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Thread: Jatland copyright policy

  1. #1
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    Jatland copyright policy

    Jatland is becoming an important source of information about Jats. We aim to make it an encyclopedia of Jats. Any Jat or any other person interested should be able to search and use informations on it for fair use. We do not have coyright policy for using the informations either from Jatland threads or from Jatland Wiki. There are requests to use info from here in articles or research purposes.

    It is therefore proposed to make a copyright policy. Suggestions are invited from the members.

    regards,
    Laxman Burdak

  2. #2

    Copy Right

    DEAR LAXMAN JI.
    I DO NOT KNOW MUCH ABOUT COPY RIGHTS ON INTERNET.
    BUT MOST OF THE MATERIAL HERE IN HISTORY & ON WIKI
    FROM THKUR DESH RAJ
    BS. DAHIYA
    CAPT. DALIP SINGH AHLAWAT
    LT. RAMSARUP JOON
    DHARMPAL SINGH DUDEE- ME & OTHERS ARE ALREADY PUBLISHED IN HISTORY BOOKS . SO ALREADY COPY RIGHTS.
    MOST OF MY POSTs ARE REF TO SOME BOOKS. SO THEY ARE ALSO COME UNDER COPY RIGHTs.
    I DID NOT WRITE COPY RIGHT REF TO EVERY MY POST IN GOOD FAITH IN THE PAST AND MOST OF THEM GONE TO WIKI WITH OUT ANY REF OF MINE OR ANY WRITER.
    I DO NOT MIND PERSONALLY. IF MY WRITING SERVE ANY NOBLE CAUSE. THEY CAN BE USED FOR RESEARCH WITH DUE REF & RESPECT.
    Jay Jawan Jay Kisan Jay Shaheed

  3. #3
    Quite true.

    -vinod

    Quote Originally Posted by ranjitjat View Post
    DEAR LAXMAN JI.
    I DO NOT KNOW MUCH ABOUT COPY RIGHTS ON INTERNET.
    BUT MOST OF THE MATERIAL HERE IN HISTORY & ON WIKI
    FROM THKUR DESH RAJ
    BS. DAHIYA
    CAPT. DALIP SINGH AHLAWAT
    LT. RAMSARUP JOON
    DHARMPAL SINGH DUDEE- ME & OTHERS ARE ALREADY PUBLISHED IN HISTORY BOOKS . SO ALREADY COPY RIGHTS.
    MOST OF MY POSTs ARE REF TO SOME BOOKS. SO THEY ARE ALSO COME UNDER COPY RIGHTs.
    I DID NOT WRITE COPY RIGHT REF TO EVERY MY POST IN GOOD FAITH IN THE PAST AND MOST OF THEM GONE TO WIKI WITH OUT ANY REF OF MINE OR ANY WRITER.
    I DO NOT MIND PERSONALLY. IF MY WRITING SERVE ANY NOBLE CAUSE. THEY CAN BE USED FOR RESEARCH WITH DUE REF & RESPECT.
    It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given to a handful of metaphors. -J L Borges

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by lrburdak View Post
    Jatland is becoming an important source of information about Jats. We aim to make it an encyclopedia of Jats. Any Jat or any other person interested should be able to search and use informations on it for fair use. We do not have coyright policy for using the informations either from Jatland threads or from Jatland Wiki. There are requests to use info from here in articles or research purposes.

    It is therefore proposed to make a copyright policy. Suggestions are invited from the members.

    regards,

    my understanding is that the site already has an automatic copyright against "duplication" of content, but the idea to have a formal policy makes sense.

    In the past, we've not had anyone ask us specifically (except in one instance, when they wanted to duplicate content and we advised them against it). However, instances where people have copied stuff verbatim from the forums and/or the wiki have been pointed out, but we've not had the ability or the time to enforce the copyright.

    it might make sense for you to share your thoughts on how we should do this?

    one possible model is as we have done on the wiki page on jat regiment, where we clearly reference the original source of the material (and we use it relatively unchanged). so we can allow ppl to use content by referencing us. obviously, for scholarly articles, people may be unlikely to use jatland as a source, but our policy can be consistent/use independent.

  5. #5

    my 2 cents

    Sorry, but it didn't. Atleast to me. As far as history content goes (more or less the only referencable material), most of the articles have primary source from other books/journals which few dedicated members made available by typing/composing themselves. The idea should be to bring out, rather publicize, valuable historical references all over the internet even though it may involve pasting/discussion of these articles in other forums, non-Jat forums being important example of that section e.g. India-forum, where Ravi ji single handedly had kept alive Jat history discussion for last couple of years by using articles which were simulatenously pasted at 3-4 portals for wider audience (e.g. Jatland, juttworld, india-forum, yahoo-group and "you-know-what-website"). Focus should be on disseminating this information aggresively for "others" to take notice. Non-jats are anyway not allowed to discuss history here so what we have here is only our points of views on history which may be good enough for our satisfaction but not good enough for it to claim its deserved place in mainstream history of India. Rest on your wisdom.

    -vinod

    Quote Originally Posted by ndahiya View Post
    it might make sense for you to share your thoughts on how we should do this?
    Last edited by vinodks; January 11th, 2007 at 11:23 AM.
    It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given to a handful of metaphors. -J L Borges

  6. #6
    Ditto as Vinod....dont think we need copyright unless deshwalji wants to get quoted for his "Kissa Kadyan Khap" which definitely is a very ingenuine piece of work...

  7. #7
    Perhaps we could just concentrate on bringing out and publicizing the material for the benefit of our community.


    We should be encouraging all to use the material freely - no restrictions.




    Ravi Chaudhary

  8. #8
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    Question

    Is History posts only deserve the Copyright Act ?
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

  9. #9
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    It is important to have a policy of Copyrights on this site and mentioned on it. We have to decide:

    1. Which contents are to be allowed to RE-use or copy freely without restriction ?

    2. Which contents are allowed to RE-use or copy from Jatland with rstrictions ?

    3. So far we have not been mentioning name of the author on articles in Jatland Wiki. Though it remains in its history page. Some people insist to write the name of editor on the page itself. Shall we permit it ?

    My immediate broblem came from Wikipedia. I gave stub article about Alka Tomar. I receved following message from user ReyBrujo.
    ***************************
    Alka Tomar

    Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia! We welcome and appreciate your contributions, such as Alka Tomar, but we regretfully cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from either web sites or printed material. This article appears to be a direct copy from

    http://www.jatland.com/home/Alka_Tomar,

    and therefore a copyright violation. The copyrighted text has been or will soon be deleted.

    If you believe that the article is not a copyright violation, or if you have permission from the copyright holder to release the content freely under the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL), you can comment to that effect on Talk:Alka Tomar. Then you should do one of the following:

    Make a note on the original website that re-use is permitted under the GFDL and state at Talk:Alka Tomar where we can find that note; or
    Send an e-mail from an address associated with the original publication to permissions-en(at)wikimedia(dot)org or a postal message to the Wikimedia Foundation permitting re-use under the GFDL, and note that you have done so on Talk:Alka Tomar.

    Thank you, and please feel welcome to continue contributing to Wikipedia. Happy editing! -- ReyBrujo 15:15, 7 January 2007
    ***********************
    Laxman Burdak

  10. #10
    Copyrights, without the means of enforcing them, iare worthless. This site, being a non-profit venture might not be easily able to enforce any copyrights.(Individual works referenced on this site are an entirely different issue, and their owners are totally responsible for that.)

    As for the immediate problem, the administrators can easily solve it if they are amenable to it.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by lrburdak View Post
    It is important to have a policy of Copyrights on this site and mentioned on it. We have to decide:

    1. Which contents are to be allowed to RE-use or copy freely without restriction ?

    2. Which contents are allowed to RE-use or copy from Jatland with rstrictions ?

    3. So far we have not been mentioning name of the author on articles in Jatland Wiki. Though it remains in its history page. Some people insist to write the name of editor on the page itself. Shall we permit it ?

    My immediate broblem came from Wikipedia. I gave stub article about Alka Tomar. I receved following message from user ReyBrujo.
    ***************************
    Alka Tomar

    Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia! We welcome and appreciate your contributions, such as Alka Tomar, but we regretfully cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from either web sites or printed material. This article appears to be a direct copy from

    http://www.jatland.com/home/Alka_Tomar,

    and therefore a copyright violation. The copyrighted text has been or will soon be deleted.

    If you believe that the article is not a copyright violation, or if you have permission from the copyright holder to release the content freely under the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL), you can comment to that effect on Talk:Alka Tomar. Then you should do one of the following:

    [B]Make a note on the original website that re-use is permitted [/B]under the GFDL and state at Talk:Alka Tomar where we can find that note; or
    Send an e-mail from an address associated with the original publication to permissions-en(at)wikimedia(dot)org or a postal message to the Wikimedia Foundation permitting re-use under the GFDL, and note that you have done so on Talk:Alka Tomar.

    Thank you, and please feel welcome to continue contributing to Wikipedia. Happy editing! -- ReyBrujo 15:15, 7 January 2007
    ***********************

    The copyright policy is then ,

    " free use and reproduction of all material allowed" , put prominently on the website"

    B]Make a note on the original website that [/B] re-use is permitted

  12. #12
    Do you have any idea about the cost of what you are talking about here...I have a sofware product where we had to go for copy right thats how I know the process. It's not only expensive but very elaborate and time consuming too and then on top of that how sure are about the info being posted here is true and valid?
    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds... Albert Einstien

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by lrburdak View Post
    It is important to have a policy of Copyrights on this site and mentioned on it. We have to decide:

    1. Which contents are to be allowed to RE-use or copy freely without restriction ?

    2. Which contents are allowed to RE-use or copy from Jatland with rstrictions ?

    3. So far we have not been mentioning name of the author on articles in Jatland Wiki. Though it remains in its history page. Some people insist to write the name of editor on the page itself. Shall we permit it ?

    My immediate broblem came from Wikipedia. I gave stub article about Alka Tomar. I receved following message from user ReyBrujo.
    ***********************

    I believe the question of whather we have a copyright is settled (Yes, we do).

    The other issue is that Burdak ji and Ravi ji raise. What should our policy be ref the copyright ?

    My view is that exact copies of material should reference the source. Ideally speaking material that is "based on" or substantially similar needs to refer or atleast acknowledge the source as well. This improves the quality of information as it allows for linking up the info sources...

    In my view, our policy should allow for free re-use, but with a reference back to the site.

    Ref mentioning the author name, the collabarative nature of a wiki renders this somewhat useless, especially if multiple people work on a page. In our case, Mr Burdak does most of the work, so it can be different. But believe that putting the authors' name will desist others from contibuting.

    From a copyright point of view for a website, the copyright owner is the site once the material is posted on it (even though the site does not vouch for the "correctness" of the content), unless ithe content creator is explicitly recognized as the copyright owner, in my view.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by chhillar View Post
    Do you have any idea about the cost of what you are talking about here...I have a sofware product where we had to go for copy right thats how I know the process. It's not only expensive but very elaborate and time consuming too and then on top of that how sure are about the info being posted here is true and valid?
    Believe we are not talking abt enforceable business copyright as in your case, but a policy ref the content. Even though an unenforceable policy has no direct material benefit, it provides a framework for content sharing.

  15. #15
    Free re-use with Ref sounds ok. Articles taken from other primary sources of course could be reproduced further(as they have been reproduced here) without Ref. I suggest (if it matters at all) that authors of articles could have their names(if they wish) on articles in wiki for atleast two reasons.

    1) The website won't be held responsible for accidentaly incorrect information(as there are some even right now) and it would be easier to trace individual writer for any change to be made. When two people have different opinions on certain piece its better for them discuss and decide the final form rather than keep editing wiki alternatively.

    2) It gives incentive and ecourages new members to participate. It can be elaborated by examples but I would leave it at this.

    -vinod
    Last edited by vinodks; January 14th, 2007 at 09:30 AM.
    It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given to a handful of metaphors. -J L Borges

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by vinodks View Post
    Free re-use with Ref sounds ok. Articles taken from other primary sources of course could be reproduced further(as they have been reproduced here) without Ref.
    -vinod
    The distinction is trivial at best. Obviously, we do not want to violate anyone elses copyright policy just as we do not want ours to be violated. We should be properly referencing material as well (unless it is under a GFDL license). Anyone who uses us a source should refer back...

  17. #17
    Lets take an example. You mean the following article taken (verbatim) from Dilip Singh's book regarding Jats' role in 1857 struggle can't be reproduced elsewhere without Jatland's Ref? Jatland should be grateful for people who made it available here and similarly if book publisher doesn't mind, it is absolutely legal to use it further by directly quoting Dilip Singh's name. No qualm about it.

    http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=805

    Rest of course gets decided as per your whims.

    -vinod

    Quote Originally Posted by ndahiya View Post
    The distinction is trivial at best. Obviously, we do not want to violate anyone elses copyright policy just as we do not want ours to be violated. We should be properly referencing material as well (unless it is under a GFDL license). Anyone who uses us a source should refer back...
    It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given to a handful of metaphors. -J L Borges

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by vinodks View Post
    Lets take an example. You mean the following article taken (verbatim) from Dilip Singh's book regarding Jats' role in 1857 struggle can't be reproduced elsewhere without Jatland's Ref? Jatland should be grateful for people who made it available here and similarly if book publisher doesn't mind, it is absolutely legal to use it further by directly quoting Dilip Singh's name. No qualm about it.

    -vinod
    If that is the case, we should refer to it. One would like to assume that any "duplicated" content is already refered properly, unless it is made available by the original copyright owner/policy.

    Quote Originally Posted by vinodks View Post
    Rest of course gets decided as per your whims.
    -vinod
    There is little anyone can do with your presumptions and cynicism.

  19. #19
    <edited by mod>

    Well, that proves my point. Take care.

    -vinod
    Last edited by vinodks; January 15th, 2007 at 09:10 PM.
    It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given to a handful of metaphors. -J L Borges

  20. #20
    Wants little clarification...?

    Who will have the ownership ,if a writer submits an article via post here on jatland ,writer or jatland site?

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