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Thread: Reservation of JAT's in Haryana.

  1. #61
    Deshwal ji … I am just on the other side of thoughts in this matter … and frankly sharing my thoughts to you … kindly don’t get hurted of any … kindly resolve

    Quote Originally Posted by spdeshwal View Post
    You win or vanish, ghissar-2 ke jina kis kaam ka! This can only be achieved only by "Burn the Bridges". No route to escape but fight to win or vanish.To me providing resevation is another bridge to escape from reality

    - What reality we are talking about Deshwal ji here?
    Increasing candidates and decreasing seats to fight is the reality for jats? Are we supernaturals who will always be among first 100s only from ten thousands? Arent we expecting more from our new generations? Kya aaj wo samae hai ki ek medium parivar wale bache jo ki 80-90% ke beech calibre wale hein … unke liye koe scope nahi hai?

    Dear Siddharth, I appreciate your enthusiasm and concern for the community and this write up is not certainly to counter your argument or to win the argument but to give strenth to your voice, just a different point of view.

    All those who don't subscribe to your point of view are not traitors who you and your suppoters think that shouldn't be on this site. They are here for years and will remain. They are jats in soul and body. Only thing is they have different point of view. They feel for the community as strongly as you if not more.

    Even I would support all those who oppose reservation. Bhai Jitender Hooda has qouted an example on another thread that shows how Yadav's are benifited from reservation. If they weren't in Backward class category, 50% of them wonn't get any seat. But same time we can argue that if there is no reservation at all that percentile may go down to 10% or whatever % is Yadavs all together.

    - Cant get your point here?

    To support my contention, I would like to mention about the progress made by lower castes migrants to smaller countries like Fiji, New Gini, Mauritius and Surinam , trinidad and Tobago etc. Mostly who migrated to those countries were laboureres from lower strata of society. I should say mostly SC"s. They are now 100 times better than their own people those who remained in India. They had no reservation, rather they had to combat against reservation to locals. In Fizi living and working for 125 years and mostly 5-6th generation have no land rights. They achieved everything against all odds because they had no route to escape. They had no money to go back.


    - Deshwal ji … unpe to sir pe padi thi … wo kahya Karen ne … “Bagula to apni aae mare … tun kyun mari bater” ….…. Kya ek 85-90% aala balak nue kahe ek meri sarkar mene utni seat to dyo ki atleast compete to karun … kya ye escape hai? Deshwal ji aapki baat tab 100% theek manta mein agar bharpoor opportunity and seats hote hue bhi jat nue kahete ek aur dyo humne to … in present situations these don’t seems to be practical to me … may be this is due to immaturity … ya phir jis level pe aap soch pa rahe hein experience ke karan mein nahi dekh pa raha hun benefits is baat ke …

    Who got benifited with present reservation scenerio. I believe, only a section of a particular class. For example, only a section of chamars from SC and A section of Meenas in ST, who obviously shouldn't be in that class at all. What % of Sc are there from Balmikis or what % of STs are Santhal, Bhils or Mundas get selected in different state or central jobs? Percentage of those get benifited from lower level is negligible but only the creamy layer gets the benifit.

    – Deshwal ji … I have given few examples below … don’t you feel that those should have been admitted? Kya wo unke parents ki (jo dono master hein) creamy layer itni creamy hai ki they don’t deserve this much favour? Agar kya ek matr naukri wale ke bache isse benefited ho rahe hein, chahe sarkar unko creamy layer ka kaheti ho … uchit nahi hai?

    Finally, i would support the idea of creating infrastructure and facilities for all poor of every section of the society.In addition to that we can contribute as an individual. Col. Jagmohan used to say that we have to start from own example and I echo his sentiments .For the benefit of the members who have recently joined, Col Jagmohan is our distinguished member who moved from a luxurious life of Bombay to a Village in Haryana to help the rural kids. So, start helping atleast one needy relative or known rural child. Jatland par bhasanbaji se revolution nahi aata. The revolution starts from within.. from you from me and from every responsible member of the community.

    – Deshwal ji ….ye bhajan bhookhe aadmi ne na suhavein … ek chikya aud aadmi ee inka anand le sake hai …. (NO PUN intended) … jis aadmi ne aapne aap apne jeevan ke rasse hoe rahenge wo kitka janjagriti mein bhag lega …. Nue kahega re kime do bhakhat ki roti ka to jugad rooh sir ho len de … pher sochange …

    "Lekin ek baat solah aane such hai ki jo iss raste par chalne ki koshish karta hai, kuchh ne kuchh jaroor hasil kar leta hai, Kam se kam aapne bachon mein achhe sanaskaar jaroor bhar deta hai".

    – Bilkul sahi kaho ho deshwal ji … par thodi si kasar hai … sirf sanaskaar se to jindagi nahi chalti na … kuch apni mehanat ke hissab se kaman-khan ka rah bhi hona chahiye …

    Cheers!
    Deshwal ji, I am quoting two cases here below, please go through them and tell me where the problem with these two youngsters is.

    1) One of my known who has just passed 10+2 and tried for MBBS. She is really good in studies … she filled up a few forms because of high form fees. His father is a master and can hardly manage their studies along with the other house hold expenditure within his single income in rohtak city. Girl worked really hard and scored above 85% in both 10th and 10+2. She can’t get expensive coachings and also the notes like brilliants etc. but she keep on putting hard efforts. Mein te jib bhi jaon bichari padhti ee paya kare … (eeb ghane hade nue argue kar sake hein ek sirf padhan te baat na banya kare … she should have something in mind … so for those she is really good). But now what happened in PMT results … in all the results she merely missed.

    a. Its not that she was not deserving but its only because that the seats are less to fight into …
    b. It’s also that there are candidates with more facilities or trainings or coachings … with same calibre … so they took a slight edge … which she can’t because of her father’s less capacity to spend on her.
    c. Also there are candidates who have calibre of above 95% and they will sure shot go through the results … and they deserve that …. Par kya ye ladki jo ki 85-90% ke calibre ki hai … ab aise hi rahe jaegi? Uska baap uske upar ek saal aur bhi laga de … agle saal phir utni hi seatein aur utne hi calibre ke bache … man lo wo phir minute number se rahe gae …(that is in the next live example) … to kya wo Bsc karke phir bEd karva denge ya MSc … phir kahin shadi kar denge … kya ye nyay hai us bachi ke sath? Kya uske ander calibre nahi hai? Wo aur uska baap usse kahan tak leja paega is mahol mein? Agle saal na huya to uske father ke nue bhi lag jyagi ek bhai doosra chora bhi hai uske liye bhi kharcha hai … pher iska kal ne byah bhi karna hai … ghar banana hai … har mahine nue aakhir mein 1000-1200 kisse yare pyare pe lete lete kitne din bajavega wo ….

    2) Other one … she was in 10 positions in haryana in 10th … ghar ke bahut raji hue … er uske pita ne padhai aache te … kudarti wo bhi master ee hai … pahele saal na huya pmt mein rahegi madi si kasar … pher kheecha tani karke 1 saal drop karva diya … iss bari uska 2 number te rahegya batavein… eeb ke karenge we? Was she again less deserving? Eeb bsc mein admission divavenge usne … ha ha eeb uske babu ki aukat na ek usne civil ki tyari karva dega ya phd tahin ghar bitha lega … she would have to be married and then after it will totally depend on the other person and family which way it will swing …

    contd...

  2. #62

    Contd....

    Ye donu chori isse tabke te hein joki kosis karein hein kheech tan karke apne sukhh mar ke balak padhae … er pher jib we safal bhi na ho pae to ke milya … eeb ye donu doctor ban jyati je category mein hoti to … chahe BC-B hi kyona hota … kae ghar sudharte …

    To ye ho raha hai kabil jat bachon ka hasr … unmein kabliyat ki kami nahi hai … wo kabil hein aur agar mauka mile to aache doctor engineer banke dikha sakte hein … lekin unko dhakela jar raha hai hashiye par … yahan reservation ke demand nahi kar rahe hein ye log … ye soch ke chalo ki ye log sirf utni seeton ki demand kar rahe hein jinke liye wo lad sakein … ek to itni population and competition … aur uspe phir ye reservation … kitne bache safal honge … wohi honge jo upar ke 5-7% hein baki bichare to nue rahe jyange … waise to hum ladkiyo ki wakalat karte hein … lekin aisi sthiti mein maa-baap ye sochne par majboor ho jata hai ki ladke pe jyada dyan dein ya ladki par … agar unko ye lage ki ladki par dhyan denge aur wo kuch banke niklegi to wo kudh hi mehanat karenge else they will spent less on them kyonki kitni bhi mehanat kar lo rahene wahi dhak ke teen paat hein to kyun paise bhi lagae … apne karao BA/bed er byah dyo …

    Doosra aap dekh sakte ho ki aaj mainly jats kahan se nikal rahe hein …IT sector … jahan reservation nahi hai abhi tak … yatinder ne jaisa kaha ,,., kuch saal baad ye log jab private mein bhi reservation kar denge to yahi halat wahan ho jaegi … aapne bache mehanat karne mein koe hichak nahi karte … aur isiliye bahut sare ab bahar nikal gae hein … kahin bhi dekho jat milta hai … aur mostly from IT …

    1)aur ye baat bhi dhyan dene ki hai ki …. Jitney bhi bahar nikalte hein unmein se bahut kam waapas India jate hein … yahin settle ho jate hein … (a little bit personal but Deshwal ji aap bhi wahan ki opportunities aur bacho ke surakhsit bhavishya ko dekh kar hi wahan settle ho gae ho shayad?) … yahi major sawal har kisi ke samne hota hai .. aur bahut sare ye soch kar ki yaar kal ne India mein bacho ko naukri to hein nahi … to kya karenege wahan jakar … migrations will be more and more … jis kisse ka bhi byont hai wohe bahar liked jya hai … chahe padhai ke liye aur chahe job ke liye … aur shuru mein kite bartan manje hein … kite storan mein pizza supply Karen hein … par ulte nahi jate … kyon? Asurakshit bhavishya India mein?

    2)Soch ke dekho je nue jiska daa lagega wohe bhaj lega hude te to kon bachega … nire bihari rahenge haryane mein, er jo rahe jyange apne bhai band … unke balak jail mein pavenge … kyun naukri te milengi nahi to galle pakadenge er chakku marenge …

    3)Eeb nue batao 11103 candidates mein sirf 100 seetein admission ke liye?? Er same economy ke bande compete kare hein … yadav kahan se kam hein? To indirectly ye reservation ki demand utni seetein provide karne ke liye hein jinmein aadmi kam se kam compete to kar sake …

    4) Mene nue lage hai ek jib thoda scope dikhega ek lyo thara bhi admission ho sake hai to ghane jat balak apply karenge er mehanat karenege .... ek lyo thoda hanga la dyo baat ban jyagi ...

    Deswal ji, kindly clear point by point so that I can think from your angle at it

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooljat View Post
    Ravi Bhai
    very sensible n logical answer!!
    kudos to u!!

    Btw, discussion ka time gaya abhi now its action time....I wonder what Haryana Jats r doing to get Reservation???

    Jats from Rajasthan acquired it long ago with out any blood....what u ppl r doin??

    Rock on
    Jit
    Though its correct that its not time to debate but to act. I'll make one last humble submission to people opposing reservation that they can always remain and apply in general category even if Jats get reservattion as OBC. But by opposing reservation here on Jatland they are really stopping some promising and needy Jat youths from entering into good service.

    There are so many other forums here where we can always debate but here at least on this reservation issue we can have consensus even if it is wrong, say for the benefit of poor Jat people in villages.

    I've quoted the frustration of Jat youths by quoting Capt. Bhopal Singh (a close associate of Tikait) Murder. Where one angry Jat youth shot him dead. As quoted in news paper- he took some money for his job which he could not provide him.

    As Ravi Bhai puts it rightly:I want to ask one simple question to those opposing resevation of jats that out of 100 jobs what they would like to see.
    10 jats (while jat being in general quota)
    or 40 jats (while jat being in OBC quota)


    We Jats proudly proclaim Jai Jawan, Jai Kisan and say that we are feeding the country and at the same time defending it by giving our lives in army. But to be very true a Jat youth joins army as sipahi because he needs job. When that sipahi dies, in some Jat or other regiment whole country salutes him but his mother certainly weeps knowing fully well that his son went there for job only.
    Similarly Jat is forced to remain in village for agriculture because he has got no avenues outside. Even when no reservation was there and Jats were sometimes in power at centre/state, like Charan Singh, Devi Lal and Chhoturam, condition of kisan was miserable. its no better now a days also, where many kisans keep committing suicide every now and then.

    Now what kind of justice is this that Jat feeds the nation and Jat defends the nation with khoon-pasina, other people comfortably rule over him in nation. Lower classes by using the weapon of reservation and upper classes to shuru se hain hi.

    People opposing reservation here mostly give the logic

    1. Is se kisi ka fayda nahin hua

    Ans. When country got freedom almost all CMs or majority of them and PM were brahmins. They were equally good in coveted govt jobs also. Brahmin IAS lobby still remains the strongest even today. The bottom most were SC/ST. They escaped all higher castes by finding refuse through reservation. All other castes kept crying that reservation is wrong, against the nation, merit etc. Aur is reservation se kisi ko koi fayda nahin hua. SC did not pay any heed to such slogans. They were clear in their approach. Their leaders were openly saying "Aarakshan se liya SP/DM aur vote se lenge CM/PM". PM,CM,DM,SP are four most powerful posts in our constitution. Today SC IAS lobby is strongest only to be exceeded by Bramin lobby perhaps even more than that. They are heading towards CM/PM also. The most populous state is independently controlled by them. And Brahmins there are accepting them their leaders.

    Yadavs controlled two most populous states UP and Bihar independently after reservation.

    So, this logic is misleading that reservation se kisi ko koi fayda nahin hua and hence Jats should oppose it.

    Chalo, reservation se Jat ko koi phayda ho ya na ho but Jats opposing reservation can not tell ki Is se Jat ko aakhir nuksan kya hai?

    2. That among SC only higher strata got its benefit. Balmiki's are still at the bottom.

    Ans. With due regard and no offence to anyone, that everybody knows. More than that Balmikis themselves know that. Its Jatland and not Balmiki land. Mostly, we are Jats who's discussing here. Conveying such logics here would mean that there is a lacuna in this reservation policy.Thats why Jats should oppose it and poor Jat youths of village should be deprived from jobs. Aur hum yahan Balmiki ka theka kyon le rahe hain? However, in such cases Balmikis can fight for creamy layer concept. Similar can do poor Jats once they have reservation. And as Hudaji puts it ki ek-do aur Jaton ka bhi bhala yadi reservation se ho gaya bhale hi ve creamy layer ke hon to kuchh to Jat ko phayda hua kum se kum nuksan to kuchh nahin hai.

    3. Reservation is vote bank policy.

    Ans. Yes, it may be. But who stops jats from encashing this vote bank policy? particularly when 80% population of India is encashing it. Its legal and constitutional.

    After independence country was broadly divided into three classes. One was traditional upper classes Brahmin, Rajput, Kayastha etc. Second was SC/ST and third was the majority which is now OBC about 70%. As Jat fairly good in OBC so it was frequently reaching PM/DPM post on their own as Kissan or rural/village India leader. After the implementation of OBC other majority castes was cut off from Jats. Never again Jat could dream reaching PM/DPM independently till today and never can he do in future also. Leaders dont come by magic. Its vote and policies that bring them. Now Jats are in 15-20% upper castes. Aur un me ye sub se phissadi hain. Punjab me badi mushkil se Chhoturam ne inhen Baniyon se bachaya tha. Kaise kaise ye Rajasthan me Rajput se bach ke nikle hain. Aur ab phir inhin aise hi logon me ja ke baithe hain. I'm not to spread venom against these castes but to make Jat realise that 15-20% me to sub Jat se upper hain hi aur neeche ke 80% bhi us se reservation ke karan upper hain. Phir Jat kyon sub se neeche rahne pe tula hua hai.

    Further fear comes when OBC demands 70% reservation. Now law may not allow it but 80% percent majority can always ammend the laws in parliament. Moreover, as Ravi bhai rightly puts is that sooner or later reservation is going to be put in private sector and IT sector also. Who knows demand may go later even to agricultural land also then where will Jat go?

    Lastly concluding practically:

    Reservation is the most serious issue concerning the survival of poor Jats today in India.

    1. Its debate and everybody is free here to put his views in favour or opposition. So, I'll request Hoodaji, Takharji, Raviji and others to prepare usual common questions which are usually raised by people here again and again. I hope enough answers now we have for them. These brief question-answere or brief or detailed discussion on reservation can be prepared. I support Kharabji that not mine but some such template should be automatically displayed when again this issue is raised here.

    If any new logic comes to the mind in favouring or opposing reservation it can be raised but repeating same points will be a wastage of time.

    2. Some practical action in this direction is also welcome. We can create a group. We can join some other groups doing something in this direction.

    regards
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 21st, 2007 at 05:26 PM.

  4. #64
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    all Jat brothers, thanks for your views and pain.
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 22nd, 2007 at 08:16 AM.

  5. #65
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    bhai siddharth , u correctly puts that we need not to discuss repeatadly the same thing. and questionnaire would be good solution for that.

    for the same, i m putting my views for the doubt that is generally raised and also pointed in other thread about reservation.

    reservation will demotivate jat boy to work hard.
    actually I feel the opposite of it. In present time of fierce competition sometimes students and parents have to make hard decision depending upon resources and possibility of success. one example is given by hooda bhai.
    For example for preparing for civil services exam a person should be 100% dedicated and that can take 2-3 years. so some people even doesnot take this although they can do it considering the risk factor is very high.
    But if they found that they are fare chances and possibility is good they can opt for this exam. civil service is one example this can be applied to any competition.

    so in my view, reservation which will increase the chances and possibility of clearing the competition(academics or job) and will motivate jat people to go for better things.

  6. #66

    How To Get It- Reservation Must ?

    http://www.jatland.com/forums/showth...rvation&page=2

    http://www.jatland.com/forums/search...5&pp=25&page=7


    RESERVATION-MUST.HOW TO GET IT??????????
    Dear friend since you started this topic.jats got the reservation in Rajshthan, up, mp,Delhi etc how to get it in haryana ,panjab.hp. J&k etc /???????????????????
    reservation is going to stay for long time. weather we like it or not, for or against. All jats must get it to survive, no other way


    Dear friends this was my Q on 22 March 2002 and I am repeating thia again. This is my view now and also on that day.
    There are 7 pages of 300 threads on this subject on this site.
    this will not be last- Good for time pass.
    Jat ko Samjhana bhagwan ky kahbu sy bhi bahar hae.
    I was part of the DR Gayanparkash Pilaniya team in Rajsthan resevation movement. I was invited by Dr GhasiRam Verma and his team to Sanghariya to help in this movement. We made a solid plan for a peaceful movement.
    Unity on ground level and on public platform.
    We used mass media and pressure from all over world. We got resevation by very peaceful- Democartic way.
    Why we can not do in Haryana now.
    We asked every CM from Haryana. We asked on 13 March 2005 to CM Haryana Hooda Sahib
    in International Jat Conference inNew Delhi.
    Hooda Sahib ny Kahan koe mujh ko Iska fayda batlade- Samjha dae to Bat karengy.
    Hamne kaha Jab Rajsthan-UP- MP- Delhi ky Jatoo ko benefit mil raha tao
    Haryana ko Perhej kuon hae. Yah DR Pilanaya sahib Benefit Samjha dengy.
    Aur kase milega Yah bhi Samjha dengy- aur AP 5 Yrs CM bhi aram se Bane rahogy/
    har Jagah Politics chalti hae-
    Jab Hooda sahib opposition thae 1999- Khud resevation support kar han.
    Depender Ky liye Aur uske Father ky liye Ak to yahi Kam hae
    unka statement yad dela raha hun

    Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda

    http://www.indianexpress.com/res/web.../ige23105.html
    Give Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda
    EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE


    CHANDIGARH, Oct 22: Haryana Congress president Bhupinder Singh Hooda today demanded OBC status for Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois, Tyagis and Rors.
    In a statement here, Hooda said there should be no discrimination against Jats in Haryana when they had been accorded the OBC status in Rajasthan and Delhi.

    He added that the Gurnam Singh Commission had recommended inclusion of Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois and Rors in the list of OBC. The HPCC president asked Haryana Chief Minister Om Parkash Chatuala to clarify his stand on the recommendations of the commission.

    "Chautala must inform whether he will accord the OBC status to these communities," he said.

    He also congratulated Rajasthan Chief Minister Ashok Gehlot and the Delhi Chief Minister for taking positive steps by conferring OBC status on Jats in their states.

    Copyright © 1999 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.
    Last edited by ranjitjat; June 22nd, 2007 at 12:04 PM.
    Jay Jawan Jay Kisan Jay Shaheed

  7. #67
    Can't we fight for NO RESERVATION ON CASTE BASIS, FINANCIAL BASIS ONLY.

    I feel the reservation must not be there on the caste basis and even if everybody want's reservation it must not include the creamy layer.
    -Virender M.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by ranjitjat View Post

    There are 7 pages of 300 threads on this subject on this site.
    this will not be last- Good for time pass.
    Dharampal ji, Itne sahi shabd chahe kadve lagte hon lekin sachai hai ye ... yahan bhi is thread par jo ki kadiyan saab ne ek petition ke liye dala tha ... members unki petition ne to bhool ge lage hein er ek doosre ne samjhan mein jyada jut ge ... bhaiyo jo iske favour mein hein ek be in kadyan jiyan ka bhi man rakh lyo ... apne tahi ee hai yo ... ho sake hai kite ya petition bhi kime affect dale ... it will hardly take 2-3 minutes to go there on the site and put your signs ....

    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/res...ity-in-haryana

    there are many supporting posts on this thread but only 5 signatures on the petition ...

    Thanks ...

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by mann123 View Post
    Can't we fight for NO RESERVATION ON CASTE BASIS, FINANCIAL BASIS ONLY.

    I feel the reservation must not be there on the caste basis and even if everybody want's reservation it must not include the creamy layer.
    Maan saab aapki baat 100 takke ki hai ... par mere bhai yo fight aala kaam duniya khatir ye jat ek be kudh ne reservation mile pache nahi kar sakte ke .... eebe cheekna jaroori hai ke ....

  10. #70

    Thumbs up Gajab ki post ....

    Quote Originally Posted by ranjitjat View Post
    We asked every CM from Haryana. We asked on 13 March 2005 to CM Haryana Hooda Sahib
    in International Jat Conference inNew Delhi.
    Hooda Sahib ny Kahan koe mujh ko Iska fayda batlade- Samjha dae to Bat karengy.
    Hamne kaha Jab Rajsthan-UP- MP- Delhi ky Jatoo ko benefit mil raha tao
    Haryana ko Perhej kuon hae. Yah DR Pilanaya sahib Benefit Samjha dengy.
    Aur kase milega Yah bhi Samjha dengy- aur AP 5 Yrs CM bhi aram se Bane rahogy/
    har Jagah Politics chalti hae-
    Jab Hooda sahib opposition thae 1999- Khud resevation support kar han.
    Depender Ky liye Aur uske Father ky liye Ak to yahi Kam hae
    unka statement yad dela raha hun

    Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda

    http://www.indianexpress.com/res/web.../ige23105.html
    Give Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda
    EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE


    CHANDIGARH, Oct 22: Haryana Congress president Bhupinder Singh Hooda today demanded OBC status for Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois, Tyagis and Rors.
    In a statement here, Hooda said there should be no discrimination against Jats in Haryana when they had been accorded the OBC status in Rajasthan and Delhi.

    He added that the Gurnam Singh Commission had recommended inclusion of Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois and Rors in the list of OBC. The HPCC president asked Haryana Chief Minister Om Parkash Chatuala to clarify his stand on the recommendations of the commission.

    "Chautala must inform whether he will accord the OBC status to these communities," he said.

    He also congratulated Rajasthan Chief Minister Ashok Gehlot and the Delhi Chief Minister for taking positive steps by conferring OBC status on Jats in their states.

    Copyright © 1999 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.

    RK JI this is the thing noted by you and you should take this to Deepender .... kathni aur karni mein antar nahi hona chahiye ...

    Dharampal ji ... mein nue sochun tha ek aap itne din ho liye er jaton ke hit ke thread par chup kyun ho ... but its really the nice bang you made ... sach ko aanch nahi ...

    Halanki mujhe aasha hai bahut iss sarkar se ... aur khaskar Deepender se ki being a learned and polite person he would go through all these positive critics and will take some steps ... but it will be really bad if they also will turn and take a 360 degree angle at it ...

    This is win-win situation both for jats and Bhupinder hooda sarkar ... it will benefit him and deepender in long run in politics ,.... jaisa ki Dharampal ji ne kaha ... ki phir chahe jaise bhi politics karo ... golden words Dharampal ji ...

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by mann123 View Post
    Can't we fight for NO RESERVATION ON CASTE BASIS, FINANCIAL BASIS ONLY.

    I feel the reservation must not be there on the caste basis and even if everybody want's reservation it must not include the creamy layer.
    We must have been fighting for it, I suppose! But we lost the battle there. So better as loser in the battle join the winner and take whatever advantage you can get.

    yes, there is concept of creamy layer in reservation. Bhai ji ek bar reservation le to lo baad me creamy layer bhi hata dena. Jab tak do-char Jat bhi creamy layer ke phaltu aa ge govt service me to kya nuksan hai?
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 28th, 2007 at 11:28 AM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by dalal_ravi View Post
    bhai siddharth , u correctly puts that we need not to discuss repeatadly the same thing. and questionnaire would be good solution for that.

    for the same, i m putting my views for the doubt that is generally raised and also pointed in other thread about reservation.

    reservation will demotivate jat boy to work hard.
    actually I feel the opposite of it. In present time of fierce competition sometimes students and parents have to make hard decision depending upon resources and possibility of success. one example is given by hooda bhai.
    For example for preparing for civil services exam a person should be 100% dedicated and that can take 2-3 years. so some people even doesnot take this although they can do it considering the risk factor is very high.
    But if they found that they are fare chances and possibility is good they can opt for this exam. civil service is one example this can be applied to any competition.

    so in my view, reservation which will increase the chances and possibility of clearing the competition(academics or job) and will motivate jat people to go for better things.
    Its rightly said. Meenas and SC rose like anything and were nowhere demotivated. Gujjars demanding and dying for it are not fools. Jat boy is more demotivated when he is unemployed and becomes criminal while his counterpart yadav/gujjar/meena gets job due to reservation having equal social/economic status. I've quoted earlier Jat and Meenas have common hukka in Rajasthan.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ranjitjat View Post
    http://www.jatland.com/forums/showth...rvation&page=2

    http://www.jatland.com/forums/search...5&pp=25&page=7


    RESERVATION-MUST.HOW TO GET IT??????????
    Dear friend since you started this topic.jats got the reservation in Rajshthan, up, mp,Delhi etc how to get it in haryana ,panjab.hp. J&k etc /???????????????????
    reservation is going to stay for long time. weather we like it or not, for or against. All jats must get it to survive, no other way


    Dear friends this was my Q on 22 March 2002 and I am repeating thia again. This is my view now and also on that day.
    There are 7 pages of 300 threads on this subject on this site.
    this will not be last- Good for time pass.
    Jat ko Samjhana bhagwan ky kahbu sy bhi bahar hae.
    I was part of the DR Gayanparkash Pilaniya team in Rajsthan resevation movement. I was invited by Dr GhasiRam Verma and his team to Sanghariya to help in this movement. We made a solid plan for a peaceful movement.
    Unity on ground level and on public platform.
    We used mass media and pressure from all over world. We got resevation by very peaceful- Democartic way.
    Why we can not do in Haryana now.
    We asked every CM from Haryana. We asked on 13 March 2005 to CM Haryana Hooda Sahib
    in International Jat Conference inNew Delhi.
    Hooda Sahib ny Kahan koe mujh ko Iska fayda batlade- Samjha dae to Bat karengy.
    Hamne kaha Jab Rajsthan-UP- MP- Delhi ky Jatoo ko benefit mil raha tao
    Haryana ko Perhej kuon hae. Yah DR Pilanaya sahib Benefit Samjha dengy.
    Aur kase milega Yah bhi Samjha dengy- aur AP 5 Yrs CM bhi aram se Bane rahogy/
    har Jagah Politics chalti hae-
    Jab Hooda sahib opposition thae 1999- Khud resevation support kar han.
    Depender Ky liye Aur uske Father ky liye Ak to yahi Kam hae
    unka statement yad dela raha hun

    Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda

    http://www.indianexpress.com/res/web.../ige23105.html
    Give Jats in Haryana OBC status, says Hooda
    EXPRESS NEWS SERVICE


    CHANDIGARH, Oct 22: Haryana Congress president Bhupinder Singh Hooda today demanded OBC status for Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois, Tyagis and Rors.
    In a statement here, Hooda said there should be no discrimination against Jats in Haryana when they had been accorded the OBC status in Rajasthan and Delhi.

    He added that the Gurnam Singh Commission had recommended inclusion of Jats, Jat Sikhs, Bishnois and Rors in the list of OBC. The HPCC president asked Haryana Chief Minister Om Parkash Chatuala to clarify his stand on the recommendations of the commission.

    "Chautala must inform whether he will accord the OBC status to these communities," he said.

    He also congratulated Rajasthan Chief Minister Ashok Gehlot and the Delhi Chief Minister for taking positive steps by conferring OBC status on Jats in their states.

    Copyright © 1999 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.
    16 aane such baat hai. I suggest some group in Haryana should be made under the leadership/guidance of Dudeeji and other like minded, experienced and dedicated persons. Lets achieve the goal now, like we did it in Rajasthan. Already much water has flowed.
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 28th, 2007 at 12:13 PM.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by jitendershooda View Post
    Dharampal ji, Itne sahi shabd chahe kadve lagte hon lekin sachai hai ye ... yahan bhi is thread par jo ki kadiyan saab ne ek petition ke liye dala tha ... members unki petition ne to bhool ge lage hein er ek doosre ne samjhan mein jyada jut ge ... bhaiyo jo iske favour mein hein ek be in kadyan jiyan ka bhi man rakh lyo ... apne tahi ee hai yo ... ho sake hai kite ya petition bhi kime affect dale ... it will hardly take 2-3 minutes to go there on the site and put your signs ....

    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/res...ity-in-haryana

    there are many supporting posts on this thread but only 5 signatures on the petition ...

    Thanks ...
    very practical, Hooda Sahb. I've signed the petition.

    I agree with you and Dudiji. Mostly people take this reservation issue as time pass only. But I've requested earlier also that let anybody do it elsewhere but this topic at least should be taken most seriously. Its the dire need for our young generation. Misguiding the youth here that no, there is no benefit to you by reservation is not good. If one can not do any good to Jat boy then please do not harm him also.

    I've seen when a young Jat misses some competition by a few marks only and his Gujjar/Meena/Yadav friend gets through scoring same or less marks he definitely curses his community ukk mhare bade budhe aur baki sub neta kya kar rahe hain. And truly there I do not see any fault, incompetency or lacuna in that Jat boy. But in this case fault, incompetency or lacuna us Jat boy ke bade budhe logon aur netaon me hai jo use reservation nahin dilwa paye jabki Gujjar/Yadav/Meena/SC/ST/OBC ke neta aur bade budhe ye kam kar gaye.

    vo yahi rota hai ki "Ya to mere Aadarshwadi Bade Budhe Jat aur Neta sub ki reservation rok dete aur ya phir meri bhi reservation kar dete. Mujhe to inhon ne dono taraf se mara hai. yadi koi reservation na hoti to bhi me ye seat le jata aur yadi meri bhi reservation hoti to bhi me ye seat le jata. In ke is seudo-adarshwad ne mujhe kahin ka nahin chhoda. Sabhi jatiyon ke Bade Budhe aur Neta apne bachon ka bhavishya samvarte hain aur hamare Bade Budhe aur Neta hamara bhavishya ujadte hain. Forward caste ke log to reservation ko is liye oppose karte hain kyonki unhen pata hai ki unhen to ye kabhi milni nahin hai aur unki is opposition me hi un ke bachon ka bhavishya hai. Ye Jat faltu ke moorkh ban rahe hain un ke sath rah kar. Kaash! me Jat nahin hota! Yadi forward hota to shahar me kahin achhe se ghar me paida hota, badhiya coaching leta, puri public school ki mehngi padhai karta to me forward me bhi ye seat le marta. Aur yadi me OBC/SC/ST me hota to reservation se ye seat le marta. Adarshwadi Jaton ke ye bade bade logic meri samajh me nahin aate. Mera koi career hota, roti-dal ka kuchh jugad hota to me unke ye logic sunta bhi"

    Aur jab ye Jat boy naukri na milne se barbad hota hai ya phir criminal banta hai to us ka dosh bhi is Jat boy ko nahin balki us ke Bade Budhe aur Netaon ya phir non-reservationist Jaton ko hi jata hai. I must remind people here that enormous (almost suicidal) frustration is there in any student when he misses his target by a few marks.
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 28th, 2007 at 02:00 PM.

  15. #75
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    Talking

    samajh me nahin aata ki hamare bade budhe aur neta aise kaise ho gaye!
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 28th, 2007 at 09:56 PM.

  16. #76
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    Sometines in history crucial junctions came for Jats, they boldly and wisely faced them. This again is crucial do or die situation for Jats.
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 28th, 2007 at 09:52 PM.

  17. #77
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    if Jats do not act now then it'll be too late.....
    Last edited by kasutajatram; June 30th, 2007 at 11:35 AM.

  18. #78
    Majorities of yester years are the minorities of today.Reservation is nothing but a shelter of NIKKAMAPAN.No body wants to work..reservation de dyo arr gharran tankhwa bhejj dyo....What a stupid thought.becoming competitive is the answer.BAISAKHIYON par chal kar lambi yatra sambhav nahin.
    "LIFE TEACHES EVERY ONE IN A NATURAL WAY.NO ONE CAN ESCAPE THIS REALITY"

  19. #79
    You are wrong. Reservations dont make people uncompetitive, rather reservations for disadvantaged sections creat enough incentives for them to try entering the competition and become competitive. There is whole set of literature on this aspect of reservations or what we call as affermative action. A lot of empirical work is available on affirmative action and its imoprtance both for India and Western Countries..esp USA. But that is beyond your ability to comprehend.

    Moreover, none of us here is qualified enoug to give final judgments as to what is the best coures of action. So, my suggestion is, we all align our ideas with the ideas of Jat Intelligencia working under Jat Mahasabha. Learned Jats and experienced leaders working through Jat Mahasabha are better equipped than any of us here to propose future course of action. And Jat Mahasabha has clearly stated its position, that is, Jats all over india should be included under OBC reservation. So, rather than each of us creating own opinion without full understanding of the issues, we should align our ideas with what our learned Jat elders in Jat Mahasabha have proposed.

  20. #80
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    Jitender, starting here by your suggestion, as you have posted abt IIM in haryana, What Say, let it be builded first or shud start demanding Reservation in it for haryanvi jats as a separate issue...:D..

    Its good thread for the brainstroming of reservation issues.
    Last edited by Samarkadian; June 4th, 2008 at 06:49 PM.
    "All I am trying to do is bridge the gap between Jats and Rest of World"

    As I shall imagine, so shall I become.

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