Do we Jat really need Reservation ?

[rajivsp]

For many years, I have been just a reader of these discussions and I got lots of information about my cast JAT. I was born in Bilsoori, Bulandshahr and brought up in Jaipur with mostly Punjabis and Marwaris, so I did not know much about this cast.

Whenever I came to forum,a message always welcomes me
Rajeev Singh Paweria ! are you sure You have nothing to Say?

And really I had nothing to say, There are so many learned persons giving their valuable opinions, So I was just enjoying them.

Even today, I do not want to say something rather want to know after reading the thread "Jat are making history........"

"do we really need reservation ?"

My daughter is MAITREYI after the name of wife of Yagvalkya ( There are only 300 people in the history of mankind who had Ved-Vision, and 13 among them were Women, Meitreyi was one of them).

My son is Dev Vratha after the name of Bhishma - grandfather of Arjun.


I am afraid if I will avail reservation for my kids, how close would the personalities of my kids to the personalities of real Maitreyi and Dev Vratha?

One side we are saying from RAMA to HARSHAVARDHANA all were Jat and ruled over India for many centuries ( Ref. People on Jatland.com), on other side seeking reservation on the ground of social backwardness. I cannot understand.

And if we will get reservation, as of now I am already in reserved category based on my birth in UP and domicile of Rajasthan, How many Jat children will grow like Kapil Dev, Dharmendra, Sir Chhotu Ram, Charan Singh, Hari Singh Nalawa, Ashoka the Great......................

Maximum they will get a better job....

and Job is job....

A Servant is a Servant from Peon to IAS.
A Servant can obey his Master only, He can't become a Leader......

And Leaders are must to uplift the community.

Unfortunately modern education can produce only Servants not Leaders...


Punjabis and Sindhis came to India empty handed and now they are doing very well.
I met many Sindhis families migrated to Indonesia, Singapore, HK during partition. They are doing exceptionally well.
Birlaji came to Calcutta empty handed, became one of the richest person of India.
In America in the list of Fortune 500 many Indians names are there among top 50.
Dr. Deepak Chopra is among 100 top heroes of the century in America.

Once I was flying to London and one Punjabi Jat gentleman met me , he was born and brought up in Singapore and after WWII came to London and served in UK Police, He told me that Jats are different, Even his superiors used to tell him that his thinking and working style is totally different from rest of Indians. And He was awarded for his services by British Police.

....................

Thanks for your precious time.........
Please don't answer to this post. just think and give your opinion in poll

[ygulia]

For many years, I have been just a reader of these discussions and I got lots of information about my cast JAT. I was born in Bilsoori, Bulandshahr and brought up in Jaipur with mostly Punjabis and Marwaris, so I did not know much about this cast.

Whenever I came to forum,a message always welcomes me
Rajeev Singh Paweria ! are you sure You have nothing to Say?

And really I had nothing to say, There are so many learned persons giving their valuable opinions, So I was just enjoying them.

Even today, I do not want to say something rather want to know after reading the thread "Jat are making history........"

"do we really need reservation ?"

My daughter is MAITREYI after the name of wife of Yagvalkya ( There are only 300 people in the history of mankind who had Ved-Vision, and 13 among them were Women, Meitreyi was one of them).

My son is Dev Vratha after the name of Bhishma - grandfather of Arjun.


I am afraid if I will avail reservation for my kids, how close would the personalities of my kids to the personalities of real Maitreyi and Dev Vratha?

One side we are saying from RAMA to HARSHAVARDHANA all were Jat and ruled over India for many centuries ( Ref. People on Jatland.com), on other side seeking reservation on the ground of social backwardness. I cannot understand.

And if we will get reservation, as of now I am already in reserved category based on my birth in UP and domicile of Rajasthan, How many Jat children will grow like Kapil Dev, Dharmendra, Sir Chhotu Ram, Charan Singh, Hari Singh Nalawa, Ashoka the Great......................

Maximum they will get a better job....

and Job is job....

A Servant is a Servant from Peon to IAS.
A Servant can obey his Master only, He can't become a Leader......

And Leaders are must to uplift the community.

Unfortunately modern education can produce only Servants not Leaders...


Punjabis and Sindhis came to India empty handed and now they are doing very well.
I met many Sindhis families migrated to Indonesia, Singapore, HK during partition. They are doing exceptionally well.
Birlaji came to Calcutta empty handed, became one of the richest person of India.
In America in the list of Fortune 500 many Indians names are there among top 50.
Dr. Deepak Chopra is among 100 top heroes of the century in America.

Once I was flying to London and one Punjabi Jat gentleman met me , he was born and brought up in Singapore and after WWII came to London and served in UK Police, He told me that Jats are different, Even his superiors used to tell him that his thinking and working style is totally different from rest of Indians. And He was awarded for his services by British Police.

....................

Thanks for your precious time.........
Please don't answer to this post. just think and give your opinion in poll

It is my personal view, therefore, please avoid comments on it.
I think we do not need reservation in the present scenario of the country.
Reasons and facts:
1) Jats would have been given resevation under Mandal commission but they were denied because Mandal said they are economically well off. The observation of Mandal commission was based on prosperity of Jat sikhs. Example of Jat sikh is known to every one. If they can prosper why not we.
2) We need to change our attitude towards life: We are so attached to the place we are born that we do not like to leave that place for betterment. I mean we should look for green pasture else where too(Migration may be within the country).
3) There are poor in every community. Reservation is not the solution to the problem of poverty.
4) Reservation is for socially down trodden.
5) We need to improve little bit on our attitude otherwise we are hardworking and intelligent.

[desijat]

After my 12th examination, i applied to NIFT into fashion technology, NIFT's first ever 4 years garment manufactring technology for funsake after being forced by one of my friends. Unfortunatly he couldn't make it but i cleared all the rounds, there were 180 seats and my rank was 181.

I was sure that i have cracked it and was just awaiting the center's name in the final list. However, when i went and checked the final list, i was shocked to my senses to know i was not even there in the waiting list for the course where as one of my friend who had secured 471th rack made it through.

Later when i entered her roll no. in online result sheet i realised she was a SC and that is why she was through(However she claimed to be a jat n wrote GILL as surname).

I was literally heart broken, in spite of being deserving i couldnt get through, and that is when i realised, even if jats get reservation, i would never snatch what others deserve just because i am entitled to get reservation

However, thankfully because many people dropped out i made it into NIFT, was at chennai for a week only to realise i am not a fit for fasion industry, management is better:p:p

[brahmtewatia]

Punjabis and Sindhis came to India empty handed and now they are doing very well.
I met many Sindhis families migrated to Indonesia, Singapore, HK during partition. They are doing exceptionally well.
Birlaji came to Calcutta empty handed, became one of the richest person of India.
In America in the list of Fortune 500 many Indians names are there among top 50.
Dr. Deepak Chopra is among 100 top heroes of the century in America.
***************************
Please don't answer to this post. just think and give your opinion in poll
i wud hv. refrained frm replying to yr. post as rqstd. by u, hw ever i wud like to remind u tht if u r counting examples, u'll find lots of them, even among jats...just to name one, if u r talking abt riches nd forbes list...we do hv a jat among them, an achievement by far. mr. kush pal ranked No. 8 by Forbes magazine in its much anticipated 2008 list of billionaires. pls. chk out here...

http://www.financialexpress.com/news...ichest/219126/

http://www.indianrealestateforum.com...roud-2675.html

2) We need to change our attitude towards life: We are so attached to the place we are born that we do not like to leave that place for betterment. I mean we should look for green pasture else where too(Migration may be within the country).
thts vry true navin bhai

this issue of reservation has bn. discussed at large on various threads. since this is a poll, i'wud surely like to rpt my opinion. i strongly oppose the policy of quotas/reservations etc etc...hwever the fact remains that we cannot change our system, at least the politicians.
...
i wud say... "खुदी को कर बुलंद इतना, की हर तकदीर से पहले खुदा बंदे से ये पूछे...बता तेरी रज़ा क्या है."

but when i read mr. deshwal's post on one of the threads, i was left pondering...yes this is true nd the harsh reality tht exists among us. we may b lucky few comprising the privileged class of jats...but luking into the broader perspective nd the harsh reality tht exists plus the political vendetta's tht r involved...i wud say...YES...we do need reservation
(i wud still not say "Strongly agree" but wud surely like to say "Agree")
...here's mr. deshwal's post...
.
.
V
V

आधे से ज्यादा जाट आबादी ऐसी है जिसे पता नही ४-१० बीघे के टुकड़े में सारा साल कैसे निकलेगा
एक बचे की शादी करनी पड़ जाए , तो सारी उमर के लिए कर्जदार
लड़कों की तो खैर शादी होती ही नही , कोण रिश्ता करेगा , किसी ने लड़की ब्याह्दी तब खिलायेगा क्या
नोकरी मिलनी नही

में ख़ुद जाती के आधार पर आरक्षण का हिमायती नही , पर आर्थिक आधार पर मिलले नही और जाती के आधार पर मांगो नही , इस तरह ये बहादुर जाती ही खत्म हो जायेगी १००-१५० साल बाद

[keshavdahiya]

Rajeev singh paweria ji...this is your first post on Jland with sucha a controversial topic.....are you sure about it ???

forget Jat community for a while.....Are you so inefficient that you need reservation ??

[brahmtewatia]

Please don't answer to this post. just think and give your opinion in poll

Rajeev singh paweria ji...this is your first post on Jland with sucha a controversial topic.....are you sure about it ???

forget Jat community for a while.....Are you so inefficient that you need reservation ??

i dont c any controversy here...hw ever the contents in the post might b controversial...but as said by rajeev...pls. dont answer to the post...take it as POLL only.

[skadian123]

Dear Mr. Paweria,

The topic that you have you written on, has been a topic of debate for long both within and outside our community and rightfully so, considering the short and long term end results that it would lead to.

As is the case with any debate or discussion, there is no right or wrong as far as viewpoints are considered. People like you and me are fortunate enough to have quality education and good work opportunities, but unfortunately that is not the case for our community in totality. If you look at the hinterland in Haryana, Rajasthan, UP and I believe even to a large extent in Outer Delhi, you will find the masses especially the youth with no or little quality education available and negligible employment opportunities except for the option of joining the armed forces.

Hence, with the educated lot among us forming the flashes in pan, l strongly believe we should not generalise our prosperity to our entire community. By doing this, we are denying the opportunities to a majority of our community members which will not only allow them to make a place for themselves but also to even survive in today's fiercely competive and ironically at the same time reservation driven scenario.

Even if we get reservation, it does not stop any of our community member to stop striving for excellence. Even with reservation, we can have toppers in their respective fields. A very fine example of a community which has progressed with reservation is the Yadavs. What more can be said than the fact that at one point in time we had Yadav CMs in UP and Bihar with the entire state machinery backed by Yadavs and yet they were enjoying the benefits of reservation. They are enjoying the fruits of reservation in almost all the states in Northern India including Haryana. What have they lost by taking reservation?????? They still are a proud community. They are doing well in their respective fields and growing from strength to strength with each passing day.

Let's stop living in our past and face the reality. Just because we form islands of progress and prosperity in a sea of unemployment and backwardness, we should not deny the vast majority of our community members the opportunity to survive and exist.

[dkumars]

For many years, I have been just a reader of these discussions and I got lots of information about my cast JAT. I was born in Bilsoori, Bulandshahr and brought up in Jaipur with mostly Punjabis and Marwaris, so I did not know much about this cast.

Whenever I came to forum,a message always welcomes me
Rajeev Singh Paweria ! are you sure You have nothing to Say?

And really I had nothing to say, There are so many learned persons giving their valuable opinions, So I was just enjoying them.

Even today, I do not want to say something rather want to know after reading the thread "Jat are making history........"

"do we really need reservation ?"

My daughter is MAITREYI after the name of wife of Yagvalkya ( There are only 300 people in the history of mankind who had Ved-Vision, and 13 among them were Women, Meitreyi was one of them).

My son is Dev Vratha after the name of Bhishma - grandfather of Arjun.


I am afraid if I will avail reservation for my kids, how close would the personalities of my kids to the personalities of real Maitreyi and Dev Vratha?

One side we are saying from RAMA to HARSHAVARDHANA all were Jat and ruled over India for many centuries ( Ref. People on Jatland.com), on other side seeking reservation on the ground of social backwardness. I cannot understand.

And if we will get reservation, as of now I am already in reserved category based on my birth in UP and domicile of Rajasthan, How many Jat children will grow like Kapil Dev, Dharmendra, Sir Chhotu Ram, Charan Singh, Hari Singh Nalawa, Ashoka the Great......................

Maximum they will get a better job....

and Job is job....

A Servant is a Servant from Peon to IAS.
A Servant can obey his Master only, He can't become a Leader......

And Leaders are must to uplift the community.

Unfortunately modern education can produce only Servants not Leaders...


Punjabis and Sindhis came to India empty handed and now they are doing very well.
I met many Sindhis families migrated to Indonesia, Singapore, HK during partition. They are doing exceptionally well.
Birlaji came to Calcutta empty handed, became one of the richest person of India.
In America in the list of Fortune 500 many Indians names are there among top 50.
Dr. Deepak Chopra is among 100 top heroes of the century in America.

Once I was flying to London and one Punjabi Jat gentleman met me , he was born and brought up in Singapore and after WWII came to London and served in UK Police, He told me that Jats are different, Even his superiors used to tell him that his thinking and working style is totally different from rest of Indians. And He was awarded for his services by British Police.

....................

Thanks for your precious time.........
Please don't answer to this post. just think and give your opinion in poll

Bhai saahb allow me to write few words here.

First of all, there had been lotta discussions on similar topics on JL. Infact few are exactly same.
Second, u asked not to ans the post but asked for opinion through poll only. Here, i would like to ask(say) u that u cud have asked this question with even title only or 1 line post. Here, u have wrote a good article but which reflects ur opinion also. So, i feel knowingly or unknowingly u r trying to convince ppl here for a particluar ans. I mean u wrote this long post which says something abt ur perception towards the subject and u courted few examples also which are making the comments more lucid. So, i personally feel u shud have written a single line if u really want only unbiased poll opinions.

Btw u have got beautiful names for ur children. Hope they will make their names true in future. Waise u really wrote gud and true.I liked that.

Devender

[ravichaudhary]

The facts are, that except for a few isolated families of jats, the majority have been denied education and opportunities.

Caste politics ensured that jats would not get to the opportunities, As Sir Chotu Ram once said, “ When people from rural areas try and get education it is denied to them; when they try to participate in opportunities, they find that the gates to those opportunities are held , held by other communities and barred to the Jats and other rural communities.”

Reservation is a tool, a weapon, to achieve a level playing field.

Jats need to use this weapon, not to throw it aside, in a bout of false pride.


Ravi Chaudhary

[brainspeak]

ya we need reservation...

[ranjitjat]

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24118

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20340

[rajivsp]

I consider myself the least deserving candidate to comment on the Issue of Reservation. I know whether we want or not we will get it for Harayana too.
Now it is not the question of our need whether we need it or not, but the capabilities of our leaders - They are efficient enough to get it for us or not. In this context I will say ya we need Reservation. A game of power.

A message was hidden in my post (more relevant to Jat are making history rather than Reservation) -

Now its not muscle power ruling the world but Economy. When it was the time of Muscle we Jat ruled the world, but now time is changed and since last 10-12 years it is changing very fast so we have to cope with this.

The survival of any community is not depend how powerful or intelligent it is, but how adaptable it is. That's way our civilization is survived for more than 5000 years, where as Aztec, Rome, Egypt all destroyed because of lack of adaptability.

I have searched this forum, but I did not find any discussion over Business or Entrepreneurship, I strongly recommend for a Folder named Business or Entrepreneurship or something similar. This is demand of the present time and before time will change us it is wise we will change ourselves. JatLand is a wonderful platform over 10000 educated members, I think they are enough to spread awareness of entrepreneurship to all Jats and others too.

Business is not in our blood, but we can learn how to do business. There are some good Jat businessmen. I hope they will not hesitate to help us even we can get help from non-Jat also. I am doing the same for last 2 years trying to establish my own business, and learning thought lessons. Very difficult but not impossible. I will say Jat are making History - when there will be at least 100 Entrepreneur Jats and each Employing 100 employees.

We have to learn how to get advantage of new opportunities- Now we are the player of global economy.
We have to learn to take initiatives.

We do not take imitative, but Punjabis
A wonderful opportunity came to India, may be 10-12 years back MLM, Networking or Direct Selling, How many of us took the advantage of that opportunity.

I was outside of India for 10 years and when I came back, I knew about this at the end of 2007. I am the last person to know about this opportunity in India, But I wondered not a single Jat (all are aware of it) I met who got the benefit of this opportunity in last 10 years, while Delhi Punjabis I met earning millions of rupees out of this business.

I am very busy in my software business, for many years I worked in embedded technology but now working in web 2.0 and I am new to this. Whole night I give consultancy to my clients all over the world and in day I am busy in development.
My wife has joined it but she is also busy in growing two kids. But she is looking very positive. I have developed a site related to this, but I can not write the link here.

But what I want to say

It is just a matter of commitment and taking initiatives and we can do a lot for our community.


Socio-Economic Perspective of being an entrepreneur Envision new product and service ideas
Change the way people live, work, and spend time
Create wealth using ethical means
Contribute to the national GDP
Generate employment
Create heroes and role models




I Came, I Saw, I Conquered !

[devdahiya]

We need Education and tameez....Reservation is no stupid solution.

[desijat]

Create wealth using ethical means

I blv had you been in India for past 10 years, you must have thought 200 times before putting this point here and probability would have been that this point would have never come...

[raka]

We need Education and tameez....Reservation is no stupid solution.

Devsaab , theek baat hain hume sabse pahele education aur tameez ki jarurat hain , par sir jo log isska[aarakshan] labh uthha rahe hain unke baare me aapka kya khyal hain. aaj bi hamare 85% jatt bhai gaon me rahte hain ,unke liye behtar shiksha ki disha me aapne kya kabi koi kadam uthhaya hain? , kabi kissi gaon me jaa ke koi kosish ki hain?
devsaab plz mind na karna. mane dekha hain yaha JL par (95%) log aarakshan ya education par baat to karte par ground par kuchh nahi...

[devdahiya]

Devsaab , theek baat hain hume sabse pahele education aur tameez ki jarurat hain , par sir jo log isska[aarakshan] labh uthha rahe hain unke baare me aapka kya khyal hain. aaj bi hamare 85% jatt bhai gaon me rahte hain ,unke liye behtar shiksha ki disha me aapne kya kabi koi kadam uthhaya hain? , kabi kissi gaon me jaa ke koi kosish ki hain?
devsaab plz mind na karna. mane dekha hain yaha JL par (95%) log aarakshan ya education par baat to karte par ground par kuchh nahi...

bhai mein gaon mein hi paidda huwa..wahin padhha,hall bahya..peirr thhaye,gehtte hankke,paani ferre....arr nass-2 se wakif huun...aur baddi battein nahin karta...jo bhi kar sakta huun kar raha huun aur hamesha aakhiri saanss takk karta rahungga...kyunki mujhhe apne logon se pyar hei,mohobatt hei........mein khudd bahut humble background se belong karta huun aur bahut burre waqt dekhe hein.baddi mehnat karri hei jindagi mein......Mein sirf baat karne wale logon mei se nahi hunn...mein abhi bhi gaon jata rehta huun aur apne logon se purri trah contact mein huun.Kuchh jimedariyan shesh hein wo jaladi hi purri ho jayeinggi.....fir 24 ghantte jutt jaungga...akele hi.Aur battao.


AAPNE aissi koi baat nahin kahi jiska burra manna jaye Rakesh bhai.

[sanjeetsparp]

Reservation Reservation Reservation ................ bahut din e alag alag thread main ye topic uchaal reha hai or kai baar is pe achhi khaasi behas bhi ho chuki hai .......

Bahut saari aise Cast jinki aarthik sithti jaton se kehin behtar hai .... meja ker rahe hain ......

Jat bhi reserved hain Rajasthan main, UP main or Delhi main ......

Dekha jaaye to aajkel ka reservation bemaani ho gaya hai .. or jinko faayda milna chhaiye we ab bhi peeche hain..... or shayad hi khabhi ubher jaayein .. kyunki unki aarthik sithti itni buri hai ki ... we 2 time ki roti ke bare main sochte hain .. or bachhon ko school main isliye nahi bejhte ... ki bachha school chala gaya to shayad ghar ka ek aadmi bhookha reh jaayega... main bahut se aise gaon main ghooma hoon ....... jehaan poore gaon main kahana shayad ek hi time milta ho.... Haryana main aise gaon nahi hain.....

But jehaan tak reservation ki baat hai to jin jin casts ko reservation diya gaya hai unka economic survey hona chahiye or jo log ek income level se uper hain .. unko reservation nahi milna chahiye.......

Same case should be applied in Haryana as bahut se gaon main .... Jat bahut peeche hain .. er austan gaon main 20% jat family economically backward hain ... jin ko vastav main push kerne ki jarurat hai

or yehi stream rekhni hai reservation ki jo ki chali hui hai .... to Reservation hame bhi chahiye .... as aaj Govt sector main reservation or kel corporate houses bhi in .... netaon ke pressure main honege or private sector main bhi reservation lagega...... Is sense main main aarakshan ka purjor samarthan karoonga.

[snandal1]

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24118

http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20340

dudeeji, jissya na koi hogya, aur na hi koi ho gya

[snandal1]

whtever this grand old man says is right

[snandal1]

ek saharan ne is rsrvsn pe likhyya tha. aa ne kuchh pbls kar ke dikhya do na in jatyann nne. ke pros n kons ho sakke ssen is rsrbsn ki bimari ke.