What reservations should be like.

[desijat]

We all have been hearing the hue and cry on reservation but have we thought of an alternative to it?

I have a few suggetions in my mind which i present to you for discussion with the jat bhais.

1. Reservation on the basis of Cast should be completely abolished, reservation should be on the basis of other criterions such as financial status, the well being of the area from where people are coming from etc.

E.G.
We should be having a free and fair selection process for IIMs and IITs and any other institutions But instead of having reserved seats, vary the fees structure as per the household income of the candidate.

Seeing the household income, make slabs of fee accordingly, so that the poor but deserving student also get equal chance to study.
This would maintain an equilibrium of talent and govt should come fwd. in subsidising the education or providing interest free loans.

2. There should be absolutely no reservation in job sector.

Did anyone wonder why are govt. institutions not functioning? where as they become profitable when they go into pvt. hands?

Because we have an evil prevailing called reservation and promotion as per time, not as per performance.

Whereas in private sector, promotion is as per performance, that is why they excel.


These are my views as to how the reservations should be like, this would not only stop the votebank politics but also encourage the students to work hard to achieve something.

[sunnysangwan]

We all have been hearing the hue and cry on reservation but have we thought of an alternative to it?

I have a few suggetions in my mind which i present to you for discussion with the jat bhais.

1. Reservation on the basis of Cast should be completely abolished, reservation should be on the basis of other criterions such as financial status, the well being of the area from where people are coming from etc.

E.G.
We should be having a free and fair selection process for IIMs and IITs and any other institutions But instead of having reserved seats, vary the fees structure as per the household income of the candidate.

Seeing the household income, make slabs of fee accordingly, so that the poor but deserving student also get equal chance to study.
This would maintain an equilibrium of talent and govt should come fwd. in subsidising the education or providing interest free loans.

2. There should be absolutely no reservation in job sector.

Did anyone wonder why are govt. institutions not functioning? where as they become profitable when they go into pvt. hands?

Because we have an evil prevailing called reservation and promotion as per time, not as per performance.

Whereas in private sector, promotion is as per performance, that is why they excel.


These are my views as to how the reservations should be like, this would not only stop the votebank politics but also encourage the students to work hard to achieve something.

I agree, there should be no reservation but consideration into the financial status should be there.

[vikaskundu]

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12864
this thread is also same

[desijat]

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12864
this thread is also same

not same, but similar . . . .

[atul.jhajhria]

We all have been hearing the hue and cry on reservation but have we thought of an alternative to it?

I have a few suggetions in my mind which i present to you for discussion with the jat bhais.

1. Reservation on the basis of Cast should be completely abolished, reservation should be on the basis of other criterions such as financial status, the well being of the area from where people are coming from etc.

E.G.
We should be having a free and fair selection process for IIMs and IITs and any other institutions But instead of having reserved seats, vary the fees structure as per the household income of the candidate.

Seeing the household income, make slabs of fee accordingly, so that the poor but deserving student also get equal chance to study.
This would maintain an equilibrium of talent and govt should come fwd. in subsidising the education or providing interest free loans.

I disagree!

I am against reservation but if we have to live with reservation, current system is the only way!

The reservation on the basis of Income does not seems logical to me!

The reservation is there because communities like SC/ST/OBC people have been suppresed for long time!They did not had equal standing with people of higher castes like Brahmins!

Since Brahmins were so smart to put themselves upper most caste:rolleyes:, the not so rich/educated brahmin cant be judged at different level!

When Brahmins/Rajputs suppresed SC/ST it was not on the basis of their Income level!

It was based on their caste!! So why reservation on the basis of Income now!!

Upper caste did horrible mistake and present crop has to bear with it!

Somebody has to loose!

2. There should be absolutely no reservation in job sector.

Did anyone wonder why are govt. institutions not functioning? where as they become profitable when they go into pvt. hands?

Because we have an evil prevailing called reservation and promotion as per time, not as per performance.

Whereas in private sector, promotion is as per performance, that is why they excel.

You are mixing two things here!

There are lots of public sector which is performing good but you cant put blame on Reservation for failure of others!

The reason(in your words) is simply: Whereas in private sector, promotion is as per performance, that is why they excel.

Take the example of Infosys. Infosys hires General/SC/ST both but its working. why??

There theory is every man is capable of doing everything!!
If he wants to!

There is no difference in IQ level of Brahmin or SC/ST!!

Its the difference in their motivation level and their urge to succeed combined with hard work!

If some SC/ST person shows same characterstics he will succeed too!

Take another example! IQ level of IIT'ian and a common man!

Who has more IQ!

.......

They both have same IQ!! And this is the fact! I had Psychology class in which my prof told us he conducted IQ test for IIT people and Non-IIT people! He found IQ level same! In the range 90-110.

And dont rely on online IQ tests, they are Invaild!!

So there is no reason not to have reservation in jobs!

Offcourse the performance wont be same but again that was the price we had to pay not to divide India in three parts!

These are my views as to how the reservations should be like, this would not only stop the votebank politics but also encourage the students to work hard to achieve something.

Thats so true.

[desijat]

I disagree!
The reservation on the basis of Income does not seems logical to me!
Who has more IQ!
Upper caste did horrible mistake and present crop has to bear with it!
.

i Disagree too, i said there should be a system which motivates poor and needy people to study.

i never said there should be reservation on the basis of income, i said people should come on their hardwork, but they should be given discounts on fees as per their household income.

50 years is enough to change the thinking of a generation, but what we are doing is here is cooking food for SCs and giving to them.
Even if they dont work, they are promoted in govt sector, just because they are SC+ST, which kills the drive to perform, and kills the motivation of those who work.

if 56 years of spoon feeding cant help them, that doesnt mean we will increase the size of the spoon, the capacity of intake is still the same.

Therefore, let the world be equally competent to everyone, let us not Repeat what our ancestors did i.e. to divide the society on the basis of cast.

[desijat]

How did i become a victim of reservation....

I gave my NIFT entrance exam for UG Technology course which had 180 seats all over India in the year 2003.

I Scored 182 rank, which means i should have been in the waiting list, but i was shocked to see i didnot make it into waiting list even:eek:

Whereas my friend who had a rank of 459 made it into final list and was given top priority for centre, she chose gandhinagar and went there.

When i checked her result, she was a SC, and i was so heartbroken that i didnt get into NIFT cause of being a JAT.

Though later, i was called and i made it into it as a last selected cadidate, but jab mera dil hi tut chuka tha NIFT and is selection procedure se, i came back within a week from Chennai, which was my centre. and joined Amity.
and frankly, no regrets

[atul.jhajhria]

i never said there should be reservation on the basis of income, i said people should come on their hardwork, but they should be given discounts on fees as per their household income.

reservation should be on the basis of other criterions such as financial status, the well being of the area from where people are coming from etc.

You are refuting your own point!

You only said reservation should be on the basis of financial status!!

Reservation on the basis of financial staus is different than giving them discounts on fees!!

50 years is enough to change the thinking of a generation, but what we are doing is here is cooking food for SCs and giving to them.

You think 3000 years of suppresion can be undone in just 56 years!

Nope!

Even if they dont work, they are promoted in govt sector, just because they are SC+ST, which kills the drive to perform, and kills the motivation of those who work.

As i said the performance will be compromised but thats what our ancestors did too!!

Our society would have progressed at faster rate if they did not excluded SC/ST groups!

You see you cant have both head and tail!!

if 56 years of spoon feeding cant help them, that doesnt mean we will increase the size of the spoon, the capacity of intake is still the same.

Ahh spoon feeding for what!

For the unjustice done to them!

How much is % of SC+ST+OBC??

Its >50%.

Spoon was smaller in the beginning my friend!

Now it has better size and shape!!

Therefore, let the world be equally competent to everyone, let us not Repeat what our ancestors did i.e. to divide the society on the basis of cast.

Thats exactly what SC/ST/OBC people were saying for 3000 years!

They said: include us, give us positions in Raj Darbar which distributes posts on the baiss of caste!!

Now when you feel the heat you want to turn back on it!!

Double standards!!

[desijat]

What i meant up there was that there should be a rebate on the basis of financial criterion. What is the point in selling a form at half the price to SC as compared to a Jat, with out any knowledge of their background?

a Jat or brahmin could be poor and can not afford to buy it at 1100 rs. where as a chamar who is buing it at 550 could have afforded it at 1100 too.

As i said the performance will be compromised but thats what our ancestors did too!!!!

If we repeat what our ancestors did too, we will land up in the same position.



and my friend, now when you can not even make out who is SC and ST, till u c the certificate, how do you think people will give a biased opinion in any selection? Earlier it used to be very well visible if he is SC or ST, but now it is not, SCs are living at par rather as you said since they enjoy a mejority, they are a more powerfull part of society.


If 56 years can make India a country which can challange USA , a country which has the same history as SCs have, which was looted by britishers, and has not been given reservation in any world forum, Then why cant a perticular society rise.

56 years means atleast 2 generations have enjoyed benefit, and if they are smart, they should be competable enough to face anyone.

If i was an SC, i would have never accepted i am an SC just because i am born in that cast, i would not have enjoyed any benefits of reservation, i would not accept any position, untill i deserve it

And frankly, the way VOTE bank Politics is going, i think sooner or later even brahmins will be under reservations.


Khikhi

[panward]

New Delhi, Apr 9 (UNI) The All India Jat Mahasabha and the All
India Federation of OBC Welfare Associations today welcomed the
Government move to reserve 27 per cent seats for OBCs in IITs,
IIMs and central universities.
In a statement here, the two caste organisations said OBC-run
institutions such as Maharaja Suraj Mal Institute and others
should also be allowed to enrol students on preferential basis.

[atul.jhajhria]

If we repeat what our ancestors did too, we will land up in the same position.

You are torchering a man and than suddenly you stop, set him free and expect everything is normal!

No my friend, world is not like that!!

You cant set standards everytime!

Sometimes you have to be at receiving end!

and my friend, now when you can not even make out who is SC and ST, till u c the certificate, how do you think people will give a biased opinion in any selection?

The reservation is not just due to discrimination!

Reservation is a tool to undone the harm to those poor communities for over 3000years!! To make sure they are selected into certain percentage!!

Earlier it used to be very well visible if he is SC or ST, but now it is not, SCs are living at par rather as you said since they enjoy a mejority, they are a more powerfull part of society.

I never said SC are majority!

I said SC+ST+OBC is majority!

But those are broad divisions, and their are 1000's of division among them.

They are most powerless people except in certain parts!

If 56 years can make India a country which can challange USA , a country which has the same history as SCs have, which was looted by britishers, and has not been given reservation in any world forum, Then why cant a perticular society rise.

There is difference between country and people!

You can defeat and plunder a country! But country dont have emotions!

People have emotions!!

China defeated India but we dont hold grudge against china instead we try to befriend them!

But when you dont let SC/ST person to ride a horse in his own marriage, thats something serious.

56 years means atleast 2 generations have enjoyed benefit, and if they are smart, they should be competable enough to face anyone.

I will say again: The harm done for 3000 years cant be undone in just 56 years!!

If i was an SC, i would have never accepted i am an SC just because i am born in that cast, i would not have enjoyed any benefits of reservation, i would not accept any position, untill i deserve it

Say it again when you born as SC

There are lots of SC's who dont accept any benifits!!

But you had different views than!

And frankly, the way VOTE bank Politics is going, i think sooner or later even brahmins will be under reservations.

Yah Brahmins are already humbled in Haryana!

Soon they will vanish!

[sansanwalamit]

Like Hen's teeth.

[desijat]

Bhai
Arjun Singh needs a secretry, should i put fwd ur name?
You 2 people are the only one who think alike, and together u can go on putting up social reforms for SCs n STs. khi khi

I am still not convinced by your Ideas, and wouldnt ever be.

Though am really serious about arjun singhs sec offer.

[dahiyarules]

How many of you think that there should not be any reservations becuase you really think so?


I guess most of you are saying so becuase you do not benefit from it. Try to find one SC/ST who will agree with you.

[priti]

Someone told me- Reservations do not result in equal opportunity but in equal outcome. And it stuck me to so true.

Its bad news and will probably worsen the caste situation in India rather than improving it. If the government wants to do anything, it should target the root of casteism and promote equal opportunity from the beginning rather than providing these make-up solutions.

The key is to promote equal opportunity policies rather than imposing quotas.......

[desijat]

Someone told me- Reservations do not result in equal opportunity but in equal outcome. And it stuck me to so true.

Its bad news and will probably worsen the caste situation in India rather than improving it. If the government wants to do anything, it should target the root of casteism and promote equal opportunity from the beginning rather than providing these make-up solutions.

The key is to promote equal opportunity policies rather than imposing quotas.......

But then whr would the politics for vote bank go? MPs see thr benefit 1st rather than the countries benefit.

There are a lot of things that can be done, but they arent.
For insstance if govt enters a pact with RBI the price of petrol will be fixed and go cheap like in US, but it doesnt cause thn govt officials wont make money.

[virenderkhokhar]

But then whr would the politics for vote bank go? MPs see thr benefit 1st rather than the countries benefit.

There are a lot of things that can be done, but they arent.
For insstance if govt enters a pact with RBI the price of petrol will be fixed and go cheap like in US, but it doesnt cause thn govt officials wont make money.

all of our fellow members r right that reservation isnt the solution at all .....thinking practically that this reservation cant b abolished in this present context of politics....so for the benefit of our community lets us become united and pressurise govt to include jats also.....
this looks to me the more feasible..