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lrburdak
April 6th, 2004, 08:36 PM
It has been proved that sanskrit is one of the oldest language. Jats were mainly Aryan people who knew sanskrit language. They lived in the “sapt sandhav” the main home land of Aryans. Jats were first to develope agriculture. The evidences of agriculture in India have been found as back as 10000 b.c. Prof. P.Kawk writes that after Mahabharat war a large number of sanskrit knowing people moved to countries of Europe, America and settled there. There are various referrences in Jain and Budhist literature that Indians especially Jats moved to Asia, Europe, America, China, Burma, Egypt etc. According to Hukam Singh, B-blood group in Europe was carried by Jats from India. Jats when moved from India to other countries, they carried with them sanskrit literature like Vedas, Puranas, Mahabharat etc. They named various countries after their RISHIs. Some of examples are narrated below:-
1. AMERICA:- Named after sanskrit word AMBERISH. America was founded by Amberish Jat. It was also known as Patal-lok in Mahabharat period. Bhagwan Krishna was known to visit Patal-lok to find son of his guru sandip. Mexican people were ajtak who are jat. Mexican people worship Ganesha.
2. AUSTRALIA:- Named after sanskrit word ASTRALAY. The land was used for testing various kinds of astras used in Mahabharat. That is why the land has become desert.
3. BABILONIA:- Named after sanskrit word BAVOLIN. It was founded by Yaduvansi Jat king Bahupal.
4. BALOCHISTAN:- Named after sanskrit word BALOCH. It is also inhabited by Biloch gotra jats. These were very powerful people hence called BALOCH.
5. CANADA:- Named after sanskrit word KANAD. It was land of Kanad Rishi. Dahiya, Sangwan, Dalal, Chauhan etc. gotra jats are found in Canada.
6. DENMARK:- Named after sanskrit word DENMARG. It is said to have been founded by Jats.
7. DUESTSCHLAND:- Named after sanskrit word DAITYASTAN. It was considered to be the land of Daityas.
8. EGYPT:- It is also called MISRA. Named after sanskrit word MAHARISHI. It was developed by Maharishi Jemini.
9. FRANCE:- It is also called GAUL. Named after sanskrit word GALAV. It was the land of Galav Rishi.
10. GERMANY:- Named after sanskrit word JANMAJAY. It was land of Jat king Janmajay.
11. HUNGARY:- Named after sanskrit word SHRANGARY. The land is called Shrangary due to presence of jungles,rivers and springs.
12. ISRAEL:- Named after sanskrit word ISHWARALAY. It is the land of Jews and birth place of Judaism and Chritianity. One of the theory relates Jats to Jews.
13. JORDAN:- Named after sanskrit word JANARDAN. Janardan is the name of Bhagwan Krishan.
14. KANDHAR:- Named after sanskrit word GANDHAR. It was founded after Gandhari, who was wife of Dhritrashtra.
15. MALI/SUMALI:- Named after sanskrit words MALI/SUMALI who were members of Rawan family.
16. NORWAY:- Named after sanskrit word NARAK.The country has got ‘JUTLAND’ inhabited by jats
17. PALASTINE:- Named after sanskrit word PULASTIN. It was the land of Pulashy Rishi.
18. PARSIA:- Named after sanskrit word PRA-RISHIY. The Pradesh near Rishiy land.
19. RUSSIA:- Named after sanskrit word RISHIY. It was the land of large number of Rishis.
20. SCANDINAVIA:- Named after sanskrit word SKANDNAMI. Skand was name of one in Shiva’s family. Skandnami in sanskrit means ‘chief soldier’. Jats used to be the chief soldiers.
21. SIBERIA:- Named after sanskrit word SHIVIRIY.Due to snow cover there used to be temporary camps of Rishis, meaning SHIVIR in sanskrit.
22. SWEDEN:- Named after sanskrit word SWARG. It was place like heaven.
23. SYRIA:- Named after sanskrit word ASHURYA. Bhagwan Krishan is said to have visited this land.
24. TURKEY:- Named after sanskrit word TURUSHK.Turushkas were Aryans.It was founded by Tank and Tunwar gotra Jats.

anujkumar
April 7th, 2004, 12:52 PM
Quite heavy stuff.

biotechs2001
April 7th, 2004, 02:17 PM
Laxman Burdak Ji
very nice information.
Thanks.

bnashier
April 7th, 2004, 03:39 PM
I have only one question.

I can visualize move from India to any country connected by land. How did they move from India to the Americas (US, Canada, etc)? We are talking about a period some 5-10 thousand years ago. Just curious!

rajendersingh
April 7th, 2004, 09:07 PM
dear laxaman ji namaskar,
thanks for the information.
here i will suggest all jats to read dr hukam singh on jat history... its a great book.

dr budhji,
your point is very valid , but we all have\had heard or read ramayana and mahabharta. agreed the difference is names only other wise u name a weapon or vehicle or any thing which america has today and it has not been mentioned in those epics? we all know these are very much there.

i am not at all surperised how dr budh from a village in sonipat reached to america.
just think for a while there whould have been a country or area much more developed than today's america and must had influenced the world in much bigger way than today's america.

rkumar
April 7th, 2004, 10:05 PM
Budh Nashier (Apr 07, 2004 06:09 a.m.):
I have only one question.

I can visualize move from India to any country connected by land. How did they move from India to the Americas (US, Canada, etc)? We are talking about a period some 5-10 thousand years ago. Just curious!

Budh ji,

Man has been moving around the globe over millions of years. During Ice age it wqas not so difficult to walk over the sea which got frozen. Then we had this continental drift...Even there are records that its was not the Columbus who went first to america, but it were the scandevevians who went via today's Greenland to Canada and then lower down to other parts...

Regards
Rajendra

biotechs2001
April 10th, 2004, 08:02 PM
Dear Rajender and Rajendra Ji
I am 100% agree what you said. Recently British Journal of Medicine (BMJ), an internally well know journal in field of medical science wrote in the 3rd April issue about “Hindu mythology and medicine”, of Mahabharatha time. Just read here the link:-

http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/328/7443/819

biotechs2001
April 10th, 2004, 08:25 PM
Read here the quotations of great Western scientists and philosophers about scientific knowledge and achievements of ancient Indians, instead of doubting their abilities about petty things like travelling and transportation.
Louis Jacolliot (1837-1890), French wrote: - "The Hindu revelation, which proclaims the slow and gradual formation of worlds, is of all revelations the only one whose ideas are in complete harmony with modern science. “
Marquis Pierre Laplace ( 1749-1827) French mathematician, philosopher, and astronomer
"Nevertheless the ancient reputation of the Indians does not permit us to doubt that they have always cultivated astronomy, and the remarkable exactness of the mean motions which they assign to the Sun and the Moon necessarily required very ancient observation."
Jean-Sylvain Baily, (1736–93) French astronomer, said in his book, Essai sur la théorie des satellites de Jupiter :
"The movement of stars which was calculated by Hindus 4,500 years ago, does not differ even by a minute from the tables which we are using today." And he concludes: "The Hindu systems of astronomy are much more ancient than those of the Egyptians - even the Jews derived from the Hindus their knowledge."

Lord Warren Hastings (1754-1826), was the first governor general of British India
"The writers of the Indian philosophies will survive, when the British dominion in India shall long have ceased to exist, and when the sources which it yielded of wealth and power are lost to remembrances."
Sir John Woodroffe:- "To the philosophers of India, however, Relativity is no new discovery, just as the concept of light years is no matter for astonishment to people used to thinking of time in millions of kalpas, (A kalpa is about 4,320,000 years). The fact that the wise men of India have not been concerned with technological applications of this knowledge arises from the circumstance that technology is but one of innumerable ways of applying it."
Dick Teresi wrote in his book Lost Discoveries:
Twenty-four centuries before Isaac Newton, the Hindu Rig-Veda asserted that gravitation held the universe together. The Sanskrit speaking Aryans subscribed to the idea of a spherical earth in an era when the Greeks believed in a flat one. The Indians of the fifth century A.D. calculated the age of the earth as 4.3 billion years; scientists in 19th century England were convinced it was 100 million years."

Louis Jacolliot (1837-1890), in his masterpiece, La Bible dans l'Inde, about origin of life :-
' The first germ of life was developed by water and heat.' (Manusmriti - Book I, sloka 8,9)
' Water ascends towards the sky in vapors; from the sun it descends in rain, from the rains are born the plants, and from the plants, animals.' (Manusmriti - Book III, sloka 76)

Thomas Henry Huxley (1825-1895) physiologist, anatomist, anthropologist, agnostic, educator, distinguished zoologist and advocate of Darwinism, the following quotations from his work, Collected Essays vol. VI, serve to show how much ancient Indian philosophy anticipated modern Western thought.

Dr. J. Robert Oppenheimer, (1904-1967) Scientist, physicist and the Supervising Scientist Manhattan Project, the developer of the atomic bomb and who was familiar with ancient Sanskrit literature.

described the thoughts that passed through his mind when he witnessed the first atomic test explosion.

"Of a thousand suns in the sky if suddenly should burst forth the light, it would be like unto the light of that Exalted One. (Bhagvad Gita XI,12)
" Death am I, cause of destruction of the worlds, matured and set out to gather in the worlds there" (Bhagvad Gita XI 32)

During his lecture at Rochester University a student asked a question to which Oppenheimer gave a strangely qualified answer:.

Student: Was the bomb exploded at Alamogordo during the Manhattan Project the first one to be detonated?

Dr. Oppenheimer: "Well -- yes. In modern times, of course.

ravichaudhary
April 10th, 2004, 08:57 PM
We must try not to let our imagination run totally away with us.

The Gita is a spiritual book,

and the explosion of light could be symbolic, of enlightenment, moksha. to which the light of a thousand suns could be compared, but would still fall short

Ravi

rkumar
April 10th, 2004, 09:46 PM
Ravi Chaudhary (Apr 10, 2004 11:27 a.m.):
We must try not to let our imagination run totally away with us.

The Gita is a spiritual book,

and the explosion of light could be symbolic, of enlightenment, moksha. to which the light of a thousand suns could be compared, but would still fall short

Ravi

Well well... Ravi you are talking like a typical historian who believes only what the eye sees. Historians are to me like stenographers who just record the events based upon what is dictated and what is there as source to prove. Philosophy is a writen menifestation of the development of man's mind. Mind does not think in vacuum. All its thinking is based upon some real inputs. Philosophers often write the obvious in a way which a common man won't understand.. A good historian will be who will take hints from these so called wild imaginations and look for some proof... Being a physicist I can tell you one thing that based upon the perceptions of mind people drew equations about many things and which were discovred year later. Here are few examples;

1. Positron was predicted by Dirac in Fermi Dirac equations and was discovered many years later..
2. In theory of relativity Einstein said that light photons have weight. This could be proved only when scientist could observe the light path bending near very heavy stars..

There are so many such things in science. We all look only for things which we can comprehend. This does not mean that these things do not exist.

Rajendra

rkumar
April 10th, 2004, 10:04 PM
Dear Burdak ji,

I wish to differ with you. Almost all names in this world can be made to look drived from Sanskrit. This does not mean that Indians went there and lived. Linguistic similarity is only one very small basis to look for such linkage. I will give you some examples;

1. Rajendra sounds very similar to Alaxendra .. Do I take that I am of Greek origin or should I take that Alaxendra was of Indian Origin?

2. Names of countries are not universal and they are called differently in differnt countries. India is called Inde in many Europian countries, where as in India it was never the name before British came.

3. In all our religious books India is still called Jamboo Dweep and which we know that its not a Dweep for millions of years. It was dweep only before colliding with Asiatic mass. I do not know where from the word Jamboo came...and who used this word; the people on the so called Jamboo Dweep or the outsiders..

I personally feel that Sanskrit being one of the oldest language, has many similarities with other old languages and many names sounds similar. Using same language does not mean the people who speak it, belong to same ethnic groups.

Yes I agree, Jats had a major influence on world events. However, not as large as being projected..

One thing which really bothers me is that if we have been so great all along the histrorical times and pre-historical times, why have we degraded to the level that we feel proud of being grouped as OBC ? Where did we loose faith in our capabilities and greatness? Were we so useless that others could install a feeling of inferiority among us? If we have been such great warriors, how come that we lost control on the affairs of the world? Or is it just that anything which rises, has to come down?

Rajendra

ravichaudhary
April 11th, 2004, 02:57 AM
Rajendra Kumar Kalkhunde (Apr 10, 2004 12:16 p.m.):
[quote]Ravi Chaudhary (Apr 10, 2004 11:27 a.m.):
We must try not to let our imagination run totally away with us.

The Gita is a spiritual book,

and the explosion of light could be symbolic, of enlightenment, moksha. to which the light of a thousand suns could be compared, but would still fall short

Ravi

Well well... Ravi you are talking like a typical historian who believes only what the eye sees. Historians are to me like stenographers who just record the events based upon what is dictated and what is there as source to prove


******************

Dear Rajendra

Thank you for the feedback.

Here is a translation of the relevant stanzas of the Gita.

Chapter 11.

The opening stanza speaks of spirituality/ illusions.

Stanza 11 .10.11

The next speaks of the universal form of the Lord

Stanza 12 , the one quoted for an atom bomb, actually says"

"If hundreds of thousands of suns were to rise at once into the sky, their radiance might resemble the effulgence of the Supreme Person in that universal form."

Stanza 32, talks of Time, as the destroyer.


Now , no disrespect, but if someone wishes to see atomic warfare in all this, could they not be mistaken ?.

A physicist, is a scientist, and is bound by certain rules of scientific enquiry.

Conceptualizing, theorizing, even far out conceptualizing is essential. Physicists are very prone to this. Being one too I should know.

Yet the concept must also be modified with evidence as it unfolds.

Thus Burdakji's conceptualization and postulating a theory is acceptable to me. He may be right or totally wrong.

He as a true scientist/ historian will also have to change his theory to adapt to the evidence.

I disagree with his postulations on the place names .Too much reliance on similar sounding words. No backup evidence. They will not stand in a public forum

I am glad he has posted his views, and I wish many more do so too even if they turn out to be a bit off the mark.

Mine usually/often are

And one of the purposes of this closed list is , as I see, just that. To allow people to post their thoughts in a non threatening environment and test them.

That the participation level here has jumped, is a source of immense pleasure to me.

Learning and clarity will come.

we have onlyjust begun to resconstruct our history

We urgently need people who know Sanskrit, Pali, Brahmi and more importantly , are willing to help.


We need original inscriptions re- translated from a Jat perspective


Ravi

See :

http://bhagavadgitaasitis.com/11/


BG 11.1: Arjuna said: By my hearing the instructions You have kindly given me about these most confidential spiritual subjects, my illusion has now been dispelled

*****************
BG 11.10-11: Arjuna saw in that universal form unlimited mouths, unlimited eyes, unlimited wonderful visions. The form was decorated with many celestial ornaments and bore many divine upraised weapons. He wore celestial garlands and garments, and many divine scents were smeared over His body. All was wondrous, brilliant, unlimited, all-expanding.

BG 11.12: If hundreds of thousands of suns were to rise at once into the sky, their radiance might resemble the effulgence of the Supreme Person in that universal form.

BG 11.13: At that time Arjuna could see in the universal form of the Lord the unlimited expansions of the universe situated in one place although divided into many, many thousands.

**********************
BG 11.32: The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: Time I am, the great destroyer of the worlds, and I have come here to destroy all people. With the exception of you [the Pāṇḍavas], all the soldiers here on both sides will be slain.


.

uday
April 11th, 2004, 11:19 PM
Mere Pyare Bhaiyoon !!

Jo tha.. Vo tha..
Jo ho gaya so ho gaya...
If we get old history changged as desired... will that effect today's life of JAT'S.


To get corrected your past first emphasize your present...

PRESENT REFLECTED VALUES of JAT kaum will matters when we ask to the govt.\ existing diluted- non diluted historians or any bla..bla.. for a changed past in history.

Believe in present & serve your kaum.

Aadar Sahit.
Stay Tuned
Uday

rajendersingh
April 12th, 2004, 11:20 AM
dear uday,
sermons r o k,but may god help u to be more judicious in showering these words on these little poor creaters of the jatland.
thanks.

ravichaudhary
April 13th, 2004, 01:45 AM
[quote]Uday Dahiya (Apr 11, 2004 01:49 p.m.):


If we get old history changged as desired... will that effect today's life of JAT'S.

******************

Dear Uday,


We are not asking for History to be changed.

All we are asking for is that the Jats be given their due recognition and the erroneous history that is propagated today is changed.

and yes, if the version is corrected, today's Jats will have a different feeling/outloook about themselves- increased self esteem for one.

It is one thing for a child to go to school and be taught that Jats are Vagabonds and looteras, and good for nothing, junglee, rustic, peasants.

Another for the Child to be taught

1) that Harshvardhan , Chandragupta Maurya, the second Guptas( Dharans) were Jats.

2) that the Sarv Khap of Haryana, was a mighty republic, and our ancestors kept our people and all who lived there safe from invaders of all kinds (including Timur). If they had not, we would all be Muslims, or Serfs to the Rajput thakur.

3) the Jats were philosophers and sants- Sant Ganga Das, Sant Nischal Das , Swami Omanand, for starters.

Our Jat children need role models.

Today many Jats have a low self esteem, and are falling behind economically and socially.

For most of us the only History we ever learn, is what we are taught in school, and that too upto Grade 9, and that is what shapes our identity.

Do you still think it would not make a difference. as to what version of History our children are taught in School?

I do not mean to be personal, but please reflect on what you learnt about the history and culture of the Jats in your school days.

If you wish to share some reflections please do so.

Feedback please ?


Ravi

lrburdak
April 28th, 2004, 02:01 PM
Thanks all
One curiosity raised by Budh ji is very important. How people moved from India to far off places not connected by land. In our Indian mythology we find existence of VIMAN. There is one BRAHD VIMAN SANHITA. It all can not be imaginary. It indicates existence of a developed technology.
The english word NAVIGATION is derived from sanskrit word NAV. We find mention of NAV and NAVIK in our mythology books.This shows that we were very advance in technology of NAVIGATION.
regards,

sejwal
May 12th, 2004, 05:14 PM
Anuj Kumar (Apr 07, 2004 03:22 a.m.):
Quite heavy stuff.

Very important and interesting information

lrburdak
May 15th, 2004, 05:56 PM
Rajendra ji,
You will believe that the origin of name Rajendra is from sanskrit. In the name Alexandra also you can find INDRA which is common in both names. INDRA is considered to be the God of rains by Aryans. Hence RAJENDRA and ALEXANDRA both names have been derived from sanskrit.
Krisna Kumar ji and Raviji,thanks for your contribution.Here is some feed back on place of jats in school history books.

During my studies I never found mention about Jats in history books taught in schools.
In one of my daughter’s history book in seventh class I found mention about jats as a rebellion caste. It was with reference to Royal Jat family of Bharatpur state.
In one of another history book approved by NCERT India, taught in schools, run by CBSE jats have been mentioned as tribes of north India. If this is the situation in India even after 56 years of independence and we are still not demanding a right place in history, it is shame on our part.
I am from Rajasthan’s so called jat-belt where no body knows about history of jats. We have been always ignored by nexus of Brahmans and Rajputs.
No body has given right place to any caste except their own caste. History has always been biased. It is the right time to correct the history. Jat politicians and intellectuals need to come forward for this.
The facts given in my thread about contribution of jats are not imaginary. I have studied in literature about jats which can be discussed. There is always scope for improvement.
Jats have been forced not to let them study Sanskrit during preindependence period.
Solution of jat related history problems can be found through research in Sanskrit literature of the period prior to 7th century when Brahman-rajput nexus came in to existence.
We have been forced time and again in history to follow what brahmans and rajputs forced on us. It is high time to bring back the pride of jats.