Reservation for Jats: Your views

[nimeshkhatri]

Hello Everyone,

Jats are considered under OBC category in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh. Time and again, I have come across news of some sections of jats in haryana demanding OBC status.

I want to know the views of jatland users on this issue...
1. Do you support the demand?
2. Your reasons?
3. What do you think would be the affect of reservation if granted?

So pour in intellectuals...

[Fateh]

I strongly believe that reservation for jats is need of the hour & totally justified.
1) Yes I support.
2) Please read my views in many post available on the forum.
3)The effect will be positive economically, socially & politically

But unfortunately it will not happen due to disunity among our community & selfishness/false ego/ignorence/lack of will power of our so called leaders.

[rinkusheoran]

If you are really interested in views then you should go through earlier post on the same topic ,but still let me give u few url where u can read about the views of JLanders on reservation , iske alawa bhi aapko bahut mil jayenegy. Happy reading

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?29238-Aarakshan-ko-dilli-gherenge-Jat&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?30069-Reservation-versus-Commonwealth-Games&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?24568-Do-we-Jat-really-need-Reservation&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?24956-Is-Jat-s-Demand-for-Reservation-as-OBC-in-Haryana-justified&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?22273-Akhil-Bhartiya-Jat-Mahasabha-Kharad-Muzaffarnagar-24-Nov-07&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?26214-Jats-Against-Reservations&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?14556-Views-of-jatlanders-on-reservation&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?25467-Jat-mahapanchayat-demands-reservation&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?18280-Reservation-How-Relevant&highlight=reservation
http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?19691-phir-reservation................&highlight=reservation

[amitdabas22]

I personally do not feel comfortable with the demand of Jats to be included in the OBC or any other classified category. It will be horrible to see that category mentioned on my voter card or UID. I think we will be degrading ourselves with such demands and lose our face in the society.

But it seems that making a propaganda of such demands is an easy way to capture some attention in the political world. And also is an easy way to government jobs and institutions. That is why every other caste seems to be hell bent to be in this status.

So actually there are two facets of this thing:
1. Lets get it ! Why should we lose the opportunity to be in good positions/institutions easily ?
2. I would not like to be counted one amongst the other categories who have enjoyed this special privilege and be looked down upon at my workplace.

So it is actually the self-esteem that would prevent me from supporting the cause, otherwise seeing the benefits of it practically, i would ofcourse go for it. My reasoning would be simple here-When all the others are getting the benefits of it, why shouldn't i? But deep down my mind i would strongly detest it.

[narendersingh]

Reservation is of no use.

Think the positive ways we can conquer the fields.
Get proper education in allied field.
Apney dum per khech do jeewan kee gaadi.

Himmat kaa naam himmayati

[dahiyavijay7]

Jat groups are striding for reservation under OBC category in haryana. All the other castes are annoyed at this demand and are leaving no effort in protesting against their demand. Though I personally believe that caste based reservation is not an effective measure to solve the problems of community. We can see the example of SC/ST castes who are enjoying the reservation since independence. However, the survey results show that even today more than 70% SC/ST people have education below 10th standard. Could they ever imagine to become IAS on the reserved seat? Never!
The rich & mighty among any caste only reap the real advantage of reservation and the real laggard people on whose name reservation was sought, remain the same poor, illiterate and backward.
No doubt that majority of jats live in rural areas, most of them confined to agrarian and animal husbandry work and are utterly backward in all walks of life. But, in a state like haryana, where population of Jats is higher, there is strong possibility that only advanced people among them shall be benefited by Reservation. While the rural Jat shall remain the same, illiterate & backward.
The real change in the status of Jats could be achieved, if the educational, health care facilities are made available in the rural areas at par with urban areas. Further, there is need for change of attitude and healthy competition.
All kind of caste based reservation should be scrapped. However, untill, the reservation to other castes is not scrapped, the demand of Jat groups for reservation is quite justified on the similar ground of other castes taking benefit of reservation.
However, there is also need to give an answer to the castes like Brahmin which are opposing the demand of reservation by the Jats. The Brahmin caste has always remained a previlieged caste in our society. Even, during colonial times, the Brahmins were the first to change their colour and flatter the Britishers. That was the reason that most of the big posts were occupied by the Brahmins in the British times.
After Independence, when Nehru (Brahmin) became Prime Minister, he installed Brahmins at all the important posts. His biased policy and unchallenged rule upto his death resulted in a large gap between Brahmins and other castes.
The Brahmins, Baniyas and other caste which are opposing the reservation for Jats argue that Jats have large agricultural lands and they are rich and influential, why do they ask for jobs. They further argue that if they ask for reservation, they must relinquish the land holding.
In Haryana, Brahmins also have large agricultural lands and there would be hardly any Brahmin who or any of his relative is not a Gazetted officer. Further, Baniyas have family businesses. Why they do not relinquish their family business before asking for jobs?

[Arvindc]

With more and more jobs moving to private sector (where English is a must), it is becoming more and more difficult for a kisan's child to get a job as the enablers required for competing in this technological world, with changing culture, have been missing from a rural environment. With allmost all focus going to cities, rural folks are left under-privileged to compete in this biased environment.

Reservation, being based on casts, should be given to all those requesting it. Though it did brought some positive results in certain aspects, it failed to meet it's basic purpose and has became a catalyst to a castiest mind and a tool for politicians to divide communities. The only way to remove (or abolish) it now is to give it to every one. Side by side, a support system should be built for under-privileged sections.

[Saharan1628]

As far as my views are concerned,there should be no reservation of any kind except based on financial status..Its the incapability of the govt. itself not being able to take any progressive measures on the so-called backward classes..Reservation is not a progressive measure and the manner in which its being implemented and used is awful..and not to forget the term vote bank politics...

[nimeshkhatri]

I agree with what vijay has expressed above.

First of all, reservation if given would help jats climb the ladder quickly but what it means is:

The business which gets such employees based on reservation instead of qualification would suffer qualitatively. A person who has excelled in life due to his caste and not abilities is bound to hamper the progress of the work he is engaged into. lack of education resulting in further in-competitiveness and corruption in work.
In a way, I think getting a job based on caste would only mean harm in the long term for wider interests of the community.
Rather, what our demand should be is to provide better education, healthcare facilities and employment opportunities that can actually contribute to upliftment of any community.
However, an awareness about education and its benefits among the masses are very important.
Take the examples of SC/STs in education systems, they have reservations in IITs, IIMs but according to data from an IIM more than half of their seats go unoccupied every year and those who do join are hardly able to sustain the pressure of the system and take many more years to complete the education because they did not have proper education before going to such an institute and do not qualify to be part of such a premier institute.

As far as the question of giving reservation to everybody is concerned that is no solution as it nullifies all reservations, you'll see people ask reservations under reservations merely making a cycle of it.

And Saharan1628 above has summarised it quite well by "Reservation is not a progressive measure and the manner in which its being implemented and used is awful..and not to forget the term vote bank politics...".
Completely agree with that.

[deepika]

I have always been against Reservation....theres no community in which you won't find people who are not financially strong....So if Jats feel they are entitled to any reservations so are Rajputs,Baniyas,Pandits and so on.....We cant make the whole nation suffer just for the betterment of our community....rather than begging for reservation we should motivate the Jat Youth to study harder and to make their dreams come true....I have already expressed m views on this issue in some threads earlier.

[Arvindc]

Reading most of the posts above, we can see that there is a wide acceptance on Jatland that reservation should be, if at all, based on economic status and not cast. Others have reasoned that reservation of any kind would undermine the competitiveness and hence our (India's) growth, so should be abolished in totality.

Yes, agreed, this is a very good and progressive thinking. However, all these are very idealist things far from existing situation. There being far from reality and non-practicableness brings some questions.

Are we doing anything to achieve these goals?
Are we taking even a minute step at ground level towards this goal?
And the more important one, can we at present, practically do even a little, if at all, to achieve these?

My honest answer to all these would be a clear "No". So reservation, based on cast, would stay, at least for near foreseeable future.

Now coming to the questions raised here on the core issue.

Is the Jat's demand of reservation legitimate?
Do Jat's need support for upliftment and thus growth?

Well, first one is easy, it is quite legitimate. When other communities demand were met, why shouldn't our's. Reservation has neither been abolished nor it's cast base been altered.

The second one is again quite logical, Jat being basically a farming community is finding more and more difficult to compete in the job market, both because of shrinking job opportunities and more and more lagging behind in resources to compete. Let me explain this.

Conceive an image of a farmer and then look at his/her daily life, daily chores and how he/she makes a living. Put yourself in that environment and then compare it with your environment. Don't you find him/her not only lack in the financial and infrastructural resources but also the time and health (peace of mind and a balanced diet) resources to compete? Being short of money, a farmer is forced to live on other resources. A farmer has to keep a domestic animal to feed the family - in turn it takes time and effort to keep and feed that animal. The farming itself is tiring and time taking that it becomes natural for a farmer to take help from children.

Contrast this with a city family, where people actually go to the extent of quieting their jobs for nurturing their kids. Parents doing everything they can to get them admitted to best schools. Mothers awaking whole night so that kid's can study comfortably. How far do you see a farmer's family from all this? So they do need support, be it facilities or privileges(reservation)?

Since farming being a backbone (without which cities can not exist) of this country, it makes good sense to give privileges to them for their upliftment. Without uplifting/strengthening this backbone, the country would not be able to sustain growth.

The other point is that, Jat being historically being mainly farmers/fighters have beliefs and values which makes them leaders, doers, fighters but servants (job seekers). It is his this 'him', 'self', 'ego' that makes him speak, stand up against his colleges/bosses in the instance of a perceived injustice while others may keep quite. Isn't his this standing up for values making him tense and blocking his progress? Other communities like Baniyas and Pandits have certain beliefs and values which make them more suitable (on psychological front) for jobs and shops.

With farmland becoming lesser and lesser, a Jat youth is finding more and more difficult to keep pace with the growth.


Now the last one, which Amit Dabas has brought up so honestly. - Thank you Amit!!
Reservation by it's current definition is given to communities having lower social status. Wouldn't putting Jat's under the category of reservation undermine their historically high wealthy social status? Well, yes it would, but do we really have that high wealth at ground level? Isn't this high wealth social status just only our perception? Jaat aaj baaj to raha hai par kya woh under se thotha nahin hota ja raha?

So is my self-esteem more important then the upliftment of my bother's and sisters? Having got a job my self, aren't I am being selfish here?

If I am not doing anything to provide any support (in terms of money/facilities) to my under-privileged community, what right do I have to oppose and hinder their efforts to get support via reservation?

[vijay]

There should be NO RESERVATION, irrespectively.

[Fateh]

There should be NO RESERVATION, irrespectively.

Reservation of any kind & in any thing, is not correct, is demotivating, is against natural justice and without any justified logic, it is a serious desease in the society.THE DESEASE MUST BE CURED, WAYS ARE TWO-either all raise banner against or all demand reservation. To me second option seems to be more practical & possible, hence reservation demand for jats is totally justified, we have to be practical, we cannot live in isolation & let us not waste time in justifying our individual views, let us do something worth on ground,on either side.

[singhvp]

घणी लम्बी चौड़ी तक़रीर मै के धरया सै भाई दो ए बात सें, या तो इस बन्दर बाट का हिस्सा सब नै मिलै या फेर किसी नै नहीं i
हालांकि सिधान्त रूप मै जात के आधार पर आरक्षण गलत है परन्तु जहाँ सिधान्त पर चलने वाला कोई है ही नहीं तो फेर ये खील पताशे बंटवान मैं कोई हर्ज़ भी नहीं .
इसलिए जाट समुदाय की यह मांग गैर वाजिब नहीं है क्योंकि देहात मै अधिकांश जाट कृषि पर निर्भर हैं और जमीन अब रही नहीं और कोई साधन है नहीं जीवन यापन का
जहाँ तक बात दूसरी जातियों की है तो उनको भी चाहिए की वो भी आरक्षण की मांग करें
अब मायावती को और मीरा कुमार के बच्चों को आरक्षण की जरूरत है तो फिर शायद सभी जातियों को हैं i ( हालाँकि मायावती इसका फायदा शायद नहीं उठा पायेगी यह अलग बात हैं)

[vikasJAT]

घणी लम्बी चौड़ी तक़रीर मै के धरया सै भाई दो ए बात सें, या तो इस बन्दर बाट का हिस्सा सब नै मिलै या फेर किसी नै नहीं i
हालांकि सिधान्त रूप मै जात के आधार पर आरक्षण गलत है परन्तु जहाँ सिधान्त पर चलने वाला कोई है ही नहीं तो फेर ये खील पताशे बंटवान मैं कोई हर्ज़ भी नहीं .
इसलिए जाट समुदाय की यह मांग गैर वाजिब नहीं है क्योंकि देहात मै अधिकांश जाट कृषि पर निर्भर हैं और जमीन अब रही नहीं और कोई साधन है नहीं जीवन यापन का
जहाँ तक बात दूसरी जातियों की है तो उनको भी चाहिए की वो भी आरक्षण की मांग करें
अब मायावती को और मीरा कुमार के बच्चों को आरक्षण की जरूरत है तो फिर शायद सभी जातियों को हैं i ( हालाँकि मायावती इसका फायदा शायद नहीं उठा पायेगी यह अलग बात हैं)

VP ji baat aapne 100% sahi kahi.
kisaan puri tarah se kheti pe depend hai, aur aajkal zamin kisi ki pass itni rahi ni kyuki kitte by pass niakl diye to kitte government ne nu e acpuire kar li.
aaj k time me jaato me bhi aisi family hain jo garibi rekha se niche hain, unko bhi reservation ki jarurat hai.
isliye ya to reservation hona e ni chahiye aur agar fir bhi hota hai to sabhi zaruratmando ko reservation milna chahiye chahe vo kisi bhi caste ka ho......
Reservation dene ka main maksad hai pichde logo ko sabke barabar le kar aana, isliye chahe jaat ho, chamar ho, chuda ho ya koi aur , jiske pass kamayi ka koi sadhan ni hai, jeene k liye govt. ki help chahiye (in the form of reservation) un sab ko reservation milna chahiye...........

[vikasJAT]

घणी लम्बी चौड़ी तक़रीर मै के धरया सै भाई दो ए बात सें, या तो इस बन्दर बाट का हिस्सा सब नै मिलै या फेर किसी नै नहीं i
हालांकि सिधान्त रूप मै जात के आधार पर आरक्षण गलत है परन्तु जहाँ सिधान्त पर चलने वाला कोई है ही नहीं तो फेर ये खील पताशे बंटवान मैं कोई हर्ज़ भी नहीं .
इसलिए जाट समुदाय की यह मांग गैर वाजिब नहीं है क्योंकि देहात मै अधिकांश जाट कृषि पर निर्भर हैं और जमीन अब रही नहीं और कोई साधन है नहीं जीवन यापन का
जहाँ तक बात दूसरी जातियों की है तो उनको भी चाहिए की वो भी आरक्षण की मांग करें
अब मायावती को और मीरा कुमार के बच्चों को आरक्षण की जरूरत है तो फिर शायद सभी जातियों को हैं i ( हालाँकि मायावती इसका फायदा शायद नहीं उठा पायेगी यह अलग बात हैं)


घणी लम्बी चौड़ी तक़रीर मै के धरया सै भाई दो ए बात सें, या तो इस बन्दर बाट का हिस्सा सब नै मिलै या फेर किसी नै नहीं i
हालांकि सिधान्त रूप मै जात के आधार पर आरक्षण गलत है परन्तु जहाँ सिधान्त पर चलने वाला कोई है ही नहीं तो फेर ये खील पताशे बंटवान मैं कोई हर्ज़ भी नहीं .
इसलिए जाट समुदाय की यह मांग गैर वाजिब नहीं है क्योंकि देहात मै अधिकांश जाट कृषि पर निर्भर हैं और जमीन अब रही नहीं और कोई साधन है नहीं जीवन यापन का
जहाँ तक बात दूसरी जातियों की है तो उनको भी चाहिए की वो भी आरक्षण की मांग करें
अब मायावती को और मीरा कुमार के बच्चों को आरक्षण की जरूरत है तो फिर शायद सभी जातियों को हैं i ( हालाँकि मायावती इसका फायदा शायद नहीं उठा पायेगी यह अलग बात हैं)

VP ji ab aur kon si caste rehti hai jise reservation ki mang karni chahiye????????????
dhanak, chamar, chude, khatti, naayi, bhaman etc etc aur rahi kahi YADAV ne bhi mil gya...... in sab ko to reservation mil liya sirf JAAT he rehte hain.
aur aaj k time me dekhe to in reservation walo ne puri society kharab kar rakhi hai, MBBS me aise aise namune reservation se admission lete hain jo aage ja k kisi k pait me kanchi chodte hai ti kisi k me razer, is doctoro ka k sir me mara.............
Government jobs ya higher studies me GEN category k 80% marks wale reh jate hain aur ye reservation wale 60% le k job le ja hain. ye percentage wali baat khud mere sath hui hai jab maine MCA me admission liya tha..............

Ye baat sahi hai ki reservation is had tak ho ki fees kam kar do, ya admission form free kar do, lekin ye galat hai ki job ya admission me bhi reservation ho.
dimag sab ka ek jisa hai isliye isme to is reservation k poison ko nahi gholna chahiye.........

P.S: bhai kuch galat kahi ho sahi aap sab bata dena, maine jo dekha aur personally jo face kiya (specially marks) vo likh diya.