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parul
February 13th, 2003, 08:41 PM
Subj: Call to Conscience from American Armed Forces Veterans to Active Duty
Troops and Reservists
Date: 1/14/2003 10:49:12 PM

http://www.calltoconscience.net/

We are veterans of the United States armed
forces. We stand with the majority of humanity,
including millions in our own country, in
opposition to the United States' all out war on
Iraq. We span many wars and eras, have many
political views and we all agree that this war is
wrong. Many of us believed serving in the
military was our duty, and our job was to defend
this country. Our experiences in the military
caused us to question much of what we were
taught. Now we see our REAL duty is to encourage
you as members of the U.S. armed forces to find
out what you are being sent to fight and die for
and what the consequences of your actions will be
for humanity. We call upon you, the active duty
and reservists, to follow your conscience and do
the right thing.

In the last Gulf War, as troops, we were ordered
to murder from a safe distance. We destroyed
much of Iraq from the air, killing hundreds of
thousands, including civilians. We remember the
road to Basraa - the Highway of Death - where we
were ordered to kill fleeing Iraqis. We bulldozed
trenches, burying people alive. The use of
depleted uranium weapons left the battlefields
radioactive. Massive use of pesticides,
experimental drugs, burning chemical weapons
depots and oil fires combined to create a toxic
cocktail affecting both the Iraqi people and Gulf
War veterans today. One in four Gulf War veterans
is disabled.

During the Vietnam War we were ordered to
destroy Vietnam from the air and on the ground.
At My Lai we massacred over 500 women, children
and old men. This was not an aberration, it's
how we fought the war. We used Agent Orange on
the enemy and then experienced first hand its
effects. We know what Post Traumatic Stress
Disorder looks, feels and tastes like because the
ghosts of over two million men, women and
children still haunt our dreams. More of us took
our own lives after returning home than died in
battle.

If you choose to participate in the invasion of
Iraq you will be part of an occupying army. Do
you know what it is like to look into the eyes of
a people that hate you to your core? You should
think about what your mission really is. You are
being sent to invade and occupy a people who,
like you and me, are only trying to live their
lives and raise their kids. They pose no threat
to the United States even though they have a
brutal dictator as their leader. Who is the U.S.
to tell the Iraqi people how to run their country
when many in the U.S. don't even believe their
own President was legally elected?

Saddam is being vilified for gassing his own
people and trying to develop weapons of mass
destruction. However, when Saddam committed his
worst crimes the U.S. was supporting him. This
support included providing the means to produce
chemical and biological weapons. Contrast this
with the horrendous results of the U.S. led
economic sanctions. More than a million Iraqis,
mainly children and infants, have died because of
these sanctions. After having destroyed the
entire infrastructure of their country including
hospitals, electricity generators, and water
treatment plants, the U.S. then, with the
sanctions, stopped the import of goods,
medicines, parts, and chemicals necessary to
restore even the most basic necessities of life.

There is no honor in murder. This war is murder
by another name. When, in an unjust war, an
errant bomb dropped kills a mother and her child
it is not "collateral damage," it is murder.
When, in an unjust war, a child dies of dysentery
because a bomb damaged a sewage treatment plant,
it is not "destroying enemy infrastructure," it
is murder. When, in an unjust war, a father dies
of a heart attack because a bomb disrupted the
phone lines so he could not call an ambulance, it
is not "neutralizing command and control
facilities," it is murder. When, in an unjust
war, a thousand poor farmer conscripts die in a
trench defending a town they have lived in their
whole lives, it is not victory, it is murder.

There will be veterans leading protests against
this war on Iraq and your participation in it.
During the Vietnam War thousands in Vietnam and
in the U.S. refused to follow orders. Many
resisted and rebelled. Many became conscientious
objectors and others went to prison rather than
bear arms against the so-called enemy. During the
last Gulf War many GIs resisted in various ways
and for many different reasons. Many of us came
out of these wars and joined with the anti-war
movement.

If the people of the world are ever to be free,
there must come a time when being a citizen of
the world takes precedence over being the soldier
of a nation. Now is that time. When orders come
to ship out, your response will profoundly impact
the lives of millions of people in the Middle
East and here at home. Your response will help
set the course of our future. You will have
choices all along the way. Your commanders want
you to obey. We urge you to think. We urge you to
make your choices based on your conscience. If
you choose to resist, we will support you and
stand with you because we have come to understand
that our REAL duty is to the people of the world
and to our common future.

Veteran signers as of January 31, 2003:
Ed Armas, Army, 1962-1965
Peter B. AShaw, Marine Corps, 1951-1954
Tarik Aziz, Army, 1970-1975
Niall Aslen, Royal Air Force, 1962-1986
Aram Attarian II, Air Force, 1965-1966
Collin Baber, Air Force, 1994-1998
David E Baker, Army, 1988-1991
Philip L. Bereano, USPHS, 1966-1970
Anton Black, Navy, 1977-1984
Dave Blalock, Army 1968-1971
Michael Blankschen, Army, 1972-1973
David Bledsoe, Air Force, 1987-1997
Louis Block, Army, 1966-1972
Blase Bonpane, Marine Corps Reserve, 1948-1950
Fr. Bob Bossie, SCJ, Air Force, 1955-1959
Don Broadwell, Marine Corps, 1960-1966
Roger W Brown, Marine Corps, 1957-1960
Greg Busby, Air Force, 1980-2000
Rick Campos, Air Force, 1969-1971
William J. Cavanaugh, Army, 1951-1953; Army
Reserve, 1953-1982
Fredy Champagne, Army, 1965-1966
Elwood A. Chirrick, Navy, 1970-1972
Debra J. Clark, Army, 1976-1984
Rockney Compton, Army, 1967-1974
James M. Craven, Army, 1963-1966
Charlotte Critcher, Army, 1964-1971
Carl Dix, Army, 1968-1972
Barry Donnan, British Army, 1987-1993
Pat Driscoll, Navy, 1972-1975
Kenneth Dugan, Navy, 1984-1988
Jake Elkins, Marine Corps, 1965-1969
Marcus Eriksen, Marine Corps, 1985-1991
T. Patrick Foley, Navy, 1997-2000
Dr. Ray Foster, Army, 1972-1975
Lou Fox, Army, 1965
Dean Friend, Marine Corps, 1981-1985
India Mahdi Gamboa, Air Force, 1985-1987
Ernest Goitein, Army, 1943-1945
Jay R Goodman, Army, 1969-1970
Todd Greenwood, Marine Corps, 1993-2001
James F. Harrington, Air Force, 1966-1967
Rev. Richard K. Heacock, Jr., Navy, 1944-1946
Glenn Helkenn, Army, 7 yrs
Dud Hendrick, Air Force, 1963-1967
Rodger Herbst, Army, 1969-1971
Andres Hernandez, Navy Reserve, 1979-1985
John Hockman, Army, 1963-1965
Walter Hrozenchik, Navy, 1951-1955
Eric Edward Johansson, Army, 1989-1992
James Michael Kearney, Army, 1963-1965
Keith Keller, Air Force, 1966-1972
Ron Kovic, Marine Corps, 1964-1968
Robert Krezewinski, Navy, 1973-1977
Marty Kunz, Navy, 1970-1976
Krystal Kyer, Navy, 1993-1997
Neal Liden, Navy, 1965-1969
Mark McCleary, Navy, 1996-2002
Teresa Media, Navy, 1972-1977
Jack Minassian, Army, 1943-1945
Michael Moore, Army, 1975-1979
Paul S. Moorhead, Navy, 1943-1946
Catherine Morris, Marine Corps, 1981-85 & Army
Nat Guard, 1989-96
Paul Pat Morse, Air Force, 1965-1968
Bryan Morrison, Air Force, 1994-1998
Stan Nishimura, Army, 1964-1967
Bruce McFarland, Navy, 1982-1986
Rob Moitoza, Navy, 1965-1971
Dale L. Morgan, Air Force, 1956-1960
David Rees Morgan, British Royal Air Force,
1948-1950
John J. Pagoda, Air Force, 1965-1968 and
1985-1998
Todd A. Papasadero, Army, 1983-1989
John Pappademos, Naval Reserves, 1943-1946
Jeff Paterson, Marine Corps, 1986-1990
Wilson M. Powell, Air Force, 1950-1954
Erwin Rommel, Army, 22 yrs
Randy Rowland, Army, 1967-1970
Rodney A Rylander, Air Force, 1962-1967
Lee Santa, Army, 1965-1968
Nikko Schoch, Army, 1968-1970
Betty R. Scott, Navy, 1943-1945
Charles T. Smith, Army, 1969-1971
John Steinbach, Coast Guard, 1965-1969
Darnell S. Summers, Army, 1966-1970
Thomas Swift, Army, 1953-1955
Harold Taggart, Air Force, 1959-1964
Toby Tahja-Syrett, Army, 1992-1996
Tom Trigg, Army, 1967-1975
Joe Urgo, Air Force, 1967-1968
Gerald Waite, Army, 1967-1982
William H. Warrick III MD, Army Security Agency,
1968-1971
Joel Wendland, Army, 1991-1993
David Wiggins MD, Army, Gulf War
John P. Wirtz, Army, 1943-1946
Mike Wong, Army, 1969-1975
Howard Zinn, Air Force, 1943-1945
.................................................. .............
COMMENTS INVITED..
Parul

parul
February 14th, 2003, 08:13 PM
Comments please..
parul

raj2rif
February 15th, 2003, 06:13 PM
Dea Parul,
I don't agree with the views of the people posted. There are two reasons for that.
Firstly as a soldier: As a soldier, once called upon to duty, one must follow the government order. I find it strange what soldiers of past are telling the current soldiers.
Secondly the subject itself: I don't think this war is wrong. It is against a dictator, who does not mind using any weapon against any one be it his own people or any other country.
If he acquires the WMDs he will black mail every one. We should oppose his emergence as another Hitler.

amitdahiya
February 15th, 2003, 07:56 PM
Dear Parul,
1.The Kurds he attacked and killed by chemical and biologicalweapons look like jats to me. Many turks and Iranians have descrivbed them to me and I can sense that they are indeed jats.

2. Why havent these people posted this communication by including their Service number or their social security no's so that they can prove they are who they say they are.

3. They are promoting something for which there is avery bad word and that word is treason. Because their nation has already declared a war on terrorism and all service men are rquired to serve their country obediently in war.

4.The war on terrorism serves our own national interest wrt pakistan, Korea and the sea of islamic fundamentalism which threatens our own peace and secular muslims as well and believe me there are secular muslims just as there are treasonous Hindus.

5. You would do our web site a serious disservice by promoting this message which i doubt is authentic. It appears to be the work of a disinformation programme of an Islamic intelligence agency which could be of Iraqi, Al Qaeda or most likely the ISI. Lets not espouse this cause in the interest of Kaum, dharam aur desh.

Regards
Amit

Parul (Feb 14, 2003 09:43 a.m.):
Comments please..
parul

parul
February 15th, 2003, 11:08 PM
I happen to be a jat by birth but the more important thing for me is being an human.As far as cross checking is concerned how many time you cross checked what CNN is telling you.( probably you remember how US media was trying to defame Kalpana Chawla..you believed them, did you?).i am not a very experienced person( experience which comes by virtue of age), but I have my own convictions, if you happen to feel that i am doing wrong than can't do anything about it.
Will try to convince you some time in future when i can spare some more time.
Parul
.................................................
for we are all humans,
let us be humane...
...........................................


Amit Dahiya (Delhi) (Feb 15, 2003 09:26 a.m.):
Dear Parul,
1.The Kurds he attacked and killed by chemical and biologicalweapons look like jats to me. Many turks and Iranians have descrivbed them to me and I can sense that they are indeed jats.

2. Why havent these people posted this communication by including their Service number or their social security no's so that they can prove they are who they say they are.

3. They are promoting something for which there is avery bad word and that word is treason. Because their nation has already declared a war on terrorism and all service men are rquired to serve their country obediently in war.

4.The war on terrorism serves our own national interest wrt pakistan, Korea and the sea of islamic fundamentalism which threatens our own peace and secular muslims as well and believe me there are secular muslims just as there are treasonous Hindus.

5. You would do our web site a serious disservice by promoting this message which i doubt is authentic. It appears to be the work of a disinformation programme of an Islamic intelligence agency which could be of Iraqi, Al Qaeda or most likely the ISI. Lets not espouse this cause in the interest of Kaum, dharam aur desh.

Regards
Amit

Parul (Feb 14, 2003 09:43 a.m.):
Comments please..
parul

ravichaudhary
February 16th, 2003, 12:52 AM
[quote]Parul (Feb 15, 2003 12:38 p.m.):

""I happen to be a jat by birth but the more important thing for me is being an human.""
******

Parul have you ever heard of RAWA

here is the URL

http://rawa.fancymarketing.net/women.htm

Do you want our sisters in Afghanistan to go back to those times ??

Ravi

parul
February 16th, 2003, 08:05 AM
In rethinking our history, we are not just looking at the past, but at the present, and trying to look at it from a point of view of those who have been left out of the benefits of so-called civilizations. It is a simple but profoundly important thing we are trying to accomplish,to look at the world from others points of view. We need to do that, as we come into the next century, if we want this coming century to be different, if we want it to be, not an American century, or a Western century, or a white century, or a male century, or any nation's, any group's century, but a century for the human race.
As you all people are talking about treason, its a concept invented by rulers to keep slaves, slaves always.If we will try to justify our actions on the basis well established norms of this society than i doubt anyone would ever be able to bring any significant change.
-parul

ps:ravi, this url is not working, please check.
.................................................. .........
for we are all humans,
let us be humane...
.................................................. ...

ravichaudhary
February 16th, 2003, 08:59 AM
All of us are in agreement with you.


Try

www.rawa.org/

or simply go an internet search for RAWA, afganistan

Ravi

amitdahiya
February 16th, 2003, 02:18 PM
Parul please dont get me wrong but if you insist on misreading my communication then theres nothing I can do about it.
The point I am trying to make here is that in this day and age Communication is not a virtue it is a weapon. When even one of the so called soldirsa and ex sevicemen havent bothered to put down their Id numbers why do you blindly believe this communication. I agree with you that experience comes with age but by sharing each others experiences we are able to save time by repeating all the processes of every experience every time.
Please no one is questioning your motives and integrity here. I think it is a fine example of traditional jat values to stand up for the underdog and to not be afraid to do so alone . So full credit to you for that, but please do not allow your goodness of heart to be exploited in a potentially dangerous situation. It is ok to not be experienced but it is not ok to be naive beyond a point . I hope youunderstand my comment on your important post in its correct intent and context.
Amit


Parul (Feb 15, 2003 12:38 p.m.):
I happen to be a jat by birth but the more important thing for me is being an human.As far as cross checking is concerned how many time you cross checked what CNN is telling you.( probably you remember how US media was trying to defame Kalpana Chawla..you believed them, did you?).i am not a very experienced person( experience which comes by virtue of age), but I have my own convictions, if you happen to feel that i am doing wrong than can't do anything about it.
Will try to convince you some time in future when i can spare some more time.
Parul
.................................................
for we are all humans,
let us be humane...
...........................................


Amit Dahiya (Delhi) (Feb 15, 2003 09:26 a.m.):
Dear Parul,
1.The Kurds he attacked and killed by chemical and biologicalweapons look like jats to me. Many turks and Iranians have descrivbed them to me and I can sense that they are indeed jats.

2. Why havent these people posted this communication by including their Service number or their social security no's so that they can prove they are who they say they are.

3. They are promoting something for which there is avery bad word and that word is treason. Because their nation has already declared a war on terrorism and all service men are rquired to serve their country obediently in war.

4.The war on terrorism serves our own national interest wrt pakistan, Korea and the sea of islamic fundamentalism which threatens our own peace and secular muslims as well and believe me there are secular muslims just as there are treasonous Hindus.

5. You would do our web site a serious disservice by promoting this message which i doubt is authentic. It appears to be the work of a disinformation programme of an Islamic intelligence agency which could be of Iraqi, Al Qaeda or most likely the ISI. Lets not espouse this cause in the interest of Kaum, dharam aur desh.

Regards
Amit

Parul (Feb 14, 2003 09:43 a.m.):
Comments please..
parul