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lrburdak
May 3rd, 2003, 01:20 PM
Jats find mention in the Bible. While searching for religious book edda of Scandinavia I found an article on the URL-http://www.ucg.org/brp/materials/throne/appendices/ap13.html
on the subject The Throne of Britain: Its Biblical Origin and Future
Apppendices -
Appendix 13: The Nobility—Also Jewish
It is of inerest to all jat members so I am reproducing bellow for reading.
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The Bible records that two decades after the fall of Samaria, during the reign of Judah’s king Hezekiah, the Assyrian emperor Sennacherib invaded the Jewish nation. Notice these words of Sennacherib, inscribed on his famous hexagonal clay prism: "But as for Hezekiah, the Jew, who did not bow in submission to my yoke, forty-six of his strong walled towns and innumerable smaller villages in their neighborhood I besieged and conquered . . . I made to come out from them 200,150 people, young and old, male and female . . . and counted them as the spoils of war" ("Sennacherib’s Prism," Eerdmans Handbook to the Bible, 1983, p. 280).

Judah was a nation of Judahites (Jews), Benjamites and Levites. Thus it appears that a large number of these tribal groups were added to the captivity of the northern Israelites—who were at this time located in Assyria and Armenia in the west and Media and Persia in the east. It seems likely that the Jewish captives were taken to these same areas.

Author Stephen Collins notes: "When describing the Sacae Scythian tribes who migrated out of Asia in the second century B.C. [previously captive Israelites—descendants of Isaac], George Rawlinson notes that the greatest tribe, the Massagetae, was also named the ‘great Jits, or Jats’ ["Jats," The Sixth Oriental Monarchy, 1872, Vol. 11, p. 357] . . . The term ‘Jat’ has survived as a caste-name in Northwest India [which bordered Persia and Parthia] into modern times, attesting to the ancient dominance of the Jats in that region" (The "Lost" Tribes of Israel . . . Found, 1992, 1995, p. 343).

This name could conceivably be a contraction of Judahite (Hebrew Yehudi, which perhaps became Jehuti (we’ll see more about phonetic shift in language in a moment). However, it should be pointed out that "Jat" designates the peasant caste of northern India and Pakistan ("Jat," Encyclopaedia Britannica, Micropaedia, 1985, Vol. 6, p. 510). Yet that could be because the Jews came to the area as slaves. Or, perhaps more likely, because later conquerors subjugated the Jats and made themselves the upper caste.

Jat may even have initially meant highborn. In a separate article, the Encyclopaedia Britannica states: "Jati, also spelled jat, in India, a Hindu caste. The term is derived from the Sanskrit jata, ‘born’ or ‘brought into existence,’ and indicates a form of existence determined by birth. In Indian philosophy jati (genus) describes any group of things that have generic characteristics in common. Sociologically, jati has come to be used universally to indicate a caste group [in general] within Hindu society" ("Jati," p. 511). Perhaps the notion of Jews as nobility is where the concept of Jat as applied to birth and caste actually began.

It is possible that these people were related to a group known as the Yueh-chih. Says the Encyclopaedia Britannica: "Yueh-chih, also called Indo-Scyths, ancient people who ruled in Bactria (now Afghanistan) and India from c. 128 BC to c. AD 450. The Yueh-chih are first mentioned in Chinese sources at the beginning of the 2nd century BC as nomads living in . . . northwest China . . . They and related tribes are the Asi (or Asiani) and Tocharians (Tochari) of Western sources" ("Yueh-chih," Vol. 12, p. 869). And the Asi may well be the Aser of the Norse sagas (again, see Appendix 10: "The Family of Odin").

In the same article the Britannica says: "The Hephthalites . . . [were] originally a Yueh-chih tribe." They were also known as the "White Huns" and their names are sometimes given as "Nephthalites" (compare "Ephthalites, or White Huns," Encyclopaedia Britannica, 11th Edition, on-line at 89.1911encyclopedia.org/E/EP/EPHTHALITES.htm)—likely, as Collins points out, a derivation of the Israelite tribe of Naphtali (p. 237). If the name Yueh-chih perhaps derives from Judah or Yehudah, then the description of Naphtali as a Yueh-chih tribe could possibly indicate that the Jews were dispersed throughout the other tribes as leaders in their migrations.

lrburdak
May 3rd, 2003, 05:12 PM
Here is an interestng article on the URL -http://www.mmedia.is/odsman/knowntheories.shtml
which provides links between ancient India and Icelandic countries.This may prove useful to find the origin of jats.
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Dr.Keshava Deva Shastri from Benares, India, president for International Congress of Religious Philosophies (San Francisco, California, 1915) stated that the forefathers of the Scandinavian people came directly from India under the leadership of Óðinn (Odinn) about 5500 years BC - He says between Ramanaya (as its influence shows) and Mahabharata (of which no trace is found here in the North).
Here below are listed some of his quoted Sanskrit words directly to be found in Icelandic and in the myths, culture and sacred texts of ásatrú (asatru):
Veda (Edda); Skand nabia (Scandinavia); Asigarh (Ásgarður); Jyotirheim (Jötunheimar); Gurudham (Goðheimar); Uttragard (Útgarðar); Medhgard (Miðgarður); vala, bala (vala); Gargya (Grágás); Lokreta (Lögrétta); Baut-sthan (bautasteinn); etc.,etc.,

The following Icelandic words are claimed to have come directly from Sanskrit:
Óðinn (Odinn), Huginn, Muninn, Ásgarður (Asgardur), Miðgarður (Midgardur), Grágás (Gragas), Útgarður (Utgardur), Jötunheimar (jotunheimar), R*gur (* R*gsþulu; Rigur), vala (völva; volva), Alfaðir (alfadir, Ymir, Gautur, hlautbolli, Lögrétta (Logretta), Æsir (aesir), Auðumbla (Audumbla), Ægir (Aegir), Baldur, brynja, Edda, faðir (fadir), bróðir (brodir), móðir (modir; these last ones to be found in most Indo-European languages), kvæði (kvaedi), bautasteinn, Skaði (Skadi), Skandinav*a (Skandinavia), Ymir, Vani.
Óðsmál (Odsmal) is meant to promote research in etymology, as we know there is a lot of Sanskrit words in Icelandic, and this tells us a lot. Óðinn (Odinn) is from Sanskrit yodhin (conqueror, warrior), Huginn and Muninn (Odin's two ravens) from Sanskrit yogin and muni, Edda from Veda, asman is hammer, Thor's hammer, Sanskrit asigarh is Ásgarður (Asgardur).



Dr. C.A.Holboe, wrote extraordinary articles in 1846-1852 on etymology and on the striking resemblance between Sanskrit and Icelandic grammar.
For some reason or other this aspect of the cultural inheritance - the Eddas and the northern myths - is always left out when it comes to the educational system in Iceland. That we must remedy.
Det norske Sprogs væsentligste Ordforraad, sammenlignet med Sanskrit og andre Sprog af samme Æt : bidrag til en norsk etymologisk Ordbog, Holmboe, C.A., Wien, 1852, Det odlnorske Verbum, oplyst ved Sammenligning med Sanskrit og andre Sprog af samme Æt., Holmeboe. C.A., Christiania 1848, Sanskrit og oldnorsk : en sprogsammenlignende afhandling / af C.A. Holboe, Christiania: Fabritius, 1846. And there are other thesises too on the corresponding concepts in Sanskrit and Iclandic.

Óðsmál (Odsmal) is meant to promote research in ethnology, as Grýla (Gryla) might be Gerður (Gerdur) from Sk*rnismál (Skirnismal in the Edda), jólasveinar (jolasveinar, yule-boys; julenisse) might be our ancestors in disguise, as they are said to steal food in Iceland. But that actually might have been prohibited food-giving to reverent ancestors.
regards,

mbamal
May 3rd, 2003, 05:14 PM
Very interesting...it represents a totally new viewpoint on the history and origin of Jats...

ravichaudhary
May 4th, 2003, 08:53 AM
Luxman

The Jews are semities in culture and tradition.

I would go easy on the Jew, Judah, Jadu, Jatu connection.

Who is collins ??

Ravi

lrburdak
May 5th, 2003, 05:00 PM
There is one book on line which tells how Bible mentions the movement of tribes from Isriel to different parts in the world. It is-The USA & British Commonwealth in Bible Prophecy by Peter Saleni. See on the URL-
http://www.british-israel.ca.
For members the part which deals with Jats is given bellow-
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What about the Jutes? They are part of the Saxons as well. But where did this name "Jute" come from? Remember Sennacherib took 200,000 Jews captive in an invasion of Judah, see 2 Kings 18:13, and took the fortified citites. These people were called Jews NATIONALLY, because they were part of the kingdom of Judah. Then the name got corrupted to "Jute." These people in the fortified citites as we have proved were the people of the northern kingdom of ISRAEL, primarily of Ephraim and Manasseh. Stephen Collins writes about the Jutes: "As the Saxons migrated into Europe, and the British-Isles, they were closely allied iwth the Jutes...The Jutes left their names (Juteland) on the Danish Penninsula...we find them closely identified with the Sacae [Ephraim and Manasseh] (who became Saxons)...George Rawlinson notes that the greatest tribe, the Massagatae [Manasseh], was also named the 'great Jits,' or 'Jats'...the Massagatae tribe Sacae were mostly of the Israelite tribe of Manasseh...one tribe retained the Indo-Scythian tern 'Jat' and became Known as the 'Jutes'''(LTTF, pp.343-344, emphasis added).

ravichaudhary
May 6th, 2003, 07:16 PM
[quote]Laxman Burdak (May 05, 2003 07:30 a.m.):
There is one book on line which tells how Bible mentions the movement of tribes from Isriel to different parts in the world.

pint you to three discussion groups, which are discussing the Jutes, Geats, gothic connections.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Germanic-L/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gothic-l/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/


The Jewish connection I have read on the Internet on line book.

The connection at first glance seems tempting, but it stops there.

The Jewish tradition is the search for the lost 10 tribes of Israel am, and some amateur had made a Jud, JUT, Jat connection.

There own traditions also have “ found” a tribe in Nagaland, who are one of the l0 ” lost tribes as they:”Follow Jewish” customs.

The Jews have also engaged in extensive DNA studies, nowhere do those studies point a Jat connection.

North of the middle east, going upto the Serbia, Russia, Poland, many rulers and their people had taken to the Jewish faith, and they form the “ white European Jews, It would be reasonable to infer that as these were first Jat/ Getic/gothic lands some took to the Jewish faith.

THe faith originates in what is now Iraq, to Palestine. It is the Abrahmaic faith, from which emanate the Jewish, Christian, and the Islamic tradition.

Unless someone can show the Jats originating from Palestine, the alleged connection does not hold any water.

Again who is Stephen Collins?

One must be careful with Internet chatter, and not accept it simply because is written enticingly, with a bit of jargon thrown in.

I am not against any connection, but must be shown something scientifically.

Ravi

smalik
May 6th, 2003, 07:27 PM
laxmanji,
where were you last month , I think you were not on this site!! every thing fine?????

lrburdak
May 7th, 2003, 04:26 PM
Sanjay ji, I was out of net access on tour to Rajasthan.
Ravi ji, I tried to find out about author Stphen Collins. But I could nat get details but his name comes in relation with correlation of Jews, Jutes and Jats on following URL-
http://www.british-israel.ca
http://www.ucg.org/brp/materials/throne/appendices/ap13.html

I have gone through an article in Jat Samaj( Hindi), August 1997 by shri Kishori Lal Faujdar which also mentions the relationship of Jats and Bible.The article indicates -Julit nam ka ek jat pahalwan jat shahar ka rahane wala tha jisko philasti pahalwan bhi bataya gaya hai. Israel se yudh karane ke liye aaya tha....jat aur philisti ek hi cheej hai. Iske sath mein aage ankit jat itihas ka vivran bhi padhana chahiye jo Syria ke jaton ke aparichit hone ke sambandh mein ankit hai. yah vivran jat Itihas lekhak Chaudhari Ram Lal Hala mein ankit hai.
....Jaton ne Bharat se jakar aakramankari ke roop mein Syria mein apna rajya sthapit kiya tha. unki rajdhani jat namak nagar mein thi. Jaton ko Israeli log aparichit tatha vidharmi kahate the aur dono jation ke makhood(poojaniye Dev) alag-alag the. Jaton ke poojya dev ka nam bible mukddas mein dujoon aaya hua hai, jo dvij shabd ka apbhrans hai. Dvij mukhya taya brahmanon ko kahate hain jisko arya poojaniye manate hain. yahi ek shabd jaton ke bharatiye hone par bahut kuchh prakash dal deta hai. bible mukddas mein bani Israel aur jaton ke paraspar bahut se yudhon ka varnan kiya hai.......
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Rajiv ji a detailed study is needed to find the origin of jats.
regards,

lrburdak
May 8th, 2003, 12:16 PM
To find out more information about Jats and Bible I came to know about a group on line on the URL-
http://www.joshuaproject.net
On the above site we find JOSHUA PROJECT II the objective of which is to high light the peoples of world who have the least exposure to the gospel of jesus christ, by sharing information & networking. This group has also included Jats in the countries Ukraine(language-jatali,population32000) Moldove(language-jakati,population-156000) and Pakistan(language-jadgali,population-10000). The study also gives the location of this population group,their affinity block has been shown as Indo Iranian or Indo-Aryans of S-Asia. They have given % of christian population out of them(which is very less).
This may be useful for us how these Jats reached there?