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haryanajat
July 19th, 2005, 04:43 AM
1. Cricket - this game has become like a drug addiction in India.
2. The Usual Suspects - climate which has affected physique , politics and its judwa brother - corruption, bad or no/little sport facilities, lack of good coaches, lack of proper training, lack of sports equipment, not keeping up with ever developing skills in sports (lots of countries have caught up with India in field hockey).
3. Diet - could it be that lack of protein found in meat has played a part in our physique which usually is skinny/average (may be except that of jats on average). May be lack of aggressiveness could be attributed to eating habits?
May be its just genetics - black people dominate so many sports specially that require quickness(speed). For example India's 100m national record in track running is 10.5/10.3 seconds? but in USA/Uk even a black high school teenager can run faster then that. And there are lots of them that can do that.
4. Lack of Professional Sports Leagues - like they have in US/UK/Canada/australia/other countries.
5. As most people are poor they are too pre-occupied surviving from day to day rather then play sports.
What could be other reasons?

Let us take a look at wrestling(specially freestyle) which can be called as India's traditional sport. India has won 1 bronze medal in olympics wrestling(1952) - Keshav Jadhav(a marathi). Other then that there is nothing to show. It's true India wins medals in commonwealth and asian games but the true test is olympics. Iran, Russia, USA, Cuba, Japan, turkey are the countries to beat and India is not upto their level.

One country that amazes me is australia - a country of 20 million (?) people. It has got so many high calibre players in most international sports. May be some of that could be attributed to aussies being an outdoors loving people.
Has someone heard of aussies playing cricket with a bottle of beer in 1 hand and the cricket bat in other? haha. That is great!! :D

singhkapoor
July 19th, 2005, 05:15 PM
Dear Jeetendra

You have listed most of the factors that contribute to India’s poor showing in the international sports arena. For the sake of better organization of thoughts, let us discuss one at a time. I will start with two most important factors:

Diet:
I don’t believe vegetarian food habits have anything to do with aggressiveness or lack thereof.
Theorists might say that meat eaters are generally more aggressive whereas vegetarians are relatively passive. I find these theories irrelevant in the context of sports. In my opinion the kind of aggressiveness required to be a champion is not the same as that found in a criminal / murderer. A world champion doesn’t have to be a belligerent, combative or hostile person in his social life; he just has to have enough desire and motivation. Killer’s instinct, the commonly used term to define the most important trait of a champion’s personality, is not to be interpreted literally. I define this term as the ability to endure pain (during practice as well as competition) and not the ability to inflict pain on others (boxing seems to be an exception). The difference between a champion and fourth place finisher is the will power (of course, we can't discount the luck factor...but I believe in the theory that the harder you work, the luckier you get)….and at the highest level it is more mental than physical. Mental toughness can be improved with a systematic approach.

As for actual food value of your diet (read protein content et al) you can substitute meat by high protein vegetarian food; of course, that requires a little extra effort. But, if one is driven enough to succeed, this little extra effort towards putting together a balanced vegetarian diet should not be a big deal (ask my wife).

I will give you an example here. Although the swimmer in this example is only 6 yrs. old (so, it would be PREMATURE to predict his future in sports) his progress has strengthened my belief that you don’t have to be a meat eater to be a champion.

I took my son, Tej, to a swimming pool for the first time in last July (2004) when he was 5. Within four weeks, the club swim coach invited him to participate in the selection trial for a place on the club’s kids’ swim team. By the end of the winter, Feb. 2005, he was winning virtually every race (often against kids as old as 9 years). Not surprisingly, he won the “Best Swimmer” award in his age group at the southern New Jersey Swim League Championship. This season he is “shattering” all his age group records in south jersey.

Here, it is important to mention that we are vegetarians (no eggs either). As I mentioned before it is too early to predict his future in sports but his progress is an indicator (at least to me) that vegetarianism is not a barrier. If he were competing in India, we might have countered that he might be competing against kids who are also vegetarian but he is winning hands down against kids who eat meat like candies.

Competitive Leagues:
One of the biggest drawbacks I see in Indian sports system is lack of competitive leagues. Indian athletes do not get enough exposure to actual competition. Indian Athletic Federation is trying to adopt the European model and is succeeding to some extent. IAF organizes 8-10 domestic meets per year but it needs to organize more of high-quality meets (but then, there comes the question of corporate sponsorship). Elite athletes compete in as many as 30 meets per year in preparation for mega sporting events like the Olympics and world championships. In 1960, Milkha Singh competed in more than 50 international track meets in preparation for Rome Olympic Games. No wonder that most Indian athletes are at their wits’ end at these big events because they never get a chance to sharpen their reflexes, get the mental edge, or experience that knee-buckling pressure in preparatory meets / competition.

In 1993, when I became national champion, I got to compete in only 2 national level meets and one state meet, where I was running against athletes of my caliber. To put things in perspective, my son Tej has competed in 17 meets in the last 9 months. The more meets you participate in, the more mental toughness you acquire and more immune you become to that heart-in-the-mouth kind of pressure. There is absolutely no short cut to stardom in sports.

Before we move on to / discuss other factors, let’s see what others have to say on these two.

virmaramjyani
July 19th, 2005, 06:31 PM
facts given by u ppl r very true.. bt how can we leave role of politics... most of sports organisation are dominated by politicians..

ramksehrawat
July 19th, 2005, 07:27 PM
I think the main reason Indians not doing well at interntional meets is lack of facilities and exposure as explained by Kapoor Singhji. Second, the goal of most of the sportspersons in India is to get admissions in colleges or to get a job through sports quota. Once they are successful in getting a job, they feel satisfied and the fire to succeed diminishes. This one medal phenomenon too has begun only for the last 2-3 games. However, keeping in view the kind of money and adulations these bronze and silver medalist have earned, our players have started working hard and the day is not far when we will have several players doing us proud. A decade or two back who could have imaginged 2-3 jats playing international cricket for India. Like the elusive triple century was accompalished by a jat, am sure the individual gold at olympics too will be earned by a jat.

dhruvdahiya
July 19th, 2005, 07:31 PM
Respected Sehrawat uncle ji,

I pray for your wish to come true.

rkumar
July 19th, 2005, 07:32 PM
How serious India is to win medals in international sports events, can be seen by the fact that she has signed an agreement with China specifically for this. China will be helping India to win medals ...Very unique agreement I suppose the only one of its kind in the world...

http://in.sports.yahoo.com/050701/137/5z6dl.html

RK^2

singhkapoor
July 20th, 2005, 07:50 AM
Genetic make up of an athlete's body definitely affects his/her performance. Every sport has its own unique physical requirements; so, it is impossible to list ideal physical traits for every sport. Therefore, I will stick to Track & Field because this one sport itself has more than two-dozen different events that favor different kind of bodies.

An ideal track athlete has:

Narrow buttocks – Blacks have very noticeable small posterior. I am referring to blacks from Africa here; fast-food eating (burger, soda, donuts) American blacks don’t count.

Larger number of Fast-Twitch Fibers in the muscle mass for a sprinter is absolutely must. Genetically, blacks have more Fast-Twitch fibers in their muscle mass. That’s why all sixteen finalists in 100 and 200 meter races at most Olympic Games are blacks…no matter what country they are representing. Allen Wells (at 1980 Games - boycotted by US and its allies) and Valery Borzov (1972 Games) are exceptions. There are more non-black female elite sprinters but the primary reason is that very few women in Africa get a chance to take up sport; although the availability of money in distance running (esp. marathon) has helped in bringing about change in the recent past.

Lower Body Mass Index – BMI correlates with body fat. Africans have leaner/skinnier bodies than most other people.

Thin calves help you run faster - Australian marathoner; Alberto Salazer has been a rare exception.

Arched sole – Very important for agility, nimbleness, and quick reflexes – Although, flat-footed Moroccan wonder Said Aouita defied all odds by setting so many world records in distance-running.

Larger Heart (Literally) – An elite athlete’s heart beats at close to 30 times per minute compared to 72/minute for a normal healthy adult. So, the lower heart beat rate you have at birth the less you have to work to get to the magical number 30.

The larger RBC count (Red Blood Cells) you have at birth (naturally), the more oxygen carrying capacity your blood will have. That’s why blood-doping has become so common amongst distance runners and cyclists.

raj2rif
July 20th, 2005, 07:51 AM
Dear All,

Mr. Jeetendra has raised very important issues. Mr. Kapoor Singh has answered some of them. There are many more issues that are connected to the sports. I shall take them one by one. But before I do, that let me confess, that I had not been any outstanding athelete or a sports person. I am a great sports lover and have played almost every game at least at club level and most of the time not as a liability to the team. I had the unique privilage of commanding a battalion that had been sports Champion from 1982 to 1998 in the regiment ( I left the army in 1998) And let me also tell you that Rajputana Rifles as a regiment had been pretty good among the army units in sports. My own battalion had given Jagbir Singh Teotia (National Marathon Champion who also represented in commonwealth games) Sub Chandram (Captain of Indian Waterpolo Team in Tehran Asian Games which won Silver Medal, Sub Vijay Kumaran represented India in Asian Games and Commonwealth games to name a few)

First problem is identifying the talent. Sub Vijaya kumaran was cook in my unit. He would have cooked all his life if he was not spotted by us. In 9 months he won the 400 M title of Services and went on to represent India. He entered the track at age 22. That is the age most athlete participate in Olympics. Once I noticed kids at Itarsi train station doing various acts with a body as flexible as rubber. I don't think they could ever be trined for Gymnastics. We can find numerous good runners in Rajasthan or costal areas where a person from childhood has to walk on sand paths. The list can go on. But who is there to spot them.

The second question comes of fielding right person for right event. I know of atleast one coach (Dronacharya Award Winner) who probably did not identify the right event for a very promissing athlete. I had an athlete who participated in Services in three events contineously for almost 12 years. He was also good in other events. All that was needed to field him in Decathelon. But that would have challange the blue eyed boy of the coach. Such thing happen at almost all levels. Some time to ensure the team victory, we do make athlete participate in the event he is not suited for. I was asked to do pole vault while my main event was 5000M.

The next thing is motivation. Sehrawat Ji has well said that once the job is achieved the motivation ends. I had seen in army where accelerated promotion was given to outstanding athletes. But once the promotion was received, performance dropped and consumption of liquor increased. I have also seen an athelet under performing to ensure his friend came first and got accelerated promotion. This gives rise to bogus athletes some time. Similarly many times rivelry of players in team games brings down the performance of good players in team games. Here comes the role of Coach and team manager. They have to ensure that these things do not happen and defaulters are taken to task. Some time injured players report fit and get into the teams. Harbhajan Singh and Zaheer Khan have done so last season. They are back in team this year too. We know about them since media covers cricket well. I am sure there would be similar cases in other sports as well.

We can go on. But what is the solution. One can only succeed at highest level if he loves what he does. That brings the motivation and will to do. Pride in oneself is the biggest motivator. Easy as it may sound, it is very difficult to achieve. We need to popularize the other games. Media has to play a major role and so is sponsors. The government may help the companies and give them tax benefits if they contribute to sports not as popular as Cricket. We need to make sports as an industry and people have to take sports like a profession. Similary we need to have plans to rehabilitate our old sportsmen.

The planning has to be done well in advance. The plans for 2012 olympics to be made now. Talent search for 2016 games may have to start now.

vikramlal
July 22nd, 2005, 09:20 AM
:(

All of you have forgotten one big reason. Bollywood. It has vitually

become a religion in our country consuming peoples interst and time.

As for the diet argument think about this,

Pakistan and Bangladesh where people are meat eaters(Being Muslim)

dont do any better than us in the olympics

anujkumar
July 22nd, 2005, 10:12 AM
How serious India is to win medals in international sports events, can be seen by the fact that she has signed an agreement with China specifically for this. China will be helping India to win medals ...Very unique agreement I suppose the only one of its kind in the world...

http://in.sports.yahoo.com/050701/137/5z6dl.html

RK^2


Nice! I am pleased at the tone of all these news article about Indian these days in international context. It's even sweeter than yours, about India ofcourse:)

To me it seems like a number game. Out of a billion Indians, 90% have no chance to cross the threshold of persuing sports full time, among these are 40% who are living below poverty line, we can just forget about it, they are having tough time living. Rozgar kee chinta kuerta hai aam aadmee desh me.

The people to look forward to are the well to do people living in cities. To an extent these people end up in cities by a process of self selection, in which higher brain power is the requirement. So natual "equation of constant" implies that very few of them would be gifted physically. Nonetheless these are the people contributing mostly to sports india.

There are two solution:

1) Communist solution: Increase government expenditure tenfold, kill corruption in the sports infrastructure, increase fairness in the selection system. All 40% of this money to the sports activities at the university level. Half in infra and half as prizes. Something like a district leve winner, in 20 sports every other year should get 1 lack rupees. Hire someone like me to design such a 5 year plan.

2) Capatilist Solution:

a) Make people rich and they would play sports to kill boredom. Make it very cool to be in to sports, which can only happen if people are reasonably rich. Somehow create incentive to perform in sports like, to give one example, the CHICK factor in US, all the footballers get hot chicks. This seems like completely infeasible stuff for India and I drifted a little bit. So time for Plan B.

b) Let's look for a capitalistic solution for India which could work.

The basic object of this covert mission would be universities. A typical universities in USA has a few Olympic Medal winners. There is intense competition among universities to win and media care a lot about it. Universities put a serious fight to recruit (as students) some of these atheletes who were good in school then train them very well and give a degree a bonus on top of scholarship.

Again the things boil down to money. So if your really serious about it give a lot of money to univesity specifically for sports and create a sytem resembing the one above. Make sure that this system be immune to so very india disease - like corruption, bhai bhatiza-wad etc.

vikramlal
July 22nd, 2005, 10:27 AM
Anuj ji

Like I said, Bollywood is becoming a religion in India. These

rich people you talk about are " killling their time" watching the latest

movies rather than engaging in any sports

haryanajat
July 22nd, 2005, 10:38 AM
Anuj ji

Like I said, Bollywood is becoming a religion in India. These

rich people you talk about are " killling their time" watching the latest

movies rather than engaging in any sports

bollywood neee paaata naheen kin kin students ka bedaa gark karaaa haee.
You are correct - bollywood is 1 of the main culprits with its nonsense escapist crap. But it affects the poor also. Nakeli duniya, nakli loog, zoootee sapnee, fake lives, make-believe.
How pretty would these bollywood heroines look WITHOUT THEIR HEAVY MAKEUP?
NOT PRETTY AT ALL. :D