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RavinderSura
July 23rd, 2012, 01:06 PM
जाट कौम ........सावधान !!
-पूर्व कमांडेंट हवा सिंह सांगवान


http://www.jatland.com/home/Asli_Lutere_Koun/Part-II#18._.E0.A4.9C.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.9F_.E0.A4.95.E0.A5 .8C.E0.A4.AE...........E0.A4.B8.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.B5. E0.A4.A7.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.A8.21

इस लेख में मैं प्रत्यक्ष व परोक्ष रूप से ऐसा कुछ कहना चाहुंगा। मैं भी आपकी तरह एक साधारण जाट हूँ, मैं कोई इतिहासकार व साहित्यकार नहीं हूँ। लेकिन मैंने अपनी जाति के लिए इतिहास पर कुछ चिंतन किया है, इसलिए मैं अपने चिंतन को असाधारण मानता हूँ और इसी बल पर अपनी बात को डंके की चोट पर सिद्ध करने का दावा करता हूँ। मेरी बात को मेरे कितने जाट भाई समझ पायेंगे यह मैं नहीं कह सकता, लेकिन कोई एक भी समझ गया तो मैं स्वयं को सफल समझूंगा। इस बारे में मैं कुछ उदाहरण पेश कर रहा हूँ -
मेरे एक जाट मित्र अधिकारी के पुत्र ने ब्राह्मण जाति में शादी की थी। वह अपने पौत्र को एक दिन अपने साथ लाया और मुझे कहने लगा कि यह बच्चा बहुत ही होशियार है। मैंने पूछा “हम किस वर्ण में आते हैं तथा हमारा धर्म क्या है और हम अपने धर्म के बारे में कितना जानते हैं” उन्होंने उत्तर दिया “जाट क्षत्रिय हैं और मैं पक्का हिन्दू हूँ तथा प्रातः रोजाना गीता का पाठ करता हूँ।”, तो मैंने कहा - फिर तो आपका पौत्र सूत जाति का हुआ क्योंकि हिन्दू धर्म की मनुस्मृति में जातियों के अनुलामे व प्रतिलामे के अध्याय में स्पष्ट लिखा है कि “क्षत्रिय से ब्राह्मण कन्या में उत्पन्न जाति (वर्ण) सूत कहलाती है” इस पर मित्र मुझे घूरकर देखने लगा तो मैंने कहा “इसमें चिन्ता की कोई बात नहीं, आपका पौत्र तो अवश्य होशियार होगा क्योंकि यह हाईब्रीड है (शंकर वर्ण) जैसे हाईब्रीड बाजरा व गेहूँ एक एकड़ में 40 मन से 80 मन तक हो जाता है, लेकिन याद रहे इनमें देशी बाजरे व गेहूँ की तरह कभी मिठास व लोच नहीं होगा। बस यही भारी अन्तर है। पाठक कृपया इसका अर्थ स्वयं निकाले।

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 02:13 PM
Though Mr. Sangwan has his head and heart at the right place and is working for what he believes is a better future for Jats, he does take certain liberties while providing supporting examples for his opinions.

Parsis are not dwindling because of any genetic defects but because of migration and increased incidence of infertility. Secondly while it is apparent he is talking about Indira and Feroz Gandhi's affair, it would be unfounded to label their marriage as just plain lust devoid of love. One cant make such judgements about people we have never met and know nothing of their private lives.

ygulia
July 23rd, 2012, 03:08 PM
Remarks on personal life of ex-prime minister are disgusting. Article is written with a biased attitude and it is just twisting of facts. Such type of articles spoils the image of the community.

sanjeev1984
July 23rd, 2012, 03:36 PM
:) someone, wrote somewhere...

"hum har jagah pe to nahi ja sakte or sab log se nahi mil sakte... to fir kya hum sirf padh ke kisi ke bare mai raye nahi bana sakte???" anyway... mai is baat pe to agree karta hu ki bina sacchai ka pata kiye humein comment nahi karna chahiye...

but personal and private life ke bare mai mere views differ hain... mere hisaab se personnal life hum jaise common logo ki hoti hai... leaders or celebrities ya koi bhi insaan jisko log apna role model bana sakte hain... unki koi personal life nahi hoti.. it is like "sharaab pine ka shauk bilkul personnal choice hai" but fir bhi government filmstars or players ko alcholic drinks/smoking ka public display pe ristriction lagati hai...

to mere kehne ka taatpariye ye hai ki...
pehle to har us insaan ka character saaf hona jarori hai jisko log follow kar sakte hain, or ye jimmedari usi insaan ki banti hai, ki vo khud kisi bhi tarike ke galat kaam se door ruhe...
doosra, agar us insaan ka kabu uske man pe nahi hai or vo khud ko kuch galat karne se nahi rook sakta... to ye uski hi jimmedari hai ki vo apni, so called "personal life" ki galat harkato ko chupa ke rukhe...
teesri, kisi bhi insaan pe agar kuch ilzaam lagte hain to ye us insaan ki ki jimmedari hai to ya to vo un sab ilzaamo ka saamna kare.... ya to accept kare ya reject kare... or public ko prove kare ki ye sab galat batein failai ja ruhi hain unke khilaaf... or agar kisi halat mai vo insaan jivit na to to unka case uske followers ya decendents bhi represent kar sakte hain...
chautha, agar ye sabit ho jata hai ki kisi insaan ka character leader ban-ne ke layak hi nahi hai to... ye logo ki responsibility banti hai ki vo un logo ko aandhe ho kar poojna bandh kar de...



Though Mr. Sangwan has his head and right at the right place and is working for what he believes is a better future for Jats, he does take certain liberties while providing supporting examples for his opinions.

Parsis are not dwindling because of any genetic defects but because of migration and increased incidence of infertility. Secondly while it is apparent he is talking about Indira and Feroz Gandhi's affair, it would be unfounded to label their marriage as just plain lust devoid of love. One cant make such judgements about people we have never met and know nothing of their private lives.

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 03:50 PM
:) someone, wrote somewhere...

"hum har jagah pe to nahi ja sakte or sab log se nahi mil sakte... to fir kya hum sirf padh ke kisi ke bare mai raye nahi bana sakte???" anyway... mai is baat pe to agree karta hu ki bina sacchai ka pata kiye humein comment nahi karna chahiye...

but personal and private life ke bare mai mere views differ hain... mere hisaab se personnal life hum jaise common logo ki hoti hai... leaders or celebrities ya koi bhi insaan jisko log apna role model bana sakte hain... unki koi personal life nahi hoti.. it is like "sharaab pine ka shauk bilkul personnal choice hai" but fir bhi government filmstars or players ko alcholic drinks/smoking ka public display pe ristriction lagati hai...

to mere kehne ka taatpariye ye hai ki...
pehle to har us insaan ka character saaf hona jarori hai jisko log follow kar sakte hain, or ye jimmedari usi insaan ki banti hai, ki vo khud kisi bhi tarike ke galat kaam se door ruhe...
doosra, agar us insaan ka kabu uske man pe nahi hai or vo khud ko kuch galat karne se nahi rook sakta... to ye uski hi jimmedari hai ki vo apni, so called "personal life" ki galat harkato ko chupa ke rukhe...
teesri, kisi bhi insaan pe agar kuch ilzaam lagte hain to ye us insaan ki ki jimmedari hai to ya to vo un sab ilzaamo ka saamna kare.... ya to accept kare ya reject kare... or public ko prove kare ki ye sab galat batein failai ja ruhi hain unke khilaaf... or agar kisi halat mai vo insaan jivit na to to unka case uske followers ya decendents bhi represent kar sakte hain...
chautha, agar ye sabit ho jata hai ki kisi insaan ka character leader ban-ne ke layak hi nahi hai to... ye logo ki responsibility banti hai ki vo un logo ko aandhe ho kar poojna bandh kar de...

Really that was the first time I heard the 'lust' angle..I have heard all other stories and theories about the Nehru family but yeh vasna wala angle to pehli baar suna..to zaroor Sangwan ji ke kuch sources rahe honge jinhone ne unhe itna kuch bataya...

Aur kyun bhai..ek public aadmi ki personal life kyun nahi ho sakti? Kyunki ek aadmi public view mein aa chuka hai, kya use apni personal life alag rakhne ka koi haq nahi? Kya uski personal life sari public ki jaydaad ban jati hai? After all he/she is a person too. Why is it compulsory for that person to showcase his personal life and all its emotions, feelings to the general public? Its his/her choice.

Aur 'character' saaf aur ganda ek subjective cheez hai. Kisi ko wohi character saaf bhi lag sakta hai aur kisi ko ganda. So we can hardly judge. Ab Congres ke supporter kahenge ki Indira ne shaadi ki, bache huye aur fir unhone apni life desh ke naam kar di..wahin her opponents will say ki usne vaasna mitayi aur uske baad baap ke paas vapis chali gayi...ab yeh to kehne wale ke apne value system pe depend karta hai ki woh kisme belief karta hai.

ravinderjeet
July 23rd, 2012, 04:19 PM
Really that was the first time I heard the 'lust' angle..I have heard all other stories and theories about the Nehru family but yeh vasna wala angle to pehli baar suna..to zaroor Sangwan ji ke kuch sources rahe honge jinhone ne unhe itna kuch bataya...

Aur kyun bhai..ek public aadmi ki personal life kyun nahi ho sakti? Kyunki ek aadmi public view mein aa chuka hai, kya use apni personal life alag rakhne ka koi haq nahi? Kya uski personal life sari public ki jaydaad ban jati hai? After all he/she is a person too. Why is it compulsory for that person to showcase his personal life and all its emotions, feelings to the general public? Its his/her choice.

Aur 'character' saaf aur ganda ek subjective cheez hai. Kisi ko wohi character saaf bhi lag sakta hai aur kisi ko ganda. So we can hardly judge. Ab Congres ke supporter kahenge ki Indira ne shaadi ki, bache huye aur fir unhone apni life desh ke naam kar di..wahin her opponents will say ki usne vaasna mitayi aur uske baad baap ke paas vapis chali gayi...ab yeh to kehne wale ke apne value system pe depend karta hai ki woh kisme belief karta hai.


समाज की मान्यताओं के अनुसार हम किसी के चरित्र को सही या गलत कहते हैं | जब कोई व्यक्ति एक समाज को या देश को प्रतिनिधितव देता हे तो वो उस समाज या देश का चेहरा बन जाता हे | उसके चरित्र के अनुसार ही उस देश/समाज की छवि बनती हे | इसीलिए ऐसे व्यक्ति से एक सुधृअड़ चरित्र को बनाए रखने की अपेक्सा की जाती हे | कमजोर व्यक्तितव वाला व्यक्ति कभी देश/समाज को सही मार्गदर्शन नहीं दे सकता |

sanjeev1984
July 23rd, 2012, 04:52 PM
Bahot sare logo ne nahi mana tha, jab galilio ne kaha ki dharti suraj ke charo taraf ghoomti hai... maine koi baat pehli baar suni iska matlab ye nahi ki vo galat/jhooti hai... to agar aap ne pehli baar suni, iske basis pe aap sangwan ji ki info pe question nahi kar sakte... aapko nahi pata iska matlab ye bhi to ho sakta hai ki aap ignorent ho... harr baat hume kabhi na kabhi pehli baar hi pata chalti hai... study karo, research karo, analyse karo fir conclusion pe aana...

Govt ban kyon karti hai players/actors ko smoking and alcoholic brands ke ad karne ko??? Parents baccho ko is sab choozo se door rukhne ke liya peet bhi dete hain... 1). ab agar ye personal hai to kisi ko kuch nahi bolna chahiye... 2). or agar sahi hai to khul kar karne hi choot honi chahiye sabko... 3). or agar galat/sahi hai or concerned log bhi mana kar ruhe hain/ya favour mai hain, to ye choices personal ho ke bhi personal nahi hain(jab doosre logo ki raye pe kisi ka decision depend kare!!!)... and same thing is applicable for many issues like kawar, faith, extramaritial affairs, livein relationship, and many more

Bilkul character subjective cheez hai... aandho ki nagri mai kaana hi raja banta hai... chahe vo aankha ke andhe ho ya akal ke aandhe, ya fir dono ka combination bhi ho sakta hai, or ye bhi ho sakta hai ki illusion faila ke aandha banaya gaya ho...

character subjective to hai but uska mulyankan kabhi bhi isolation mai nahi hota... comparison mai hota hai... ek story suno... ek jagah ek aadmi rehta tha... uski aadat ki ki vo chalte huae tiolet karta tha... aas-paas ke sab log uski is harkat se pareshan the... ye i think uske character ka hi ek hisaa tha... (sab uska comparison normal bande ke saath karte the...)... ek din vo mar gaya... kafi log uske ghar aaye... or uske bete ko bole ki beta life mai aisa kuch karna ki tere pitaji ka naam dhak jaye... to ladke ne chakkar kaat-te huae toilet karna suru kar diya... ye dekh kar logo ne kaha... is-se t accha iska baap hi tha... kuch bhi ho uske baap ko acchai to mil hi gai... i hope moral of story aap ki samajh mai aaya hoga... agar nahi aaya to bata dena mai pointwise samjha dounga... :)



Really that was the first time I heard the 'lust' angle..I have heard all other stories and theories about the Nehru family but yeh vasna wala angle to pehli baar suna..to zaroor Sangwan ji ke kuch sources rahe honge jinhone ne unhe itna kuch bataya...

Aur kyun bhai..ek public aadmi ki personal life kyun nahi ho sakti? Kyunki ek aadmi public view mein aa chuka hai, kya use apni personal life alag rakhne ka koi haq nahi? Kya uski personal life sari public ki jaydaad ban jati hai? After all he/she is a person too. Why is it compulsory for that person to showcase his personal life and all its emotions, feelings to the general public? Its his/her choice.

Aur 'character' saaf aur ganda ek subjective cheez hai. Kisi ko wohi character saaf bhi lag sakta hai aur kisi ko ganda. So we can hardly judge. Ab Congres ke supporter kahenge ki Indira ne shaadi ki, bache huye aur fir unhone apni life desh ke naam kar di..wahin her opponents will say ki usne vaasna mitayi aur uske baad baap ke paas vapis chali gayi...ab yeh to kehne wale ke apne value system pe depend karta hai ki woh kisme belief karta hai.

RavinderSura
July 23rd, 2012, 05:03 PM
Remarks on personal life of ex-prime minister are disgusting. Article is written with a biased attitude and it is just twisting of facts. Such type of articles spoils the image of the community.

इसके अतिरिक्त ब्राह्मणवाद व पाखण्डवाद से पीछा छुड़ाये बगैर जाट कौम कभी भी अपने मकसद तक नहीं पहुंच सकती। क्योंकि हम हिन्दू रहकर कभी शिखर पर नहीं पहुंच सकते और यह हमने चौ० चरणसिंह के समय देख लिया है।
isme personal remarks wali koun si baat h samajh nahi aii ?
aur brahmanwaad ke khilaaf likhne se jat ki badnaami hoti h to ab is baat ka kya ilaaj .....

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 05:06 PM
समाज की मान्यताओं के अनुसार हम किसी के चरित्र को सही या गलत कहते हैं | जब कोई व्यक्ति एक समाज को या देश को प्रतिनिधितव देता हे तो वो उस समाज या देश का चेहरा बन जाता हे | उसके चरित्र के अनुसार ही उस देश/समाज की छवि बनती हे | इसीलिए ऐसे व्यक्ति से एक सुधृअड़ चरित्र को बनाए रखने की अपेक्सा की जाती हे | कमजोर व्यक्तितव वाला व्यक्ति कभी देश/समाज को सही मार्गदर्शन नहीं दे सकता |

Aapki baat sahi hai...par at the same time mujhe lagta hai ki hum log kisi ki personal life mein jyada hi interest lete hain.

Kya aap bhi Indira-Feroz ki marriage ke baare mein yahi kahenge ki woh ek vasna thi? We cant comment on something we dont know. Hamein kya pata. Hamein jo pata hai woh hain uske political actions and we can surely comment on that.

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 05:15 PM
Bahot sare logo ne nahi mana tha, jab galilio ne kaha ki dharti suraj ke charo taraf ghoomti hai... maine koi baat pehli baar suni iska matlab ye nahi ki vo galat/jhooti hai... to agar aap ne pehli baar suni, iske basis pe aap sangwan ji ki info pe question nahi kar sakte... aapko nahi pata iska matlab ye bhi to ho sakta hai ki aap ignorent ho... harr baat hume kabhi na kabhi pehli baar hi pata chalti hai... study karo, research karo, analyse karo fir conclusion pe aana...

Govt ban kyon karti hai players/actors ko smoking and alcoholic brands ke ad karne ko??? Parents baccho ko is sab choozo se door rukhne ke liya peet bhi dete hain... 1). ab agar ye personal hai to kisi ko kuch nahi bolna chahiye... 2). or agar sahi hai to khul kar karne hi choot honi chahiye sabko... 3). or agar galat/sahi hai or concerned log bhi mana kar ruhe hain/ya favour mai hain, to ye choices personal ho ke bhi personal nahi hain(jab doosre logo ki raye pe kisi ka decision depend kare!!!)... and same thing is applicable for many issues like kawar, faith, extramaritial affairs, livein relationship, and many more

Bilkul character subjective cheez hai... aandho ki nagri mai kaana hi raja banta hai... chahe vo aankha ke andhe ho ya akal ke aandhe, ya fir dono ka combination bhi ho sakta hai, or ye bhi ho sakta hai ki illusion faila ke aandha banaya gaya ho...

character subjective to hai but uska mulyankan kabhi bhi isolation mai nahi hota... comparison mai hota hai... ek story suno... ek jagah ek aadmi rehta tha... uski aadat ki ki vo chalte huae tiolet karta tha... aas-paas ke sab log uski is harkat se pareshan the... ye i think uske character ka hi ek hisaa tha... (sab uska comparison normal bande ke saath karte the...)... ek din vo mar gaya... kafi log uske ghar aaye... or uske bete ko bole ki beta life mai aisa kuch karna ki tere pitaji ka naam dhak jaye... to ladke ne chakkar kaat-te huae toilet karna suru kar diya... ye dekh kar logo ne kaha... is-se t accha iska baap hi tha... kuch bhi ho uske baap ko acchai to mil hi gai... i hope moral of story aap ki samajh mai aaya hoga... agar nahi aaya to bata dena mai pointwise samjha dounga... :)

Bhai..tum example to bahut dete ho..par usme logic ya supporting evidence kam hi hota hai...Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai? Sirf yahi ki usne pehle love marriage ki fir kuch saal baad politics mein aa gayi? jaisa ki maine kaha..isi cheez ko log dusre angle se bhi dekh sakte hain...halaki I dont think Indira was a great leader..par usne marriage kis liye ki yeh hum jo information uplabdh hai uske basis pe nahin keh sakte..

Bhai..ab govt ke smoking aur alchohol laws pe mat jana...wohi govt. smoking ads ke liye mana karti hai..par un compnies ko kuch nahi kehti jo cigarrettes aur alcohol banati hain. Kyun? Kyunki unse Sales Tax dwara income jo hoti hai. Is liye smoking or alcohol ad bans to govt ki sabse badi hypocricy hai.

RavinderSura
July 23rd, 2012, 05:15 PM
Aapki baat sahi hai...par at the same time mujhe lagta hai ki hum log kisi ki personal life mein jyada hi interest lete hain.

Kya aap bhi Indira-Feroz ki marriage ke baare mein yahi kahenge ki woh ek vasna thi? We cant comment on something we dont know. Hamein kya pata. Hamein jo pata hai woh hain uske political actions and we can surely comment on that.
ab wasna h ya siyasat yah to pata nahi par isme yah confirm h ki unme pyaar nahi tha , agar pyaar hota to usme wasna ya siyasat ke liye jagah nahi hoti ....

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 05:19 PM
ab wasna h ya siyasat yah to pata nahi par isme yah confirm h ki unme pyaar nahi tha , agar pyaar hota to usme wasna ya siyasat ke liye jagah nahi hoti ....

Bhai sahb..people change..emotions change..our life changes..let it be. We should discuss her political actions and its effects rather than dragging personal life of which we dont know about her motivations.

As I said, Sangwan ji was trying to convey the right thoughts but maybe he took an incorrect example. That was my whole point.

sanjeev1984
July 23rd, 2012, 05:32 PM
"Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai?" sahi baat hai... but ab ek naya sawaal kada hota hai... ki jab gallilio ne methametical proof diya to kya logo ne uski baat maan li thi??? or agar nahi mani to aise logo ka kya ilaaj jo methametical proof hone ke baad bhi us baat ko maan-ne ke liye taiyaar nahi huae...

ye baat to sach hai ki mai example bahot deta hu... iske piche meri ye kosih rehti hai ki mai kisi baat ko aasani se samjha saku... or shayad examples ka kaam bhi yahi hota hai or examples diye bhi isi liye jate hain... but ye baat bhi sach hai ki aap sahi baat ko chood kar example ka post-mortem karne mai lag jate ho or jis baat ke liye vo example diya jata hai... aap us baat ke aas-paas bhi nahi sochte... or ye baat aapke post jahir karte hain... or iska example aapka ye attached post hai ... :P


Bhai..tum example to bahut dete ho..par usme logic ya supporting evidence kam hi hota hai...Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai? Sirf yahi ki usne pehle love marriage ki fir kuch saal baad politics mein aa gayi? jaisa ki maine kaha..isi cheez ko log dusre angle se bhi dekh sakte hain...halaki I dont think Indira was a great leader..par usne marriage kis liye ki yeh hum jo information uplabdh hai uske basis pe nahin keh sakte..

Bhai..ab govt ke smoking aur alchohol laws pe mat jana...wohi govt. smoking ads ke liye mana karti hai..par un compnies ko kuch nahi kehti jo cigarrettes aur alcohol banati hain. Kyun? Kyunki unse Sales Tax dwara income jo hoti hai. Is liye smoking or alcohol ad bans to govt ki sabse badi hypocricy hai.

ygulia
July 23rd, 2012, 05:39 PM
Iska matlab ye hua ki ab aap log jaaton ko dharam pativartan ka paath padha rahe hai, do not you think it is disgusting and irresponsible statement by you.
Bhai hum hindu hi theek hai, ise paath agar is forum na dei te theek rahen ga.


इसके अतिरिक्त ब्राह्मणवाद व पाखण्डवाद से पीछा छुड़ाये बगैर जाट कौम कभी भी अपने मकसद तक नहीं पहुंच सकती। क्योंकि हम हिन्दू रहकर कभी शिखर पर नहीं पहुंच सकते और यह हमने चौ० चरणसिंह के समय देख लिया है।
isme personal remarks wali koun si baat h samajh nahi aii ?
aur brahmanwaad ke khilaaf likhne se jat ki badnaami hoti h to ab is baat ka kya ilaaj .....

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 05:42 PM
"Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai?" sahi baat hai... but ab ek naya sawaal kada hota hai... ki jab gallilio ne methametical proof diya to kya logo ne uski baat maan li thi??? or agar nahi mani to aise logo ka kya ilaaj jo methametical proof hone ke baad bhi us baat ko maan-ne ke liye taiyaar nahi huae...

ye baat to sach hai ki mai example bahot deta hu... iske piche meri ye kosih rehti hai ki mai kisi baat ko aasani se samjha saku... or shayad examples ka kaam bhi yahi hota hai or examples diye bhi isi liye jate hain... but ye baat bhi sach hai ki aap sahi baat ko chood kar example ka post-mortem karne mai lag jate ho or jis baat ke liye vo example diya jata hai... aap us baat ke aas-paas bhi nahi sochte... or ye baat aapke post jahir karte hain... or iska example aapka ye attached post hai ... :P

Bhai..to example hi soch samjh ke diya karo...Aise loopholes se bhare examples doge to fir usme nuks to nikalenge hi...Waise I understand..its not your fault..jaisa tumhara opinion hoga waisa hi example doge na....

sanjeev1984
July 23rd, 2012, 05:47 PM
maine to soch-samajh ke hi diya tha... ab aapki samajh mai nahi aaya to isme meri kya galati hai????
or loophole example mai tha kya ya aapke dimag mai ye baat ya to aap jano ya aapka bhagwaan jane!!!

waise aapka "non-sence of humor" to bahot accha hai but ye quote mai hi-lighted comment bahot childish tha... i suggest you to improve a bit whn you try to be sarcastic...

ek baat ka jawab nahi diya aapne??? koi nahi fir se pooch leta hu...
""Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai?" sahi baat hai... but ab ek naya sawaal kada hota hai... ki jab gallilio ne methametical proof diya to kya logo ne uski baat maan li thi??? or agar nahi mani to aise logo ka kya ilaaj jo methametical proof hone ke baad bhi us baat ko maan-ne ke liye taiyaar nahi huae..."



Bhai..to example hi soch samjh ke diya karo...Aise loopholes se bhare examples doge to fir usme nuks to nikalenge hi...Waise I understand..its not your fault..jaisa tumhara opinion hoga waisa hi example doge na....

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 05:59 PM
maine to soch-samajh ke hi diya tha... ab aapki samajh mai nahi aaya to isme meri kya galati hai????
or loophole example mai tha kya ya aapke dimag mai ye baat ya to aap jano ya aapka bhagwaan jane!!!

waise ye quote mai hi-lighted comment bahot childish tha... i suggest you to improve a bit...

ek baat ka jawab nahi diya aapne??? koi nahi fir se pooch leta hu...
""Gallileo ne jo kaha tha uske liye usne mathematical calulations ke saath proof diya tha... Yahan par proof kya hai?" sahi baat hai... but ab ek naya sawaal kada hota hai... ki jab gallilio ne methametical proof diya to kya logo ne uski baat maan li thi??? or agar nahi mani to aise logo ka kya ilaaj jo methametical proof hone ke baad bhi us baat ko maan-ne ke liye taiyaar nahi huae..."

To your question in bold..I dont know...At such times one must agree to disagree. But only balanced and mature people are capable of it.

And to your suggestion..surprised to hear the allegation childish from somebody who frequently uses teen chat lingo like :P, :D and or plain laughter as response to posts..

sanjeev1984
July 23rd, 2012, 07:38 PM
If according to you the definition of maturity is not to give any kind of reaction to your extremely funny jokes and out of this world "non-sense of humor", than i accept my childishness. :)

If you are not able to answer my question "in bold", please let me know what you will do with the proofs for other issues, when you never gonna accept those things? (Just like they did with Gallileo, even after providing the methametical proofs!!!!)


To your question in bold..I dont know...At such times one must agree to disagree. But only balanced and mature people are capable of it.

And to your suggestion..surprised to hear the allegation childish from somebody who frequently uses teen chat lingo like :P, :D and or plain laughter as response to posts..

cutejaatsandeep
July 23rd, 2012, 10:16 PM
जाट कौम ........सावधान !!
-पूर्व कमांडेंट हवा सिंह सांगवान


http://www.jatland.com/home/Asli_Lutere_Koun/Part-II#18._.E0.A4.9C.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.9F_.E0.A4.95.E0.A5 .8C.E0.A4.AE...........E0.A4.B8.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.B5. E0.A4.A7.E0.A4.BE.E0.A4.A8.21

इस लेख में मैं प्रत्यक्ष व परोक्ष रूप से ऐसा कुछ कहना चाहुंगा। मैं भी आपकी तरह एक साधारण जाट हूँ, मैं कोई इतिहासकार व साहित्यकार नहीं हूँ। लेकिन मैंने अपनी जाति के लिए इतिहास पर कुछ चिंतन किया है, इसलिए मैं अपने चिंतन को असाधारण मानता हूँ और इसी बल पर अपनी बात को डंके की चोट पर सिद्ध करने का दावा करता हूँ। मेरी बात को मेरे कितने जाट भाई समझ पायेंगे यह मैं नहीं कह सकता, लेकिन कोई एक भी समझ गया तो मैं स्वयं को सफल समझूंगा। इस बारे में मैं कुछ उदाहरण पेश कर रहा हूँ -
मेरे एक जाट मित्र अधिकारी के पुत्र ने ब्राह्मण जाति में शादी की थी। वह अपने पौत्र को एक दिन अपने साथ लाया और मुझे कहने लगा कि यह बच्चा बहुत ही होशियार है। मैंने पूछा “हम किस वर्ण में आते हैं तथा हमारा धर्म क्या है और हम अपने धर्म के बारे में कितना जानते हैं” उन्होंने उत्तर दिया “जाट क्षत्रिय हैं और मैं पक्का हिन्दू हूँ तथा प्रातः रोजाना गीता का पाठ करता हूँ।”, तो मैंने कहा - फिर तो आपका पौत्र सूत जाति का हुआ क्योंकि हिन्दू धर्म की मनुस्मृति में जातियों के अनुलामे व प्रतिलामे के अध्याय में स्पष्ट लिखा है कि “क्षत्रिय से ब्राह्मण कन्या में उत्पन्न जाति (वर्ण) सूत कहलाती है” इस पर मित्र मुझे घूरकर देखने लगा तो मैंने कहा “इसमें चिन्ता की कोई बात नहीं, आपका पौत्र तो अवश्य होशियार होगा क्योंकि यह हाईब्रीड है (शंकर वर्ण) जैसे हाईब्रीड बाजरा व गेहूँ एक एकड़ में 40 मन से 80 मन तक हो जाता है, लेकिन याद रहे इनमें देशी बाजरे व गेहूँ की तरह कभी मिठास व लोच नहीं होगा। बस यही भारी अन्तर है। पाठक कृपया इसका अर्थ स्वयं निकाले।

aur bhai suraa ke gyaan tere....bhai pehle to tu maane nu bataa ke tu hindu see ke taane bhi sangwan saab ki tarah dharam parivartann kar liya n sardar ban gya...ai sangwan saab ka koi bhi comment ka paaddu usmai hindu dharam ki burai jaroor hoti hai....kuch information hindu dharam ke regarding sangwan saab ko clear nahi hai..jo mai aaj batana chahta hu....pehle baat to bhai hindu dharam ki neev jisse bhagvaad geeta bolte hai jab usmai hindu dharam ya kissi dharam ka naam nahi hai to usmai alag alagg jaatiyon ka bhi jikar nahi hai....to ye sangwan saab ko kisne bol diya ke hindu dharam choti ya baadi jaati mai believe karta hai....bhagvaad geeta guru granth sahib n koran ki tarah book nahi hai jo eek religion ke liye leekhi gaye hai...bhagvaad geeta ko jeena n reehna seekhati hai...doosri bhai nu bataoo jiss dharam mai sangwaan saab convert hue hai usmai valmiki chamar dhanak chudee koni ke?sangwan saab ki baato se aisa lagta hai ki woo jaaat paat ko nahi maante hai too mai usne yee poochna chahta hu ki kya woo kissi chude n dhanak mai apna baalak byaah sakte hai ya nahi?agar haa to bahut badiya agar nahi to phir woo kyo differentiate kar rahe hai...bhai sura maane is baat ka jawab jaroor diye....teesri baat aab maane nuu bataoo ki woo dharam unhone apnaya hai usmai 5achi baatein bataoo jo unke dharam ko doosre dharam se better bana de....mai sangwan saab mere dada ji ki umar ke hai but pher bhi mai eek baat bolna chahta hu ki woo jaaat samaj ke liye bahut badiya kaam kar rahe hai but eek dharam ko oppose karke uske logo ko doosre dharam mai aane ke liye bolna bahut galat hai n woo bhi eek national level leader ke liye......n unhone aisa kya hassil kiya doosra dharam apna kar jo uhne hindu dharam mai nahi mila.....bhai sura meri saari baata ka jawab diye....

VivekGathwala
July 23rd, 2012, 10:28 PM
अगर ऐसी बात हैं तो आज के हालात देखते हुए वो दिन दूर नहीं जब जात कौम मे इन सूत पुत्रों की बाढ़ आ जाएगी | खास बात यह हैं की इस सबके लिए शहरी जाट ज्यादा ज़िम्मेवार हैं और यहीं लोग अपनी इस कमी को छुपाने के लिए गाँव के जाटों को कोसते रहते हैं

swaich
July 23rd, 2012, 10:35 PM
If according to you the definition of maturity is not to give any kind of reaction to your extremely funny jokes and out of this world "non-sense of humor", than i accept my childishness. :)

If you are not able to answer my question "in bold", please let me know what you will do with the proofs for other issues, when you never gonna accept those things? (Just like they did with Gallileo, even after providing the methametical proofs!!!!)

If my posts are a source of amusement to you, please be my guest and have your hearts fill of laughter. I do not mind. As i have said before ignorance is bliss. If you want to continue further, open a separate thread as we have gone off topic by a long distance.

I have already provided you the answer. At some point both parties with divergent views have to agree to disagree. I don't understand why this seems an alien concept to you.

Fateh
July 24th, 2012, 04:46 AM
I have not understood as to why mr sura has become writer for mr sangwan, is mr sangwan incapable of writing or mr sura expresses his views in the name of mr hawa singh, I feel mr sangwa should pen his views himself so that we are benifitted by his matured views, secondly, I think mr sura you people should stop preaching about religion, this forum must not be misused for such personal publicity and religious marketing, I request to respected sh hawa singh to consider my above post with cool and positive mind and take decision please

deshi-jat
July 24th, 2012, 07:50 AM
रविंदर, एक बात बता, यो हाइब्रिड (संकर) गेहूं कोणसा गाम मै बोया करैं ?


जाट कौम ........सावधान !!
-पूर्व कमांडेंट हवा सिंह सांगवान


..............हाईब्रीड बाजरा व गेहूँ एक एकड़ में 40 मन से 80 मन तक हो जाता है, लेकिन याद रहे इनमें देशी बाजरे व गेहूँ की तरह कभी मिठास व लोच नहीं होगा। बस यही भारी अन्तर है। पाठक कृपया इसका अर्थ स्वयं निकाले।

deshi-jat
July 24th, 2012, 08:13 AM
अर मुसलमान या ईसाई बण पहुँच ज्यागा शिखर पै? इणमै जमा किसै ढ़ाळ का कोई पाखण्डवाद (पादरीवाद/मुल्लावाद) नहीं, सारी कमी बस एक हिन्दू धर्मं मै सै !!!!!!!!

बावळी बात



इसके अतिरिक्त ब्राह्मणवाद व पाखण्डवाद से पीछा छुड़ाये बगैर जाट कौम कभी भी अपने मकसद तक नहीं पहुंच सकती। क्योंकि हम हिन्दू रहकर कभी शिखर पर नहीं पहुंच सकते और यह हमने चौ० चरणसिंह के समय देख लिया है।
isme personal remarks wali koun si baat h samajh nahi aii ?
aur brahmanwaad ke khilaaf likhne se jat ki badnaami hoti h to ab is baat ka kya ilaaj .....

anilsangwan
July 24th, 2012, 08:38 AM
अर मुसलमान या ईसाई बण पहुँच ज्यागा शिखर पै? इणमै जमा किसै ढ़ाळ का कोई पाखण्डवाद (पादरीवाद/मुल्लावाद) नहीं, सारी कमी बस एक हिन्दू धर्मं मै सै !!!!!!!!

बावळी बात

मेरे ख्याल तें तो भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .... एर एक बात का प्रण ले ल्यो.... ये बाह्मण/पादरी/मौलवी/पण्डे/गुरुजी/माता-रानी/बाबे/मोड़े/डेरे नहीं पूजणे... फ़ालतू के फंड जैसे कावड़, माता दर्शन, गंगा जी नाहन, सत्संग दर्शन/फलाणी धकड़ी देवी / आदि में धन और समय खराब नहीं करना.... बल्कि वो पैसा अपने बच्चों पे खर्च करो... पढो लिखो आर अपनी कौम ऩे उपर ठाऊ... यो मकसद अगर हर जाट का हो तो जरूत ए कोणी किसे और चीज़ की..फेर ये आसाराम, मुरारी बापू, राम-रहीम आर राधास्वामी आले किते ना ए सी कारां में चालें... सीटी मारेंगे इनके खाली पंडाल...
.

vicky84
July 24th, 2012, 08:40 AM
100 ki 100 baat !!!!


मेरे ख्याल तें तो भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .... एर एक बात का प्रण ले ल्यो.... ये बाह्मण/पादरी/मौलवी/पण्डे/गुरुजी/माता-रानी/बाबे/मोड़े/डेरे नहीं पूजणे... फ़ालतू के फंड जैसे कावड़, माता दर्शन, गंगा जी नाहन, सत्संग दर्शन/फलाणी धकड़ी देवी / आदि में धन और समय खराब नहीं करना.... बल्कि वो पैसा अपने बच्चों पे खर्च करो... पढो लिखो आर अपनी कौम ऩे उपर ठाऊ... यो मकसद अगर हर जाट का हो तो जरूत ए कोणी किसे और चीज़ की...

sanjeev1984
July 24th, 2012, 10:05 AM
Thanks! I like your PJ's and i enjoy a lot. But sadly i have few more thigs to do.

The answer you gave, can not be considered as answer at all. What do you mean by at some point both parties agree or disagree? Is this the answer? It is a universal truth for each and every dispute between people! People who disagreed were always disagree and killed galileo. And it took more than 4 generations or more than 125 years to believe in the concepts of galileo. So if you are not in agreement of the truth about Great Nehru-Gandhi's Family, let few years go part, may be you (or your future generations) will be agree with the concepts given by Mr. Sangwan.

Yes, concepts from a complex brain (like you), may be some time sounds like alien for me. And complaxity of you brain is proved by your statement given in one of you post in this thread and in another thread.

When it is about Nehru-Gandhi family, you said "Hum unse nahi mile, to humein apni raye nahi banani chahiye or koi comment nahi karna chahiye" (in this case, you dont trust the text and need a personal meeting with Nehru-Gandhi family to develop your opinion and rejects everything in text) (Where meeting with them is impossible.)
But when it was about Mr. Narender Modi, you said "kya hum kahin pe jaye bina ya kisi se mile bina, apni raye nahi bana sakte, IT hai, newspaper hain, news channel hain... ye kafi info dete hain Modi ke bare mai" (In this case is the the text, which is Bible for you) (Where as meeting with Mr. Modi is possible)

You believe only in the things which are convinient to you. And you do not only believe them, you feel that whatever "I know" or "I said" is true and correct.

Having an opinion is absolutely fine but declaring in public that whatever I know is correct and true, is dangerous. And all your posts reflects only this trait.


If my posts are a source of amusement to you, please be my guest and have your hearts fill of laughter. I do not mind. As i have said before ignorance is bliss. If you want to continue further, open a separate thread as we have gone off topic by a long distance.

I have already provided you the answer. At some point both parties with divergent views have to agree to disagree. I don't understand why this seems an alien concept to you.

RavinderSura
July 24th, 2012, 11:33 AM
I have not understood as to why mr sura has become writer for mr sangwan, is mr sangwan incapable of writing or mr sura expresses his views in the name of mr hawa singh, I feel mr sangwa should pen his views himself so that we are benifitted by his matured views, secondly, I think mr sura you people should stop preaching about religion, this forum must not be misused for such personal publicity and religious marketing, I request to respected sh hawa singh to consider my above post with cool and positive mind and take decision please
thik h ji apki salah par gaur karunga :)
waise isme aapne religion wali baat par bahut gaur kiya agar baat religion wali hi h to fer isme religion ke niyamanusar sutt putr ke baare me likha h us par apne koi tipanni nahi ki ki yah sahi kaha ya galat ....

prashantacmet
July 24th, 2012, 12:39 PM
saangwaan sahab aur sura sahab..aapne jaatoen ko jaagrat karne ke liye jo lekh like hai..jaat kaum ke uthaan ke liue aap log aur bhi jo prayas kar rahe hai uske liye aap samman ke paatra hai......aap choturam ji ke anuyaayi ho ..par unke sandesh ko aap gahrai se samajh nahi paaye..chaudhary sahab ne kaha tha.." ee jaat ek to tu le bolana seekh aur dossra le dushman pahchaan"..to aap logo ne dushman to pahchaan liya par aapne abhi bolna nahi seekhe.....aap log aise bolo jais eyeh bhaape bolte hai..ki saanp bhi mar jaaye aur laathi bhi na toote....aapne apne lekh l main sabdo ka chayan chaturai se karna chaiye....jis tarah parox roop se aap vedic dharam aur hindu dharam ke burai kar rahe hai usse logo ka gussa phhoot kar baahar niklega..kyounki jyadar jaat vedic ya hindu dharmi hai....aap jaatoen ko seedha hindu se sikh/ismai bana rahe ho..pehle inhe bas jaat to bana lo....mere hisaab se jaat ko hindu muslim sikh isai mat banao usse bas jaat rahne do...........aasha hai aap mere sabdo ka matlab samajh gaye honge

Fateh
July 24th, 2012, 01:03 PM
thik h ji apki salah par gaur karunga :)
waise isme aapne religion wali baat par bahut gaur kiya agar baat religion wali hi h to fer isme religion ke niyamanusar sutt putr ke baare me likha h us par apne koi tipanni nahi ki ki yah sahi kaha ya galat ....

My dear sura let mr hawa singh reply my post, or no problem I can go without it

Samarkadian
July 24th, 2012, 01:08 PM
My dear sura let mr hawa singh reply my post, or no problem I can go without it

धरातल पर कार्य करने वालो के पास आपके, मेरे या सूरा की तरह यहाँ फोरम पर बैठ कर समाज सुधार या कानून छांटने का फ़ालतू समय नहीं है !

कतई माफ़ी नहीं चाहूँगा फतह साहब अपने इस उत्तर के लिए !

swaich
July 24th, 2012, 02:11 PM
Thanks! I like your PJ's and i enjoy a lot. But sadly i have few more thigs to do.

The answer you gave, can not be considered as answer at all. What do you mean by at some point both parties agree or disagree? Is this the answer? It is a universal truth for each and every dispute between people! People who disagreed were always disagree and killed galileo. And it took more than 4 generations or more than 125 years to believe in the concepts of galileo. So if you are not in agreement of the truth about Great Nehru-Gandhi's Family, let few years go part, may be you (or your future generations) will be agree with the concepts given by Mr. Sangwan.

Yes, concepts from a complex brain (like you), may be some time sounds like alien for me. And complaxity of you brain is proved by your statement given in one of you post in this thread and in another thread.

When it is about Nehru-Gandhi family, you said "Hum unse nahi mile, to humein apni raye nahi banani chahiye or koi comment nahi karna chahiye" (in this case, you dont trust the text and need a personal meeting with Nehru-Gandhi family to develop your opinion and rejects everything in text) (Where meeting with them is impossible.)
But when it was about Mr. Narender Modi, you said "kya hum kahin pe jaye bina ya kisi se mile bina, apni raye nahi bana sakte, IT hai, newspaper hain, news channel hain... ye kafi info dete hain Modi ke bare mai" (In this case is the the text, which is Bible for you) (Where as meeting with Mr. Modi is possible)

You believe only in the things which are convinient to you. And you do not only believe them, you feel that whatever "I know" or "I said" is true and correct.

Having an opinion is absolutely fine but declaring in public that whatever I know is correct and true, is dangerous. And all your posts reflects only this trait.

I am entitled to my views and to defend them as you are free to do for your views. If I dont agree with your views, I will dispute them.

You do remember things I said previously but forget the contexts in which they were spoken. I see a difference between the two cases. At no point has any author, journalist, writer come out and said that what Indira did was due to her lust and not because of love. Whereas many activists, journalists and even a serving police officer pointed towards collusion at the highest level in case of Modi. Do you see the difference now? The former was based on pure conjencture with no supporting statement by any other person except Sangwanji himself while the latter was based on the writings of many. If you want to go on further, we should talk on the Modi thread.

But there is another difference. Feelings like love, lust, hate etc are not bared open to everybody. So unless one was present there or knew the people closely one cant describe their 'feelings'.

And you are right, in a debate at some point one has to agree to disagree. But in real life scenario, might wins. Though the truth might come out after a few generations as in Galileo's case.

cutejaatsandeep
July 24th, 2012, 10:31 PM
thik h ji apki salah par gaur karunga :)
waise isme aapne religion wali baat par bahut gaur kiya agar baat religion wali hi h to fer isme religion ke niyamanusar sutt putr ke baare me likha h us par apne koi tipanni nahi ki ki yah sahi kaha ya galat ....
bhai meri baato ka bhi jawab dee dee kee.....sikhism mai jatt sikh alag gurudwara mai pooja karte hai....mazhabichude alag gurudwaro mai....valmiki and ravidasi alag gurudwaro mai....to tu sikhism ki burai to naa kareee....taanee ke bass bhamann hi deekhee hai?bhai taane meri kissi baat ka ibb tak jawab na diyaa...m still waitin

cutejaatsandeep
July 24th, 2012, 10:35 PM
मेरे ख्याल तें तो भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .... एर एक बात का प्रण ले ल्यो.... ये बाह्मण/पादरी/मौलवी/पण्डे/गुरुजी/माता-रानी/बाबे/मोड़े/डेरे नहीं पूजणे... फ़ालतू के फंड जैसे कावड़, माता दर्शन, गंगा जी नाहन, सत्संग दर्शन/फलाणी धकड़ी देवी / आदि में धन और समय खराब नहीं करना.... बल्कि वो पैसा अपने बच्चों पे खर्च करो... पढो लिखो आर अपनी कौम ऩे उपर ठाऊ... यो मकसद अगर हर जाट का हो तो जरूत ए कोणी किसे और चीज़ की..फेर ये आसाराम, मुरारी बापू, राम-रहीम आर राधास्वामी आले किते ना ए सी कारां में चालें... सीटी मारेंगे इनके खाली पंडाल...
.


bhai saab ismai jo maanna hai maano jisne nahi mannna mat maano but yaha kissi particular religion ko kyo critizise karna....hindu jaat akele hi arakshan ki ladai lad rahe hai...kaha gayee soo called sikh jatt and mulle jaat?maree bhi hindu jaat hi hai n pher critisize bhi unhi ko karo..thats not right..

raka
July 24th, 2012, 11:56 PM
hindu jaat akele hi arakshan ki ladai lad rahe hai...kaha gayee soo called sikh jatt and mulle jaat?maree bhi hindu jaat hi hai n pher critisize bhi unhi ko karo..thats not right..
अच्छा तैने क्यूकर बेरा अक सिर्फ हिन्दू जाट ही आरक्षण की लड़ाई लड़ रहे हैं ?
वैसे एक लेख से इतनी समस्या हो रही हैं तो आगे के हाल होगा मैं या सोच के हैरान हु !!

anilrana
July 25th, 2012, 01:09 AM
अच्छा तैने क्यूकर बेरा अक सिर्फ हिन्दू जाट ही आरक्षण की लड़ाई लड़ रहे हैं ?
वैसे एक लेख से इतनी समस्या हो रही हैं तो आगे के हाल होगा मैं या सोच के हैरान हु !!

Meri baat maano ar chod do in post mortema ne. kuch aaj ke liye kartey ho te karo.

ygulia
July 25th, 2012, 01:12 AM
मेरे ख्याल तें तो भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .... एर एक बात का प्रण ले ल्यो.... ये बाह्मण/पादरी/मौलवी/पण्डे/गुरुजी/माता-रानी/बाबे/मोड़े/डेरे नहीं पूजणे... फ़ालतू के फंड जैसे कावड़, माता दर्शन, गंगा जी नाहन, सत्संग दर्शन/फलाणी धकड़ी देवी / आदि में धन और समय खराब नहीं करना.... बल्कि वो पैसा अपने बच्चों पे खर्च करो... पढो लिखो आर अपनी कौम ऩे उपर ठाऊ... यो मकसद अगर हर जाट का हो तो जरूत ए कोणी किसे और चीज़ की..फेर ये आसाराम, मुरारी बापू, राम-रहीम आर राधास्वामी आले किते ना ए सी कारां में चालें... सीटी मारेंगे इनके खाली पंडाल...
.




Accha ek baat bata, dharam badle tei in bata tei pechha choot ja ga jo uppar likhi hai. Ye sari cheeze har dharam mei hai, kahi thodi kahi jyada. Mujhe nahi maloom tha ki Mr. Hawa Singh Sangwan nei apna dharam badal liya..............lekin phir bhi usko theek sei nahi apnaya..... bhai jaat kabhi dharam nahi badalta yahi uski jaat hone ki sabse badi pahchhan hai.........

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 04:28 AM
धरातल पर कार्य करने वालो के पास आपके, मेरे या सूरा की तरह यहाँ फोरम पर बैठ कर समाज सुधार या कानून छांटने का फ़ालतू समय नहीं है !

कतई माफ़ी नहीं चाहूँगा फतह साहब अपने इस उत्तर के लिए !
you are right, but in that case people should not use/misuse name of such people, you have not said any thing wrong, why should you feel sorry.

anilsangwan
July 25th, 2012, 04:58 AM
Accha ek baat bata, dharam badle tei in bata tei pechha choot ja ga jo uppar likhi hai. Ye sari cheeze har dharam mei hai, kahi thodi kahi jyada. Mujhe nahi maloom tha ki Mr. Hawa Singh Sangwan nei apna dharam badal liya..............lekin phir bhi usko theek sei nahi apnaya..... bhai jaat kabhi dharam nahi badalta yahi uski jaat hone ki sabse badi pahchhan hai.........

What are you writing? Read my post carefully, I have said "भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .." ..... menne dharam badlan ki kit kahi s kasai..... !!!

vicky84
July 25th, 2012, 05:10 AM
Jaat Dharam se upar hai..

Jaat ko faaltu fund ke pakhand chhod dene chahiye. Mere hisab se Shri Hawa Singh ji yahi kehna chahte hain!!

Aaar baaki jisnai aapni gobhi phir bhi khudwaani hai to bhai usnai koon rokk sakai sai!!


Kitte kue, johaad mai paado....


Mujhe nahi maloom tha ki Mr. Hawa Singh Sangwan nei apna dharam badal liya..............lekin phir bhi usko theek sei nahi apnaya..... bhai jaat kabhi dharam nahi badalta yahi uski jaat hone ki sabse badi pahchhan hai.........

vicky84
July 25th, 2012, 05:32 AM
गंगा जी नाहन,



Ganga to sada di innai...

Moddyan nai katti naas bitha rakha sai is river ka.. Dekho kaad khulengi aankh bharat ki janta ki..

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 06:07 AM
Jaat Dharam se upar hai..

Jaat ko faaltu fund ke pakhand chhod dene chahiye. Mere hisab se Shri Hawa Singh ji yahi kehna chahte hain!!

Aaar baaki jisnai aapni gobhi phir bhi khudwaani hai to bhai usnai koon rokk sakai sai!!


Kitte kue, johaad mai paado....
No body here recommending pakhand but mr Hawa singh, since he has changed his religion, is advocating for sikhism, which is not correct

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 06:21 AM
bhai saab ismai jo maanna hai maano jisne nahi mannna mat maano but yaha kissi particular religion ko kyo critizise karna....hindu jaat akele hi arakshan ki ladai lad rahe hai...kaha gayee soo called sikh jatt and mulle jaat?maree bhi hindu jaat hi hai n pher critisize bhi unhi ko karo..thats not right..

Brother, sardar (sikh) Hawa singh is there as their rep, participating very actively, muslims representation is also there but I do not want to comment on that, sandeep sorry to come in.

vicky84
July 25th, 2012, 06:24 AM
He is not saying that you have to follow Sikh religion. He is saying about injustice in varna system in Hindu religion. I cannot see anything wrong if this injustice is present. Don't take it as fight between you and shri Hawa Singh ji.


And as I said earlier, Jaat is above religion.



No body here recommending pakhand but mr Hawa singh, since he has changed his religion, is advocating for sikhism, which is not correct

vicky84
July 25th, 2012, 06:26 AM
Could you please stop writing derogatory comments about Shri Hawa Singh ji. Sarcasm is not good for anyone. You are an elder in the community. I think you not should set such examples among other Jats here.




Brother, sardar (sikh) Hawa singh is there as their rep, participating very actively, muslims representation is also there but I do not want to comment on that, sandeep sorry to come in.

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 06:42 AM
He is not saying that you have to follow Sikh religion. He is saying about injustice in varna system in Hindu religion. I cannot see anything wrong if this injustice is present. Don't take it as fight between you and shri Hawa Singh ji.


And as I said earlier, Jaat is above religion.

Friend I have no fight with hawa singh or for that matter with any body, but it a discussion of opinion, please do not rate me so low that I have fight with mr hawa singh whom in what ever possible manner, I had been supporting, of course now few of his intelligent, promoters are spoiling his image and show here

anilsangwan
July 25th, 2012, 07:32 AM
Friend I have no fight with hawa singh or for that matter with any body, but it a discussion of opinion, please do not rate me so low that I have fight with mr hawa singh whom in what ever possible manner, I had been supporting, of course now few of his intelligent, promoters are spoiling his image and show here

Sir, what is wrong if they are promoting him. How are they spoiling his image? Whatever he has said in media /public / website here has nothing wrong so far.

He has never said that he has changed his religion. He never said that Hindus are bad and Sikhs OR Muslims are better...... He has always said that do not follow these "paakhands" and "Paakhandis" - whichever religon they are.

You first attacked him because, in your opinion, he was taking credit. Let me ask you, why should he not take credit if he is fighting for the community. He has every right to take credit because he is fighting the battle on the ground (requires lots of "dum"). And if you expect him not to take credit then I would suggest that it is your jealousy as you can not see another Jat being respected by community as its leader. Please make a habit of accepting the truth that someone is doing better than others for the community.

Further, you raised issues on someone else writing on his behalf -- what is wrong in that? Samar has given a very nice reply to you on this and I agree to his viewpoint. You are just trying to attack someone who is doing something good for community as "Ground level". Reasons? Best known to you!

You are our elder, but looking at your consistent childish behavior, you do not deserve any respect, from me at least.

malikdeepak1
July 25th, 2012, 09:49 AM
मेरे ख्याल तें तो भाई हिन्दू मुस्लिम का रोला छोडो .... एर एक बात का प्रण ले ल्यो.... ये बाह्मण/पादरी/मौलवी/पण्डे/गुरुजी/माता-रानी/बाबे/मोड़े/डेरे नहीं पूजणे... फ़ालतू के फंड जैसे कावड़, माता दर्शन, गंगा जी नाहन, सत्संग दर्शन/फलाणी धकड़ी देवी / आदि में धन और समय खराब नहीं करना.... बल्कि वो पैसा अपने बच्चों पे खर्च करो... पढो लिखो आर अपनी कौम ऩे उपर ठाऊ... यो मकसद अगर हर जाट का हो तो जरूत ए कोणी किसे और चीज़ की..फेर ये आसाराम, मुरारी बापू, राम-रहीम आर राधास्वामी आले किते ना ए सी कारां में चालें... सीटी मारेंगे इनके खाली पंडाल...
.



Yu Taaga aade ae khatam ho jana chaiye tha..

VPannu
July 25th, 2012, 11:20 AM
..............................

VPannu
July 25th, 2012, 11:21 AM
I have not understood as to why mr sura has become writer for mr sangwan, is mr sangwan incapable of writing or mr sura expresses his views in the name of mr hawa singh, I feel mr sangwa should pen his views himself so that we are benifitted by his matured views Sir, spokesperson ya PR Officer ka naam to aapne jaroor suna hoga. jinke spokesperson ya PRO hote hain kya vo log incapable hote hain apne views express karne ke ? ho sakta hai time ki killat ke karan yo jimma Ravinder sura ko de rakha ho? :semi-twins:

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 03:39 PM
Could you please stop writing derogatory comments about Shri Hawa Singh ji. Sarcasm is not good for anyone. You are an elder in the community. I think you not should set such examples among other Jats here.
could you stop commenting and finding wrong meaning of my post, you are yougester, you should not indulse with elders, no more reply please

Fateh
July 25th, 2012, 03:44 PM
Sir, spokesperson ya PR Officer ka naam to aapne jaroor suna hoga. jinke spokesperson ya PRO hote hain kya vo log incapable hote hain apne views express karne ke ? ho sakta hai time ki killat ke karan yo jimma Ravinder sura ko de rakha ho? :semi-twins:
vivek, no more discussion, please stop it here, we must stop here before the situation get worst, i never ment what you people think, but anyway it is ok. no reply please

anilsangwan
July 25th, 2012, 03:59 PM
vivek, no more discussion, please stop it here, we must stop here before the situation get worst, i never ment what you people think, but anyway it is ok. no reply please

MAARE BARAABER , ROWE FAALTU.....!

Sir, then with due respect to you, you should think many times before you write about others. When others start replying to your comments - you feel offended and plead to stop the discussion. At least you accept that you didnt want to write something what we read..... So pls pay more attention to it next time......i know, you will be now angry with me, but I dont care. And yes, Pls grow up!

Samarkadian
July 25th, 2012, 04:12 PM
''Sometime a man has to be big enough to see how small he is.'' - 3:10 to Yuma

swaich
July 25th, 2012, 04:41 PM
Did Sangwanji change his religion? Its not mentioned anywhere in his comments.

ygulia
July 25th, 2012, 06:09 PM
Aade tei Hawa Singh Sangwan ke kai chelle(jo videsho tak felle huai hai) hai jo kise nei bhi kucch nahi likhan dete, yo forum tei highjack kar rakhi hai aur log batmisi pei utaru ho ja sai.

skharb
July 25th, 2012, 09:48 PM
bhaiyon mane to nu lage hai ye sare bhai nue batlaeen gaye to iss jaat aarakshan aandolan ka tangia paad ke manenge.

cutejaatsandeep
July 25th, 2012, 10:37 PM
अच्छा तैने क्यूकर बेरा अक सिर्फ हिन्दू जाट ही आरक्षण की लड़ाई लड़ रहे हैं ?
वैसे एक लेख से इतनी समस्या हो रही हैं तो आगे के हाल होगा मैं या सोच के हैरान हु !!
bhaisaab jaha ye arakshan ka andolan hota hai road n track jaam hote hai waha sirf hindu jaat rehte hai.......maaanee leekh se koi dikkat koni but uss leekh ke matter se dikkat se....aab harr leeekh mai eek particular religion ko critisize karna thik nahi hai.....hindu dharam mai jaatiii to hai hi nahi....jaativaad pandato ne start kiya thaa to aaap hindu dharam ke liye kaise bol rahe ho....bahman galat hai unko critise karo...maine to kabhi kissi religion ke liye galat nhi bolaaa....paakhand to sikhism mai bhi bahut hai....paakhand ki baat karo to sab religion ki karo naa....kyo yee mullle eek mahina roza rakhte hai....kyo gurudwaro mai itna gold n paisa chadhaya jata hai...uska to koi jikar tak nahi karta....aaagee isssaa aap ke kaaam kaaaraan aalee ho????

raka
July 26th, 2012, 12:40 AM
bhaisaab jaha ye arakshan ka andolan hota hai road n track jaam hote hai waha sirf hindu jaat rehte hai.......maaanee leekh se koi dikkat koni but uss leekh ke matter se dikkat se....aab harr leeekh mai eek particular religion ko critisize karna thik nahi hai.....hindu dharam mai jaatiii to hai hi nahi....jaativaad pandato ne start kiya thaa to aaap hindu dharam ke liye kaise bol rahe ho....bahman galat hai unko critise karo...maine to kabhi kissi religion ke liye galat nhi bolaaa....paakhand to sikhism mai bhi bahut hai....paakhand ki baat karo to sab religion ki karo naa....kyo yee mullle eek mahina roza rakhte hai....kyo gurudwaro mai itna gold n paisa chadhaya jata hai...uska to koi jikar tak nahi karta....aaagee isssaa aap ke kaaam kaaaraan aalee ho????
उड़े हिन्दू कोणी जाट थे सारे ;)

Fateh
July 26th, 2012, 05:35 AM
Sir, what is wrong if they are promoting him. How are they spoiling his image? Whatever he has said in media /public / website here has nothing wrong so far.

He has never said that he has changed his religion. He never said that Hindus are bad and Sikhs OR Muslims are better...... He has always said that do not follow these "paakhands" and "Paakhandis" - whichever religon they are.

You first attacked him because, in your opinion, he was taking credit. Let me ask you, why should he not take credit if he is fighting for the community. He has every right to take credit because he is fighting the battle on the ground (requires lots of "dum"). And if you expect him not to take credit then I would suggest that it is your jealousy as you can not see another Jat being respected by community as its leader. Please make a habit of accepting the truth that someone is doing better than others for the community.

Further, you raised issues on someone else writing on his behalf -- what is wrong in that? Samar has given a very nice reply to you on this and I agree to his viewpoint. You are just trying to attack someone who is doing something good for community as "Ground level". Reasons? Best known to you!

You are our elder, but looking at your consistent childish behavior, you do not deserve any respect, from me at least.I

ANIL, your understanding is totally wrong and please keep your mature views with you , i do not need them, dear i have already requested every one that leave me alone stop this topic now please.

vicky84
July 26th, 2012, 05:50 AM
Kamal hai! Jab koi tark nahi to doosron pe daal do baatein.. Kisi ko reply karne se pehle thoda sochna accha hota hai. Bhagwan ne dimaak diya uska istemaal karo.. gusse ka nahi..!!

Aade tei Hawa Singh Sangwan ke kai chelle(jo videsho tak felle huai hai) hai jo kise nei bhi kucch nahi likhan dete, yo forum tei highjack kar rakhi hai aur log batmisi pei utaru ho ja sai.

ygulia
July 26th, 2012, 06:06 AM
Bhai iska matlab dimaag thare dhore sai baki tei sab phadoo hai..................First look into yourself and then dare to give personal comment. I think this is clear indication to you what I want to convey....................think 1000 times before writing.................jatland is not your personal property.


Kamal hai! Jab koi tark nahi to doosron pe daal do baatein.. Kisi ko reply karne se pehle thoda sochna accha hota hai. Bhagwan ne dimaak diya uska istemaal karo.. gusse ka nahi..!!

Fateh
July 26th, 2012, 06:11 AM
Earlier there was some discussion on jat, please see few posts above and see the clear example of we great jats, they are intelligent, matured respectful, well behaved, truthful and great

vicky84
July 26th, 2012, 06:13 AM
Phir gussa.. I think koi fayda nahi hai aise apas mei arguments ka.. Jaat apas mai ladenge to bahar waalo ko kya dikhega.. Gulia ji,, aapke pass apna opinion hai aur mere pass mera..lets move on!

Bhai iska matlab dimaag thare dhore sai baki tei sab phadoo hai..................First look into yourself and then dare to give personal comment. I think this is clear indication to you what I want to convey....................think 1000 times before writing.................jatland is not your personal property.

anilsangwan
July 26th, 2012, 06:18 AM
Aade tei Hawa Singh Sangwan ke kai chelle(jo videsho tak felle huai hai) hai jo kise nei bhi kucch nahi likhan dete, yo forum tei highjack kar rakhi hai aur log batmisi pei utaru ho ja sai.

कोए तो बात होगी उस आदमी में जिसके चेले दूर दूर तक फैले हों.....आक नहीं ? साच बात कह दयो तो चेले हो गे लोग...किस ने hijack कर लिया फोरम.. ? खुल के नाम ले भाई..... लुगायिया आली चुगली सी मत करे..... गलत बात लिखेगा कोए तो जवाब तो दिया जागा.... विचारों की सवतंत्रता सब को है... लेकिन किसी दुसरे पे आरोप लगाना बुरी बात है....

मेरी औड तें भी अब्ब कोए पोस्ट नहीं इस थ्रेड पे..... अगर किसे ने और फ़ालतू बकवास नहीं करी तो....!!!

Er haan, baaki ek baat to s.....अक्ल ना आणि हो तो सारी उम्र कोणी आवे आदमी ने .... जरुरी नहीं आक बूढा हो गया तो अक्ल आ ज्यागी अपने आप .....!!!

Mishti
July 26th, 2012, 02:07 PM
vivek, no more discussion, please stop it here, we must stop here before the situation get worst, i never ment what you people think, but anyway it is ok. no reply please

the situation started getting worse from here, and it went on & on......



No body here recommending pakhand but mr Hawa singh, since he has changed his religion, is advocating for sikhism, which is not correct




Brother, sardar (sikh) Hawa singh is there as their rep, participating very actively, muslims representation is also there but I do not want to comment on that, sandeep sorry to come in.


Aade tei Hawa Singh Sangwan ke kai chelle(jo videsho tak felle huai hai) hai jo kise nei bhi kucch nahi likhan dete, yo forum tei highjack kar rakhi hai aur log batmisi pei utaru ho ja sai.


Bhai iska matlab dimaag thare dhore sai baki tei sab phadoo hai..................First look into yourself and then dare to give personal comment. I think this is clear indication to you what I want to convey....................think 1000 times before writing.................jatland is not your personal property.

everybody first calling each-other names, then preaching others and nobody accepting their mistakes
let's see how far it goes........

VirJ
July 26th, 2012, 03:33 PM
I think moderators should interfere and clean the thread up. People from other community read the forum too. Genuine questions can be asked from anyone but personal attack on anyone shouldnt be allowed.

DrRajpalSingh
July 26th, 2012, 11:05 PM
I think moderators should interfere and clean the thread up. People from other community read the forum too. Genuine questions can be asked from anyone but personal attack on anyone shouldnt be allowed.

I second the proposal and endorse the view that instead of discussing persons, posts may be discussed in reasonably sensible and decent manner.

Koi to Laxman Rekha honi hi Chahiya post likhte waqat.

narenderkharb
July 26th, 2012, 11:36 PM
I second the proposal and endorse the view that instead of discussing persons, posts may be discussed in reasonably sensible and decent manner.

Koi to Laxman Rekha honi hi Chahiya post likhte waqat.

Agree with you .

Fateh
July 31st, 2012, 05:32 AM
He is not saying that you have to follow Sikh religion. He is saying about injustice in varna system in Hindu religion. I cannot see anything wrong if this injustice is present. Don't take it as fight between you and shri Hawa Singh ji.


And as I said earlier, Jaat is above religion.

Dear Atish , Anil sangwan, earlier also in many posts it has been recommended by his writer or hawa singh himself, that jats should become sikh, and please read line no 13 and 14 of para 7 of the esssay/heading--18 JAT KAOM SAVDHAN, in the link provided in post no 1, also post no8 and post no 37, no biases, please read with cool, also please give me one example where earlier i was against mr hawa singh,

jaisingh318
August 2nd, 2012, 08:46 PM
Dear Atish , Anil sangwan, earlier also in many posts it has been recommended by his writer or hawa singh himself, that jats should become sikh, and please read line no 13 and 14 of para 7 of the esssay/heading--18 JAT KAOM SAVDHAN, in the link provided in post no 1, also post no8 and post no 37, no biases, please read with cool, also please give me one example where earlier i was against mr hawa singh,

Atish and Anil sangwan - you must reply to this post so that your point of view should also be clear to all of us .

DrRajpalSingh
August 2nd, 2012, 09:50 PM
Friends,

Support is not given on asking but has to be earned through hard labour and clearly defined mission.

Issues not persons, and, ones contribution towards service of the community not personal attainments, would automatically get overwhelming support.

Thanks

jaisingh318
August 2nd, 2012, 10:09 PM
Friends,

Support is not given on asking but has to be earned through hard labour and clearly defined mission.


support is always given to the honest statement .

DrRajpalSingh
August 2nd, 2012, 11:16 PM
support is always given to the honest statement .

Support is always extended to honest statement of purpose well defined as to what for support is sought after!

DrRajpalSingh
August 2nd, 2012, 11:27 PM
the situation started getting worse from here, and it went on & on......

everybody first calling each-other names, then preaching others and nobody accepting their mistakes
let's see how far it goes.......

The matter could be settled if we agree to accept the fact that :
"Even though I do not agree with what you say but I respect your right to free expression of your ideas!"

And

We start discussing posts and not the persons who post them;

also that, disagreeing with someone does not mean opposition, rather it is the very life-breath of a democratic system !

Religion is a personal matter of the individual.

Thanks.

anilsangwan
August 3rd, 2012, 05:12 AM
Atish and Anil sangwan - you must reply to this post so that your point of view should also be clear to all of us .

What reply do you expect dear? Kharab saab has his opinion about it and we have ours.... no fight and it is okay.


But seems you have joined JL only for this thread and topic and more specifically for Mr Kharab. Isn't it? :livid:

vicky84
August 3rd, 2012, 05:25 AM
Our point of view is already clear. I do not think, I need to explain any further. Lets stop this unnecessary feud and move on.

If you have anything to say, please go ahead. No one is stopping you.




Atish and Anil sangwan - you must reply to this post so that your point of view should also be clear to all of us .