are beyond science?

vijay

March 10th, 2009, 11:27 AM

He asked me: What is Science? Aaj jo proved hai wo science hai aur jo aaj proved hai wo kal tak science nahi thi? Is it so?
Then why dont we have some space to a thought that there might be things which are beyond science?

Nice example Jitu Bhai :)

The interesting point is that our Scientists never searched anything but they are only researching and analyzing everything which already exits in the Universe.

Yesterday's basic fundamentals of Physics are proved as wrong today and today's would be proved wrong tommorrow. Just as Einstien ridiculed the Newton. :)

jitendershooda

March 10th, 2009, 11:31 AM

I have an uncanny habit of thinking beyond LOGIC:rock:rock

:) Mein bhi sochun tha ek aaj Sachin kit gaya, kade ya performance aali baar 99% pe naa aajya ... but am happy now :)

sachinb

March 10th, 2009, 11:36 AM

Nahi bhai performance bar neeche nahi jaagi,,,because God is with me:rock,,,,,bas mera to beech beech mein ye Infraction kaam gad-bad kar jyaa se,,,,point kat jyaa se,,,,

vaise bhai on serious note,,,,all these things about God and supernatural things can be observed and felt once a person rise above Logic and shed off all the doubts, questions.,,,,,,,just surrender before God that is the only solution,,,,,otherwise its individual's choice,,,,but anyway that wont affect existence of God as I have personally experienced it:rock

Thats why I say "One Thing I Know and That is That, I know Nothing":rock

:) Mein bhi sochun tha ek aaj Sachin kit gaya, kade ya performance aali baar 99% pe naa aajya ... but am happy now :)

deepakchoudhry

March 10th, 2009, 01:04 PM

If god existence is dependent on our own perceptions and faith (or belief) then who is higher??? Us or god??

i.e. Mano toh sab kuch hai or na Mano toh kuch bhi nahin - does this really hold true.

deepakchoudhry

March 10th, 2009, 01:07 PM

Samarkadian

March 10th, 2009, 02:54 PM

Dear Friends,

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??:D

Warm regards,

Deepak

Deepak ji, Did I miss something like observation with imperfect human senses?

Question, wether God exist or not, is as old as human evolution. Had religion ( not spirituality) been so absurd(yes most of cult based is) it wont have been continuing for hundreds of centuaries.Every human beings at the end of the day needs something to bow down.Earlier in stone age it were natural dieties like of sun, moon, rain etc.With the growth of consiousnes, there came organised guidelines of living as it was not possible for human to survive alone and it shaped socities, communities, countries, continents and ofcourse Religion i.e Dharma.It is quite fashionable to criticise Religion for everything wrong.Religion, initially provided the mannual to live to gether but it came very late in human civilization compared to biological instincts and hence not ingrianed in genetics.Till today, our behaviour is governed on instincts which can't be , obviously, described as human. Since human being is the alone species in world who has tendency to think, make a decision.Or lets say consiousness.In some cases chimpanzes/apes posses this trait of decision but that is too vague.Personal experience, even if, someone have of something like super natural can't be validated as I can't experience the headache of yours.So when it comes to God, it comes to refining of senses which are too imperfect. Here if WE( Please exclude western philosophy here) want to KNOW( knowing is better than experiencing) first step indicated towards purification( as you mentioned in your recent post about being infant as you must have meant pure, but that too is vague in sense of understanding, as a children and animal live in 'states' no abstraction of thought.)Perhaps imperial ways are the place where all over-popular philosophers find their solace.Most of achievers of the materialistic world bow their heads in Indian Aasharms which is not bowing in front of self-proclaimed babas rather to the system which has a way to KNOW that question.

Why do believe? Because we are being raised up in a society or culture(all over world) which dwells on too much average ways of surviving and a little of reality so arises a need to unlearn but the process is too difficult.We do believe because our role models who are parents in first place tends to bow down in front of average beliefs instead of questioning the wrong.That is wrong.We do believe because if we wont believe there would be fear of being left alone which too is not easy.We do believe because there is fear of walking alone on difficult path of truth( or say pursuing truth) than walking in given herdish way of comfortable senses.We do believe because we are not forced ( situationaly, by choice or naturaly) to pursue upward path.

If given, God , is experienced.Its a wrong notion.God can be known.Experience is an emotion or feeling which can't sustain but yes if you KNOW, you can't be same as other all things would seem useless and then surrounding world( which is colored, full of rollercoaster) wouldn't validate us.
So let me clear here that this path is not for emotional stuff.Thaty in most of scripture( if you go through by chance) there is emphasis on being over happiness/sorrow or say Tatasth.

Perception again is by senses, so it overruled.When it comes to faith.Faith can be countered with the arrival of higher faith.Dont work.

Yes, one thing can surely help us which is to see Universal application of any faith, perception.If one religion, truth,beliefs, faiths are not having a tinch of universality then please believe that is crap. Universal here I mean like death. EVeryone would die despite of country,religion or name.

Indian mythology or better say Eastern philosophy deals with these question in most pragmatic and scientific way.SriMad Bhagvat Geeta is being read( as Upnishads are too difficult to ingrain for a person like me or of any average intellect) widely. Why? It serves some basic question in convincing way.It requires regular and repetitive reading with continously digging your querries.

Religion as such isnt bad , it is the selfish intermediates which uses it and ignorant crowd believes them.Probem is with masses not with religion or God.

Morever, people makes it such a public issue where the core of it is so personal as love making.Ironicaly but true.

Personaly I dnt follow any God but I have sacute inclination towards pursuing the ultimate truth of human life sooner or later.

arunshamli

March 10th, 2009, 05:08 PM

It is not just the God, there are other things as well, we just believe them because we are told to do so and we never question them.

In mathematics we use the term "infinite" all the time, can anyone tell what is infinite? Has anyone seen infinite objects of anything?

mittu

March 10th, 2009, 05:33 PM

Even though there is no direct physical evidence of God , one is better off having faith that God exists than sufferinf the potential consequences of being a non - believer : Pascal Wager !

True. Faith is twisted word ans specially in India. As someone pointed out its doing more bad then good these days. People feel more of fear then faith....bhagwaan ki yaad bhi bure temm mein he aave se :D

Anyways, people who are advocating for "no logics needed" and "its about how u want to see things". Our everyday life works on rational reasons and logics.....everything we need should be reasonable....then why this exception??

how many of us believe in aliens??? there is more possibility of life on other planets then in stones....what say?

vijay

March 10th, 2009, 05:51 PM

In mathematics we use the term "infinite" all the time, can anyone tell what is infinite? Has anyone seen infinite objects of anything?

The term Infinite in mathematics is used for an undefined/unknown number. If somehow we able calculate the value of infinite then that value becomes a finite value and the term infinite would remain the same i.e. a value which can not be defined or calculated. :)

vijay

March 10th, 2009, 05:55 PM

how many of us believe in aliens??? there is more possibility of life on other planets then in stones....what say?

This is quite interesting !

I read somewhere that somewhere in our Vedas Gods are described as Aliens. But it is very hard to understand and analyze the actual meaning of the verses written in Vedas.

People read them and conclude according to their own understanding. :)

rajeshchhikara

March 10th, 2009, 06:36 PM

There is no GOD in this universe!!!!

rajeshchhikara

March 10th, 2009, 06:38 PM

Infinity ka god gael sahi mael milaya kasaiya nae......hahhahhahahhahahhaha

anilsinghd

March 10th, 2009, 07:00 PM

Okey , I guess i have to prove it for you to internalise ! :)

Here goes the proof.....

Infact I do not need to Euler did it long time back ...

=============
There is a famous anecdote inspired by Euler's arguments with secular philosophers over religion, which is set during Euler's second stint at the St. Petersburg academy. The French philosopher Denis Diderot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denis_Diderot) was visiting Russia on Catherine the Great's invitation. However, the Empress was alarmed that the philosopher's arguments for atheism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism) were influencing members of her court, and so Euler was asked to confront the Frenchman. Diderot was later informed that a learned mathematician had produced a proof of the existence of God (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existence_of_God): he agreed to view the proof as it was presented in court. Euler appeared, advanced toward Diderot, and in a tone of perfect conviction announced, "Sir, (a + b^n )/ z = x , hence God exists—reply!". Diderot, to whom (says the story) all mathematics was gibberish, stood dumbstruck as peals of laughter erupted from the court. Embarrassed, he asked to leave Russia, a request that was graciously granted by the Empress. However amusing the anecdote may be, it is apocryphal, given that Diderot was a capable mathematician who had published mathematical treatises.

============================================

As easy as that ! :)

ritu

March 10th, 2009, 07:33 PM

yes,i do believe in gods existence......bcoz if we stop believing in him.there wont be any meaning of faith,forgiveness,prayer,love,blessing ,hope and list goes on.for me god is not a murti aur a particular religion.for me its a power with in me which differentiates right from wrong.
Dear Friends,

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??:D

Warm regards,

Deepak

ARVINDJANGU

March 10th, 2009, 10:25 PM

sunillathwal

March 11th, 2009, 03:31 PM

Infact I do not need to Euler did it long time back ...

As easy as that ! :)

Oh! suddenly i SAW god. (pun intended) :)

shekhar_nehra

March 11th, 2009, 10:52 PM

thatz quite logical nishant. If believing in smthing makes us feel relieved or give u sm kind of peace or strength then we shouls go for it. And I love this "GOD is watching" concept, it works well more almost everyone :).
What i think is itz like if a lie does sm good for smone then letz go for it.

God does not watch anyone... the concept is you can lie to everyone else but not to yourself. Its your conscience that you can not lie to. So the point is, to be true to your self, have integrity of character i.e tell truth to yourself and have high esteem. If you can put this in a child's mind in any other way that would be much appreciated, but till then leading by example and telling him that God is watching him which is nothing but a way to develop his own right/moral side seems fine.

sunitahooda

March 11th, 2009, 11:01 PM

WoW....golden words....felt as if someone is writing my mind n thoughts:)
God does not watch anyone... the concept is you can lie to everyone else but not to yourself. Its your conscience that you can not lie to. So the point is, to be true to your self, have integrity of character i.e tell truth to yourself and have high esteem. If you can put this in a child's mind in any other way that would be much appreciated, but till then leading by example and telling him that God is watching him which is nothing but a way to develop his own right/moral side seems fine.

shekhar_nehra

March 11th, 2009, 11:30 PM

If god existence is dependent on our own perceptions and faith (or belief) then who is higher??? Us or god??

i.e. Mano toh sab kuch hai or na Mano toh kuch bhi nahin - does this really hold true.

When I said Maano to sab kuch hai na mano to kuch nahi ... . I actually meant that if one is in denial mode he/she will deny anything and everything .. what you call scientific fact can be denied easily by him/her. If some one denies Earth is not round or does not revolve around Sun, how will you prove it to this insane guy ?

But there has to be a common agreeable platform for any discussion to happen.

To put it simply I believe in God because I am amused by the universe/nature and how it is functioning in symmetry most of the time. Some power that must have created it and is controlling it.

Also I am amazed by facts like things that really make one happy/ sad are universal, all over the world irrespective of language / region from times memorable and in all great civilizations.

What we call teachings of God are nothing but bare minimum set of rules / guidelines that should be followed so that every human being lives happily his/her life.

Have you really prayed for something you badly needed and have they been answered ? Obviously along with your effort.

Hence I would conclude you are big and God is within you by following rules and guidelines that make life easier for everyone. The things that you do not want to happen to yourself .. you would not do to others , because what gives you pain would cause pain to others as well , but if you are hell bent on living your life without caring for others and just struggling for survival then you are free to do same. Remember you have freedom of action and its you who decide how you act and what to believe in.

I do not see a disconnect here that its only God or individual.

Regards
Shekhar

P.S : You have still not come up with what do you understand by God and what do you have against his teachings as they are called by most of the people across religions.

shekhar_nehra

March 11th, 2009, 11:40 PM

I would like to request you all for a simple experiment. Pls try it and let me know.

Pretend to forget everything you were told or taught until now, as if you were infant again.

Then ask this question again...what is your first response??

My immediate response would be " What is God ? ". Obviously not an affirmative or negative answer to the question "Does God Exists??" ! And mind you its not an experiment ... we still do not have a time machine yet ... its hypothesis ... i.e assuming I am infant again. :D

ygulia

March 12th, 2009, 05:27 AM

Whether God exists or does not exist.............it does not matter.
Atleast majority of the people on this planet are scared of doing wrong things, which are unacceptable to society at large, due to this invisible(GOD) power. This belief helps society in many ways.

deepshi

March 12th, 2009, 08:17 AM

Koyi mera Osho wala taaga kholl do
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25109

bahut dino ma aayi huu band paya

sachinb

March 12th, 2009, 08:29 AM

GOD do exists and I have experienced the existence of God myself,,,,,,,

And if any body wants to see God first that person should be in position to see himself with clear vision,,,,,ham apne aap ko hi nahi dekh paate phir God ko kahaan se dekhenge:rock

deepika

March 12th, 2009, 08:35 AM

So nice and so well defined....those who don't believe in his(God)existence can then take their self-conscience into consideration everytime they do something.Your is your best freind as it keeps warning u when u step towards doing something wrong and nasty(Though I am a strong believer that God is one omnipresent power and is for real)

Whether God exists or does not exist.............it does not matter.
Atleast majority of the people on this planet are scared of doing wrong things, which are unacceptable to society at large, due to this invisible(GOD) power. This belief helps society in many ways.

Nishantrathi82

March 12th, 2009, 09:22 AM

rocky0036

March 12th, 2009, 09:25 AM

kya phle kisne god ko dheka hai

or kisne ab dheka ho

aap sab kuch chiz aassi mis kar rhe ho aap insaniyat ke liye bhut jaruri hai

jisse hamhare purvajo ne dheka hai

main baat kar rha hu sacchi,trust,insaniyat,acche kaamo ki

kyun katam kar rhe hai ham chizo ko

jo syd ab nhi hai is dunia main

jo phale thi
but bagwan to kisko pata hi nhi wo tha ya nhi
ager haan to sabko ek jasa kyun nhi banta

ager nhi hai to ye dunia kasie start houi

mittu

March 12th, 2009, 08:15 PM

As its more or less understood by many posts that there is nothing like divine supreme being, however a conscience exists in us(or should exist) to have fear for doing immoral activities.
There are too many versions of GOD to do GOOD. majority of terrorists are killing people on god's name, told you, faith is a twisted term. martyr for one community's faith can be terrorist for others...funny Muslim people convince illiterate ones that "jihad" will lead them to "heaven", same funny people in India twist the same story for some other reasons.....and on GOD's name and for seeking heaven we are making this place living hell....So, i guess its better we replace RELIGION with HUMANITY, GOD with CONSCIENCE and WORSHIP with HARD WORK.....:)

Oh...its Thursday gotta go...mandir jana hai :p

Nishantrathi82

March 13th, 2009, 10:01 AM

mittu

March 13th, 2009, 12:51 PM

What about Luck? I think we can replace God with Luck too.

PROBABILITY :p

vkaschaudhary

March 13th, 2009, 01:20 PM

We believe in Existing and and non existing creatures of God ...!

So we believe in God ...!!!

Hence..God Exist !!!

sunitahooda

March 13th, 2009, 06:37 PM

I believe in GOD:)

satyenderdeswal

March 13th, 2009, 06:51 PM

Mera vote te teri gail se sunita.......
I TOO BELIEVE IN GOD
I believe in GOD:)

anilsinghd

March 14th, 2009, 01:52 AM

Ok , here 's a something from my side , let's see what I can write ...
===================================

As somebody already said , this question is a very old one but since we all have mind and we think , it is bound to come again.
Now first thing first , why at all bother about God and/or its existence?

If one is so sure of its non-existence , then so be it , why be curious on it ?

In any case , trying too hard is dangerous , one must exceed but not overshoot!

कबीर एक ना जान्या , तो बहु जान्या क्या होए
एक तै सब होई है , सब से एक न होए !!

Now yeh "ek" kaun hai , for sure I have no clue , upto all you intelligent people!

Anyways , fine , but then why be so adamant about its non-existence. In my first post on this thread , i basically summarised my take , its like a free option I have with me which costs me nothing and which I can use as my protection at my convenience , is not it ?

Something to substantiate:
दुःख में सुमिरन सब करें , सुख में करे न कोए
जो सुख में सुमिरन करे , तो दुःख काहे होए ?

I have faith , i find a lot deal of satisfaction in pursuing (only a bit though ) of Pooja , rituals , but a great deal in Devotional songs, bhajans , amritwani and above all the dohas! ( easy guess for most of you , right ? )
And i watch myself , I at times fit in the category of the doha above , I also flow in events and behave differently , now I am confused as to whether I should not allow myself to deviate , Vijay asks me not to because as per him being equanimous is being curbing one's emotions and they are bound to come out in some form or other (Dahiya Sir supported the hypothesis , I kind of not disagree , Well I am confused! :confused:) .

Ok now , coming to the process of having faith in God , (also clear from the thread is the perfect case of some on one side of a concept and some on the other , pheww , life's tough , there are no clear concepts , are there any ? :( All are like 51-49 , no clear odds ! ) many here have said they dont believe in the rituals , processes etc , well who asked you to believe them in the first place. No body on the planet believes/follows everything he is told to , right ? Do we believe/follow our poor admins of the site! Never! In any case , how about this :
सुमिरन सूरत लगाये के , मुख से कछु न बोल
बाहर का पट बंद कर , अन्दर का पट खोल !

Clearly mentions that there is no need to do anything but the devotion to the almighty! :) We dont need all the "dikhaava" and all ! Right!

On where you can find god , hmm... tricky ... I do not know , if I would have , I would probably not be writing out here but on my way to the place! But as a couple of people have suggested , conscience of self , or may be this can help:

ज्यूँ तिल माही तेल है , ज्यूँ चकमक में आग
तेरा साईं तुझमे है , जाग सके तो जाग ....

Pheww , give it a try but dont kill me if you can't!

Next , very important , who can find it .....again person specific , right ?
Yeah , yeah , I have one more to help me out:

कामी , क्रोधी , लालची , इनसे भक्ति न होए
भक्ति करे कोई सूरमा , जाती वरन कुल खोये ..

Give it a try folks , see for yourslef whether you qualify even for the process of trying to find god. And yes , I am not being sarcastic becasue 1) I am not targetting anyone , the whole world is my audience
2) I myself is not good enough so I don't have any competitive advantage or to put it better , I myself is an audience of this post! :)

And yes how difficult is the process ( Yups , i actually could read some of your minds on this ;) )...
well there are no free lunches as they say and since this is such an interesting and "loved" by all(many to be precise!) thing/person/concept , bet it won't be that easy , The only clue I have is this:
हांसी खेलो हरी मिले , कौन सहे पर्षान
काम , क्रोध , तृष्णा तजे , ताहि मिलै भगवान !!

I seek all of your blessings and wish you guys luck on may be the voyage to "HIM". I promise to come back to you asap if I find "him" and expect the same!

Sincere Regards,
Anil

=====================

PS: I do not intend to offend/hurt anyone , I unconditionally apologise to anyone who percieves anything I said in a negative sense.
:)

poonamchaudhary

March 14th, 2009, 09:01 AM

Does God exist?? The existence of God is not something that can be scientifically proven or corroborated by some established facts. Its a subjective concept and so every person will have a different opinion and answer to this question. Its a matter of faith and belief.

Living in a Godless universe is a difficult thing. So if like Nietzsche we believe that there is no God (actually he said God is dead) then, I think, life becomes a bit more unbearable. So believing in some kind of higher power is not bad after all !

My faith is that there is some kind of transcendental presence throughout this universe which is a sort of governing principle. This power/energy is extant in everything and is essence of all. The objects, the subjects, the trees, the air, the water and so on, all of these are informed by that principle. It is something that cannot be known tangibly but is to be felt. If it has to be searched for then it is there right within. I dont believe in rituals and idol worship. For me this concept has at its centre a God that is formless and an unseen presence. Its an energy that pulsates the universe and everything that is part of it.

In the end I'll quote Walt Whitman whose faith I share...

" Bathe me O God in thee, mounting to thee,
I and my soul to range in range of thee."

sunillathwal

March 15th, 2009, 03:52 AM

okey, so far majority of the posts tend to suggest that:

1. though God's existence can not be proved yet ppl 'believe' in god's existence (and few even feel it) because by doing so give them a feeling of being watched over by some unseen supreme power.

2. God exists because all these biological systems, universe, etc works in a perfect manner and there must be something behind these seamless operations.

i have some doubts/queries: (let me confess here, i am a staunch believer of non-existence of God)!!

2: i have already asked same thing: who created god?? if god can be self-created, why can't be these systems?? why can't these system be self-sustained??
should i assume that u ppl are labeling the 'self-sustainability' of all such systems as God?? :)

1. Ok, if god is more of a 'conscience' type thing...
let me ask a simple question:

God exists only because one believe that it does??
OR
God really exists and that is why one has to believe in its existence??

From few posts in this thread, i understood (i hope i took it in their intended meaning):

God is a 'batch' of 'our conscience' put away and labeled as some fancy name 'God'; to watch over us/ forbid us to do anything wrong/ ultimately bowing to our own supremacy!!

This 'situation' reminds me something related to my 'late-latifi'. have this bad habit of reaching late.. always. mostly by five minutes or so!! :o
to avoid 'this', once i tried this old fashioned trick of resetting my watch, my mobile.. 10 minutes ahead of actual time. :D

But it didn't work. :(

whenever i have to reach somewhere; this thing will be in mind.. "oh, take ur sweet time sunil, there is enough time and already your watch is 10 minuted ahead of the actual time." Result: again late and this time 'later' than usual 'late'!!

Point is: Don't u have this thing somewhere in ur mind that God is actually our own 'little fantasy' and there is nothing that forbid us to do anything we want to do.
if it is so then how strong is ur belief about god and if it NOT so then how stupid/amnesic are u???

see, if some one is punctual he/she need not to reset his/her watch. Similarly why this God thingy to obnubilate ourself, why we need to keep ourself in delusion of actually being devoted to something ??

P.S.: To above things add the concepts of Md. prophet, jesus, few self proclaimed Gods (new age gurus, satya sai baba, etc), krishna and many more whom millions billions believe as actual physical form of GOD (and worshiping these gods will take these 'herds' to the heaven), my preception of God is reduced to nothing but a sordid business!! :)

sunillathwal

March 15th, 2009, 09:36 PM

I seek all of your blessings and wish you guys luck on may be the voyage to "HIM". I promise to come back to you asap if I find "him" and expect the same!

Anile, sure about God's gender?? :p :p

annch

March 15th, 2009, 10:23 PM

Deepak ji,
Existence of God: the unsolved mysteries of all times!!!
In a story by Khalil Gibran, God gets a chance to destroy Satan, but he spares Satan's life. And Satan says-" You will never destroy me, because you need me for your own survival".
So, I see the invisible suit of the emperor, because I believe in good, and it helps me in being good.:D
I will agree with Anil Dalal, that i do not want to take chances by not believing in "existence of God".
Regards.

Dear Friends,

I would like hear your thoughts on this subject, participation will be greatly appreciated.

Example: Say If I were to sell you a car, without showing it you or you test driving it, would you buy it?

If not then why when it comes to religion or spirituality, we become so naive??

Why do believe everything that is told to us??

Why do believe in such a concept, which cannot be expressed, cannot be felt, is beyond our senses or intellect??:)

Why We have fear or love of something which we have no personal experience of?

And finally what if we found out everything which was told to us about religion or god was all make believe or a big lie??:D

Warm regards,

Deepak

shekhar_nehra

March 16th, 2009, 12:51 AM

okey, so far majority of the posts tend to suggest that:

1. though God's existence can not be proved yet ppl 'believe' in god's existence (and few even feel it) because by doing so give them a feeling of being watched over by some unseen supreme power.

God's non-existence can also be not proved either. Because it's beyond your comprehension. As mentioned earlier God does not watch anyone literally !

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
2. God exists because all these biological systems, universe, etc works in a perfect manner and there must be something behind these seamless operations.

Obviously Yes ! This rhythm is an indication.

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
i have some doubts/queries: (let me confess here, i am a staunch believer of non-existence of God)!!

2: i have already asked same thing: who created god?? if god can be self-created, why can't be these systems?? why can't these system be self-sustained??
should i assume that u ppl are labeling the 'self-sustainability' of all such systems as God?? :)

May be you are right, self-sustainability may be considered as God what about creation ? ( was it really Big Bang ) How do you explain this self-sustainability ?

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
1. Ok, if god is more of a 'conscience' type thing...
let me ask a simple question:

God exists only because one believe that it does??
OR
God really exists and that is why one has to believe in its existence??

God exists even if you want to live in denial of this fact for ever ! He has given you freedom of action ( Karm ) Including you not believing in him :D .So all the religions when talk of teachings of God inspired you to do good deeds .. as long as you can differentiate between the Good and Bad and continue to do Good deeds .. it hardly matters you believe in God or not.

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
From few posts in this thread, i understood (i hope i took it in their intended meaning):

God is a 'batch' of 'our conscience' put away and labeled as some fancy name 'God'; to watch over us/ forbid us to do anything wrong/ ultimately bowing to our own supremacy!!

This 'situation' reminds me something related to my 'late-latifi'. have this bad habit of reaching late.. always. mostly by five minutes or so!! :o
to avoid 'this', once i tried this old fashioned trick of resetting my watch, my mobile.. 10 minutes ahead of actual time. :D

But it didn't work. :(

whenever i have to reach somewhere; this thing will be in mind.. "oh, take ur sweet time sunil, there is enough time and already your watch is 10 minuted ahead of the actual time." Result: again late and this time 'later' than usual 'late'!!

Your supremacy is nothing but freedom to do what you want to do. i.e Karm is azaadi

So you are trying to be over smart with yourself and realize that you can not fool yourself by setting your watch 10 mins ahead. You may fool others who might see your watch to rely on it to be exact time but not to you who knows the truth. Your effort has be on realizing you need to make an effort to be punctual rather than try a trick and be punctual automatically.

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
Point is: Don't u have this thing somewhere in ur mind that God is actually our own 'little fantasy' and there is nothing that forbid us to do anything we want to do.
if it is so then how strong is ur belief about god and if it NOT so then how stupid/amnesic are u???

see, if some one is punctual he/she need not to reset his/her watch. Similarly why this God thingy to obnubilate ourself, why we need to keep ourself in delusion of actually being devoted to something ??

P.S.: To above things add the concepts of Md. prophet, jesus, few self proclaimed Gods (new age gurus, satya sai baba, etc), krishna and many more whom millions billions believe as actual physical form of GOD (and worshiping these gods will take these 'herds' to the heaven), my preception of God is reduced to nothing but a sordid business!! :)

The Point is ... Soye hue ko uthaa sakkte hain par uthee hue ko neend se kaise uthaa sakte hain. No one is trying a trick like the one suggested by you to set time 10min ahead to be punctual , in respect of God. If I were to extend your vague example here ... then when every one has the same time ( may be all set 10 min advance ) so nothing goes in mind about the doubt over the correctness of time , there is peace of mind and focus is on to ensure you reach or do things on time. No one fears God but dedicate all of their righteous acts to him. The main point is to be righteous/compassionate/considerate etc... just like being punctual and nothing to with what time is set in watch.

Yes God is referred as masculine and its all together another issue why this world is still male dominated and we still have terms like Chairman; Man of the Match etc.

Yes you are right some people have made it a business to preach wrong doings in name of God and influence the karma of some of us.

sunillathwal

March 16th, 2009, 01:19 AM

May be you are right, self-sustainability may be considered as God what about creation ? ( was it really Big Bang ) How do you explain this self-sustainability ?

bhaai, we are again back to where we started!! how can one explain the self-sustainability of so called GOD??
and 'creation': what about GOD's creation?? why there is THE need to put the 'God' beyond all the logics?? (but u demand a logic behind everything else).

proving the non-existence of GOD: somehow i found this hilarious. :D :D

:)

annch

March 16th, 2009, 07:11 AM

sunillathwal

March 16th, 2009, 10:31 AM

I did not experience it, but had heard about Ganesh ji accepting the offering of milk, but only from his true devotees.
I regret missing the chance of a proof / spoof of existence of brahminical God!!
Did anyone from JL try it?
Regards

yes, i remember i was in 9th class then.
---
मैं आपनी दादी गेल्या गया था उस दिन मंदिर में... म्हारा सारा गाम कट्ठा हो रया था उस दिन शिवाले में. शिवजी के बराबर में एक गणेश भगवान की भी मूर्ति थी. लोग ब्खोरे, कटोरे भर भर लाय रे दूध की अर् चमचे गेल्या मंड रे गणेश ने दूध प्याण.
मेरा आर मेरी दादी का भी नंबर आया थोडी हाण में , चमच लाया गणेश की मूर्ति के मुह.. कड़े का दुग्धपान करा था गणेश !! मन्ने कही कुछ न पीता यु गणेश तो :o , एक पाच्छे खड़ी लुगाई नु बोली, "बेटा, प्या गणेश ने आपने आप ना खींचे गणेश दूध ने .. माडा सा तिरछा कर चमच ने ".. नु भी कर के देखा.. सारा दूध गणेश के मुह पे तै शुरू होके अर् पेट ने कती गिल्ल करके फर्श पे आके थमा.
मन्ने कही दूर फेर, मखा कुछ न पीता यु गणेश, नु करे धोरे खड़े लोग-बाग़ अक पीवे सै, सब का पीना सै ज्यां तै थोडा-थोडा पीवे सै सबका !!!
एक आदमी इसा नहीं जो नु ना कहता हो अक कोन्या पीता, सबके सब नु रट ला रए उक मेरा तो पी लिया था बहार ने लिकड़ के देखा तो, धार बंध रही दूध की साहरे आले जोहड़ तक.. :(

आँखा देखे पाच्छे भी लोग बावले हो ज्याँ सै लोग. :tamatar

नरा फालतू का ढोंग था, कुछ न चमत्कार था वो. Stupidity at its best :mad: !!!
:)

Nishantrathi82

March 16th, 2009, 10:59 AM

yes, i remember i was in 9th class then.
---
मैं आपनी दादी गेल्या गया था उस दिन मंदिर में... म्हारा सारा गाम कत्था हो रया था उस दिन शिवाले में. शिवजी के बराबर में एक गणेश भगवान की भी मूर्ति थी. लोग ब्खोरे, कटोरे भर भर लाय रे दूध की अर् चमचे गेल्या मंड रे गणेश ने दूध प्याण.
मेरा आर मेरी दादी का भी नंबर आया थोडी हाण में , चमच लाया गणेश की मूर्ति के मुह.. कड़े का दुग्धपान करा लगी गणेश !! मन्ने कही कुछ न पीता यु गणेश तो :o , एक पाच्छे खड़ी लुगाई नु बोली, "बेटा, प्या गणेश ने आपने आप ने खींचे गणेश दूध ने .. माडा सा तिरछा कर चमच ने ".. नु भी कर के देखा.. सारा दूध गणेश के मुह पे तै शुरू होके अर् पेट ने कती गिल्ल करके फर्श पे आके थमा.
मन्ने कही दूर फेर, मखा कुछ न पीता यु गणेश, नु करे धोरे खड़े लोग-बाग़ अक पीवे सै, सब का पीना सै ज्यां तै थोडा-थोडा पीवे सै सबका !!!
एक आदमी इसा नहीं जो नु ना कहता हो अक कोन्या पीता, सबके सब नु रट ला रए उक मेरा तो पी लिया था बहार ने लिकड़ के देखा तो, धार बंध रही दूध की साहरे आले जोहड़ तक.. :(

आँखा देखे पाच्छे भी लोग जान बावले हो ज्याँ सै लोग. :tamatar

नरा फालतू का ढोंग था, कुछ न चमत्कार था वो. Stupidity at its best :mad: !!!
:)

Hahahaha bhai sahe kaaha naahe piiya dodh mai bhi dekhne gaaya tha woh murti se hoo kaar naali me jaa raha tha aur mandir ke peeche naali dhooli ho gee thee.
Fool's Paradise :cool:

anilsinghd

March 16th, 2009, 04:00 PM

proving the non-existence of GOD: somehow i found this hilarious.

Well that is the crux , why do you find that hilarious!

Everyone starts a Phd with zeal to find out something that was not there or to prove some conjecture etc.

I find it perfectly fine to take the existence of God as a conjecture , and I am not betting on someone proving it or disproving it.

thats why i said , its a free option for me! :)

vijay

March 16th, 2009, 04:19 PM

bhaai, we are again back to where we started!! how can one explain the self-sustainability of so called GOD??
and 'creation': what about GOD's creation?? why there is THE need to put the 'God' beyond all the logics?? (but u demand a logic behind everything else).

proving the non-existence of GOD: somehow i found this hilarious. :D :D

:)

Well ... Non-believers are providing logics behind the non-existance of God while the believers just believe and showing faith in God's existance. This is the believers' thinking that God is beyond all the logics. If non-believers want to see the logic behind God's existance then first they have to prove non-existance of God by logics. Its all about faith and belief only for the believers. People who introduced the logics in this subject should prove their point by logics first.

As simple as that. :)

mhundpuriamann

March 16th, 2009, 04:32 PM

sabb apnee apnee gaa rahe hain to main bhee gaaoongaa ! :rock

when i was in 9th class i used to think why should i believe in god if it can't be proved , for this i used to speak lot of bad words(gaal in haryanvee) for "bhagwan" publicly. i used to think that one day god will get angry and he will show his existance to me.
whether god is there or not , for whom this is a problem , problem? yes problem , this is not a problem for all animals.this problem (jiggyasaa) is only for few people , this is also not a problem of god because it makes no difference for him whether we believe in him (or her) , so finally problem is ours, yes ours ! this is we who want to see the god.
our great forefathers (aryans) resolved this problem very logically thousands of years back, see take a little example we can't see sun through our naked eyes because we r not capable of that and we have to have some helping device in other words we need to raise our level from natural. in the same way we can't see or feel god's existence beacause our frequency is not matching with that, to raise our level our forefather (great forefathers ) developed a technique called "RAJYOGA" , this is set of some physical excercises , meditation practices,kundalini jagran etc these things are not just theoritical these works as medicines in allopathy, i have experience of that.
after doing all these things u starts seeing world from a higher level . then some day u will not need any "logic" to prove god. there is a master in this,"OSHO" if somebody really wanna do true meditation then he/she must listen speech of osho on "dhyan and samadhee".
"logic" in itself is a confusing word see "logics" changes as we grow everyday, this is actually very illogical thing to remain stick to this "logic" theory. :)

mittu

March 16th, 2009, 05:12 PM

Well ... Non-believers are providing logics behind the non-existance of God while the believers just believe and showing faith in God's existance. This is the believers' thinking that God is beyond all the logics. If non-believers want to see the logic behind God's existance then first they have to prove non-existance of God by logics. Its all about faith and belief only for the believers. People who introduced the logics in this subject should prove their point by logics first.

As simple as that. :)

As an atheist, I do not have a specific belief, but a lack of belief. I have nothing to "prove", it is up to theists to prove that their particular omnipotent father-figure exists..
one more thing, people who have this belief pls define GOD.

vijay

March 16th, 2009, 05:33 PM

As an atheist, I do not have a specific belief, but a lack of belief. I have nothing to "prove", it is up to theists to prove that their particular omnipotent father-figure exists..
one more thing, people who have this belief pls define GOD.

Some scholars are trying to 'prove' the non-existance of God.
Why you NEED a definition for 'something' which doesn't exists according to you ?
Let it be like this only for your 'lack of belief'. :)

mittu

March 16th, 2009, 07:06 PM

Some scholars are trying to 'prove' the non-existance of God.
Why you NEED a definition for 'something' which doesn't exists according to you ?
Let it be like this only for your 'lack of belief'. :)
Just want to know, whats this fuzz is all about?? :p
If people who believe in "something", are not able to prove it! at least define it...not for me...but God's sake!! :p
On serious note, if theists can tell us some characteristics and properties of god, it will be lot easier to prove that it does not exist. fair enough?

asho

March 18th, 2009, 11:40 AM

can you define your quintessence ?

asho

March 18th, 2009, 01:34 PM

prior to make a comment on God one should know about himself first. Is human being nothing more than intellect and senses ? senses as well as intellect have limits. Earthworm has sense of touch only (no eyes no ear no tongue and nose ) Earthworm knows what his skin tells him.ant have skin and eyes, so his world is limited to the feeling of touch and sight. Fly,slightly more developed have tongue too so it can taste also.Snake have four senses touch (skin),eyes,nose,tongue only so it can feel,see,smell,and taste the world.it cannot hear. Likewise the world of the above four type of creature is limited to their senses.We have five senses.Other creatures are confined to their senses. So do we.Same is the story of intellect.what we can not see Einstein or Bertrand Russel could perceive.It is not true that things which we do not see, feel ,perceive or understand does not exist.God is not confined to our senses or intellect.This is our limit.Things exist and happen beyond our senses and intellectual limits.Your name is Deepak.Once Lord Gautam Budhha uttered Appo deepo bhav (be your own light) Do not ask. Know yourself.

deepakchoudhry

March 19th, 2009, 12:18 AM

why does one want to know the existence of God?

Navin Bhai,

Humans ask questions, its in our nature. Human Knowledge has been acquired by asking questioning only but there are some existential questions, which have always baffled and bothered us.

But on the other hand, do we need any knowledge....no not really.

Animals live in perfect harmony and yet they do not sit around and do any discussions.:)

Deepak

SANDEEP5

March 21st, 2009, 01:24 PM

yes, i remember i was in 9th class then.
---
मैं आपनी दादी गेल्या गया था उस दिन मंदिर में... म्हारा सारा गाम कट्ठा हो रया था उस दिन शिवाले में. शिवजी के बराबर में एक गणेश भगवान की भी मूर्ति थी. लोग ब्खोरे, कटोरे भर भर लाय रे दूध की अर् चमचे गेल्या मंड रे गणेश ने दूध प्याण.
मेरा आर मेरी दादी का भी नंबर आया थोडी हाण में , चमच लाया गणेश की मूर्ति के मुह.. कड़े का दुग्धपान करा था गणेश !! मन्ने कही कुछ न पीता यु गणेश तो :o , एक पाच्छे खड़ी लुगाई नु बोली, "बेटा, प्या गणेश ने आपने आप ना खींचे गणेश दूध ने .. माडा सा तिरछा कर चमच ने ".. नु भी कर के देखा.. सारा दूध गणेश के मुह पे तै शुरू होके अर् पेट ने कती गिल्ल करके फर्श पे आके थमा.
मन्ने कही दूर फेर, मखा कुछ न पीता यु गणेश, नु करे धोरे खड़े लोग-बाग़ अक पीवे सै, सब का पीना सै ज्यां तै थोडा-थोडा पीवे सै सबका !!!
एक आदमी इसा नहीं जो नु ना कहता हो अक कोन्या पीता, सबके सब नु रट ला रए उक मेरा तो पी लिया था बहार ने लिकड़ के देखा तो, धार बंध रही दूध की साहरे आले जोहड़ तक.. :(

आँखा देखे पाच्छे भी लोग बावले हो ज्याँ सै लोग. :tamatar

नरा फालतू का ढोंग था, कुछ न चमत्कार था वो. Stupidity at its best :mad: !!!
:)

Sahi kah hai sunil bhai, ek gilasi me main bhi doodh le ke gaya tha par 2 ghante line me lagya raha er mera number nahi aaya. main jib bina doodh pilaaye ghar vaapis jane laga to bahar naali me ku sara doodh bah raha tha. Main to use dekh ke apan laya hooa doodh apne aap hi pi liya. khamakhwah naali me bahaye se kya faayada...... :D

siwach2767

April 4th, 2009, 11:33 AM

hi guys i have read many post regarding the topic. and i would like to say that yes god does exist. but we ppl don't know the real form of it. it is a supreme soul who is free from all bondages. he is incorporeal . he is above birth and death. every soul who took birth and do karma is not a god. be it a krishna, ram, hanuman, shankar and all.

Fateh

April 5th, 2009, 05:25 PM

Dear Friends, this question cannot be answered in yes or no, either answere cannot be supported by proof & no body can show GOD TO ANOTHER PERSON, Even if someone has seen/felt the presence of the power/god, he also cannot show another person, yes some guidelines are available, if sincerely tried one may get some answere to this question. Some of The guidelines are:- 1. should have desire to know the God/the superpower.
2. should have positive mind & thinking.
3. should have ful faith & confidence in self.
4. The musk deer enchanted by fragrance of musk, & not knowing its source, kept on running hither & thither looking for it. It was only when musk deer was dying than he realised that the good smell was coming from his own body. Similarly, please donot waste your time & energy to find the God every where, Friends it is with you, inside you & really you are part of the super power, look inside, you can see the real path & the God itself, for which one has to do following :-
1Try to understand the voice of the soul & control the Mind
2. Think & act as per direction of the soul
3. Detech/ Leave KAMA, KRODH, AHENKAR, MUDH, MOH, MAYA,LOBH
4. Control desire.
5. Love yourself, everyone & every thing including the nature.
6. Be true & honest to yourself.
7. Leave eggo, fear, enemity,jeaousy & revenge
8. Live in present.
9. Enjoy your efforts & be satisfied.
10. Be always happy & donnot ditrub happiness of others.
In the end I must tell you that our parents are real gods/devetas, lookafter them, love them, respect them, help them & keep them always happy, you will get the answere yourself. Regards