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Thread: Jats in Today's World

  1. #1

    Jats in Today's World

    Jats although have proved themselves again and again in various fields but still they are perceived mistakenly. The stereotype is of no nonsense, simple friend for life who believes in hard work. Now there is nothing wrong with it but trouble arises when we get typecast. It’s similar to a good actor’s dilemma; type cast gets him work but doesn’t allow him to show his brilliance. He knows there is much more potential in him than the world knows. Hence an actor avoids it at all costs before selling out. Or if he is Shahrukh Khan, he manages to market his stereotype well.

    Part of the stereotype is convenience. It serves other communities/races well if a good Jat officer is taken as a Punjabi. The officer also doesn’t bother much to shout from the top of the roof that he is a Jat. And probably with right reasons. Mending that public view is another topic of discussion. A long and perhaps a more controversial one.

    However, here we are talking about bettering our social and communication skills that will not just improve the image of Jats but their careers and lives as well.

    It’s no hidden thing that although Jat Models have drop-dead looks but they fail to transition into acting smoothly because of their social and communication skills. They do not know how to network and to confidently deliver a line. This story gets repeated everyday in Mumbai.

    In a recent example of Olympic Bronze Medalist Vijender Singh talking to TV, I saw that he was struggling with his English. And I doubt he was asked by the reporter to speak in English since there were other athletes speaking in their respective mother tongues. Although part of his interview is adorable (stereotypical hard working village lad from a poor family), we should also realize that if he can articulate his passion well, he would be perceived as a bigger hero.

    Also, an athlete like Vijender has an exceptional talent that can overshadow the lacuna in his communication skills. But the Jats who don’t have an exceptional talent, what do they do? Obviously there is a purpose to their lives on this planet. How do they articulate and communicate that.

    I think the answer is simple and it is so obvious that we fail to recognize it. All it takes is a dialogue. Yet it’s not easy. Connecting with people on a genuine level and still being your true self takes a lot of courage. Like so many other people I have also been socio-phobic, put my head down and worked my ass off thinking that it will work my career and life out.
    However, I have not been completely right in thinking that I can be an island. So sooner we lose the inhibition to connect with as many different people, the better.

    Now you would ask that how is connecting with people helping you out. So many Jat guys in fact have told me that networking is such a dirty word. When you have a genuine dialogue with a person, the other person tries his might’s best to help you attain your best. Call it God’s will or whatever, it is a basic human nature to be understood and understand. If there is any connection between two people, it’s because of that. And since man is a social animal, a lot of his life is determined by his social skills.

    I have seen magical things happen to me as I am opening to people. Things that I desire happen on their own. Connecting with people outside of the communities will also change the perception of Jats. People will finally get to understand us and we in turn will understand ourselves better. Also when you open up, a whole new world of possibilities open up for you.

    The purpose of this thread is to thus talk about some very practical tips that have worked for you as a Jat or lets say as an individual in the society. Since most of you are extremely successful in your own fields, I have a feeling you are good at your social and communication skills.

    I know I have played the Jat card to get things done and sometimes I have deliberately stayed away from it. Lets talk about all of it and try to build up something that can be used by all of us.

    Waiting to hear from you guys.
    Last edited by sumeetmalik; September 4th, 2008 at 10:28 AM. Reason: Fact Check
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  3. #2
    Tips: Just be urself...people know when u r a fake..n its a BIIIG turn-off..
    I detest pretentious guys...

    n feel proud to be wot u r,,believe in urself n trust me, people will believe/look up to u..u entice them with ur genuineness and of course highlight the qualities JATs specially have...like confidence, sense of humour, wits and naive disposition..

    P.S: M a social leper..a social wreck..:D,, not that I lack confidence,, but just that I feel awkward n stuck
    n others come to my rescue:p
    But like you ,when i started to open up,,i feel mixing up with others is not thaaat bad!! just needs some of ur time...
    -There are no bad people in this world..they are either good or amusing.

    ...La Vida es Bella....

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  5. #3
    Sumeet you are right. In case of Vijender Kumar, he has got the opportunity and it is the right time to encash it. He should now invest some money in grooming himself and developing communication skills. If he does that then he can make lot of money. He needs to hire a proper consultant to advise on such matters. But unfortunately majority of jats considers such spending as useless.
    Yoginder Gulia

  6. #4

    Thumbs up JAT - a class apart !

    JAT’s in today’s world… In my attempt to come face-off with the reality, I gather above post in my perspective as follows:

    JAT’s being successful … Here I can quote numerous examples of JAT’s, who are doing well and have been greatly acknowledged irrespective of being stereotype or type-cast. Well that's beyond the subject and I won’t talk about it any further.

    JAT’s lacking in communication skills … YES that’s very much true !!! in fact this happens to be an area where we need to open up, more specifically our outlook and horizons. Having said so, please make no mistakes, because this is an area where JAT’s cannot do wonders overnight. Very simply the only solution that I can foresee is education and exposure to the world outside. We are definitely moving towards it and it’s just a matter of time when you’ll find JAT’s standing at par with any brand-shots of a specific community.

    Sumeet stressed the necessity of connecting to people outside your community… very true, and I agree 100% !!! At the same time, it must be acknowledged that he says so because he got the opportunity to do so… I mean meeting new people… visiting different places, as part of his job profile (…I guess). The fact however remains, that not everybody gets that chance.

    So now, how shall we go about it… taking this point of view a bit further socially and adding more to what many would call as stereotype rhetoric… I would say that where ever we are, where ever we go and whatever we do, we must try to strengthen JAT identity and JAT unity by fostering sustainable and community based connections among other communities. I firmly believe, this can be achieved through parallel social service initiatives, dialogue, and leadership training. It is time for us to explore a world in which JAT’s everywhere and anywhere can work together and contribute to one another. We as a community should be able to cooperate more cordially, thereby adding mutually to the greater goal of facilitating and enhancing the JAT experience. This eventually would switch people's understanding of how JAT’s worldwide can move forward and achieve greater cohesiveness as a people and/or as a community.

    Easy said then done !!! but that’s what I believe.

    On the personal front, I must confess honestly without mincing my words that there have been instances, where I wish, I would have told the world (… I mean the people around me) that YES here I am… a JAT true to his character, but I failed often times because I couldn’t express myself in my local language, when it was required MOST. :o This is contrary to the example of Vijender quoted above by Sumeet. I wish any Boswell of JAT community… may be his coach or some senior educated member in his family should have briefed/guided him in simple words, about the media that he is going to embrace, on his return from Beijing. I guess he should have simply adhered to his local language, with inclusion of his local dialect as well. There wasn't any need for him to use ungrezi at all… He surely has done our JAT community proud… as rightly said by Sumeet above… he would have done us more proud if he had articulated his passion well, indeed he would have been perceived as a bigger hero.

    From my personal experience, I would say that an educated JAT is a class apart. He is very predominantly distinguished where ever he goes and whatever he does… more such creatures are in the development stage… watch out JAT-WORLD after 10 years from now... as of now I only wish there should have been some one called Barkha Jat (Barkha Dutt) on a predominant Indian news channel, to be our brand ambassador... for rest, please check my SIGNATURES. :D
    Last edited by brahmtewatia; September 5th, 2008 at 06:10 PM. Reason: Removed SMS format writing.
    ! ... be BOLD in what you stand for !
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    !!! ... be yourself, everyone else is already taken !!!

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  8. #5

    इस दुनिया में जाट !!!

    well sumit bhai ur right but after some time we definitly done miracle..:o
    भाई हमारी कमजोरी अंग्रेजी में चेप दी चलो में इसकी हिन्दी कर दूँ

    जाट का भाग्य हे की वो Delhi के आस पास के प्रान्तों में रहता हे, यदि वो सुदूर प्रान्तों का रहने वाला होता तो इस से भी बुरा हाल हो! यह एक शर्मीली जात हे जहा इसका अपना समुदाय हे वहां ये शेर हे एक बड़ी ताकत हे , हाँ जब भी इसे मोका मिला हे जाट ने साबित किया हे कुछ बन कर जाट कानामरोशन किया हे !

    आप सभी जानते हो ख़ुद देखते भी हो घर से दूर अपने को जाट बताने के बाद सामने वाले का जाट के प्रति नजरिया ही बदल जाता है, जितने भी जाट कामयाब हुए वो सब अपनी सोची समझी से किसने जाट को आगे बढाया हे !
    अभी जाट ने घर से निकलना शुरू किया हे, वो सिख रहा हे, सिखने के बाद देखना इसमे बुलंद होंसले तो हे ही कमी केवल बोलने की ही हे ! जब सिख जाएगा या जो सिख गए है , मुझे नही लगता जाट कभी रुकेगा \ रुकेंगे
    बस मेरे विचार से एक बार निकल कर संभलने की जरुरत हे

    आज का जाट विद्यालय में कंप्यूटर व् लप टॉप प्रयोग कर रहा हे , जब यह हमारी व् आपकी तरह मार्केट में आएगा तो छा जाएगा और हमें ये सब लिखने की जरुरत नही होगी हम जाट और आगेकी सोचेंगे !

    मेहनत के साथ साथ जाट अगर स्मार्ट भी रहे तो इसमे चार चाँद लगने वाली बात हे
    आओ हम सब मिल कर एक नए जाट समाज का निर्माण करे , जहाँ भी जाट मिले कम से कम उसे सही मार्गदर्सन जरुर दे विशेष कर बच्चों को !
    Jai Jat :rock

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  10. #6
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    Excellent topic Sumeet and I appreicate that you covered the problem as well as few of the solution steps in one single post of yours.

    I agree to Brahm's view that in this sitution specific instance of Vijender , he would have been much better off to speak in Hindi , What are news channel translators for , they get paid for that , right ?

    Buiding on that I would say that a two pronged approach would help a lot.


    1. Confidence in whatever we have.
    2. Building on 1) and Adding new things to our reportoire.

    IF we guys speak Jat-ish lanugage , what's the harm , everywhere in the world people speak local dialects and all , and we must always keep in mind that knowing English ain't everything in life. Personal Experince , most of germans are not at all effecive communicators in English , but they dont lack any confidence , infact are prudent about their language.

    An Effective communication is not a good communication in English and realising that is perhaps the first step to go about things. We must be able to communicate what we exactly feel and think , thats utmost important before attempting to make it in English.

    I also understand that in this competitive world and coming up of all MNC's and the culture that is practised there , it is of importance to know the English as an language and also know some social skills.

    I would cite none other than mine example in that:
    Till 2005 ( my 3rd year at IIT ) , I was the usual stammerer when it came to talking with people in English language and even otherwise , in a sense afraid of people , avoiding discussions , avoiding groups of people.
    In fact situation was of the order that I used to think for at least a couple of minutes , dwell on it a lot before even attempting to ask the proffessor any question. Such was the level of diffidency ( if that's the right word ? ) , that was embedded in me.

    Cometh the 4th year and a bit of relaxation of the taxing studies , I tried to broaden my links and horizons and some of you would not believe if I say that coming online and interacting with people helped me a lot. From a Jat community on orkut and a lot of interactions there ( 4-5 hours on daily basis ) , I gained in confidence. People did appreciate my soft and simple humour , my thoughts and views , that made me gain the confidence to do the next step : Approach people.
    That changed my life , Interacting with people is probably the best one can do to gain social skills and get over the barriers that are in everyone's mind. Not only you know how other people behave ( rational at times and very irrational at others ) but you also know how you yourself fare in certain situations.

    Today I have total self confidence in approaching people , I guess I have good speaking skills ( writing skills were always OK!). Pretty comofortable in my company's global office with 40 people of 12 different countries.

    And as the author of the thread has already said , these are very important.


    Probably I would envision a thread after the conclusion of this one in which people can really help each other ( something similar to the Interview tips by DK ) to gain these very important tools of success.


    Cheers,
    Anil
    Last edited by anilsinghd; September 5th, 2008 at 06:43 PM. Reason: spell mistakes

  11. #7
    Sumeet you have aptly described the importance and need for socialising and communicating by jats in today's world. Jat by nature is introvert but once that barrier is broken jats can also be very articulate in putting across their point of view. As Anil Dalal has described how he would stammer in 2005 and now is comfortable in dealing with persons from all across the world. It is just a matter of stepping out and wonderful things will happen.

    Way back in 1964 when we entered our Engineering College we were completly lost. We were 5/6 Jats in our class and seriously took up the challenge, came out of our shells and saw that it was not at all difficult.
    It is just a mental block,start communicating in whatever way you feel comfortable improvement will come naturally. Jat by nature is very honest, hardworking, truthful and confident but lacks in communication skills and once it is aquired no one can hold a jat back. I am new to Jatland and boys I am delighted to see your concern for your fellow jats. Brahm is right that educated jat is a class apart and 10 years hence see the ********, there wil be no dearth of Brand Ambassoders.

    And Deeepshi keep it up and start mixing up, there are no boudaries.
    Joginder bhai jat boys are not only using computer and laptop in colleges but their parents are also using laptops in homes, so the World be ready JAT has arrived.
    Last edited by Rmandaura; September 5th, 2008 at 11:32 PM. Reason: Spell check
    Ranjit Dahiya.

    Think Positive-Everything is Possible.

  12. #8
    Thanks guys for all your inputs. There are some common threads that have emerged out of the discussion to be an effective Jat in today's society.

    Being yourself is first. We all know we cannot lie to ourselves; Maybe for a while but truth catches up sooner or later. And when it does it gets ugly. Another very important factor to keep in mind is that you have no control over how you are perceived by the other person. You can use grooming, superior and confident communication skills (as stressed by others) to be generally likeable and agreeable. But if you are putting on an act to be liked then it is a big mistake. You don't want those people in your life. Whenever I go out and meet the 'fakes' which now I can tell in a few minutes, I try to politely get out of the conversation and move on to other people. There have been so many instances that I have ignored their friends request over social networking sites. The point I am trying to make is there is no real connection if you or the other person is not being himself/herself.

    Another thing that comes up again and is confidence. What is it really? Try to think of the few moments in your life that you have been truly happy to have your life, your being. How you felt at that time is what confidence is. Next time you are interacting, think about it.

    Nobody, I repeat nobody owns you and your actions as an adult. In the west, adults are on their own much sooner than Indian kids, so I will give you 21-25 years. After that you cannot blame your life on anyone else. Life is a series of cause and effects (we might not know all) triggered by our actions and the sooner we owe up to it, the better.

    Another thing that came up is introversion. Like Mr. Dahiya said, come out of it. There is no bigger joy in this world than a true expression. Go on and tell that girl that you like her laugh (genuine compliments only!) and tell her a good Sundu or Tau joke to make her laugh again. Go and tell your mother that how much you really appreciate the small things she does for you still, and spoils you.... You must realize that whatever and however beautiful thoughts and ideas that you might have, they won't be appreciated until you put them out there. Sure it's a bit tough in the beginning since you are being vulnerable but soon you will realize that so is the person you are interacting with. After all he or she is human as well (I suppose!).

    Once again thanks for all your inputs. Keep them coming and as I pleaded in the editorial thread, keep them as 'clean' as possible. There are some other very important points that I would like to touch to keep growing as effective communicators and social beings.
    Last edited by sumeetmalik; September 11th, 2008 at 08:14 PM.
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  13. #9
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    This thread makes the discussion very simplistic.

    Bhai loogoon outside confidence does not tell what kind of person you are dealing with. I stayed for 10 days with a professor who was Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. He watched porn while his wife and daughters aged 6 and 7 just went to sleep in next room. I walked 3 miles to eat as he won't let me eat at times. I asked him to help me move to my room in Univesrity but he made threatning gestures and refused.

    He is one of the founders of a jat association in US.

    My own relatives told me to shut up about him as they wanted to use him. Yes sir and madam they said the exact words.

    Looking outside you will be duped and think he is friendly and not "fake".
    He has a good reputation in the University.
    See him outside and he is all smiley, friendly, easy going.


    Even one of his own (18 year old at that time) relatives who stayed with him for a short time tried to give his "real photo" to his uncle but his uncle would not believe him.


    One has to stay and be dependent on a person for a short time to get the real picture (may be).

    Bhaiiyoon hamare yahhan par kabhie kabhie aadmi ke umar aur usee kya phayaada ho sakta hae uske position ke base par dekh kar uska character dekha jaata hae.

  14. #10
    Thanks Aman. Although we like the discussion to be simple but in no way simplistic. So here are few more thoughts on the topic. Starting off where you left.

    You are quite right in saying that we weigh the people by their age and in what way they can be helpful to us. In fact, Jat being a relatively closely tied community, it is much more prevalent. A simple example would be the awe we bestow upon politicians. I read about the auto rickshaws with 'Hooda Express' stickers behind them in one of the threads.

    I myself have come across a senior (a daughter married off) well placed Jat who would screw anything that moves. And I came across him because of family ties so that I could get some help in career. I was naive at that time to believe the person as my hero. After all he had everything. However, as you said as you get to know people more, you get to know the greyer areas. And I realized that since I had made him such a hero, the more he fell in my eyes.

    The point is that people are complex (with even more complex sex lives). Yet you need to trust them to move forward. And along the way you hope that your judgment about people gets better.
    In the other Editorial thread, Parvir Singh Dalal, wrote something beautiful and relevant and I am quoting him here.

    ‘The greatest reason for our slavery has been that our strength, compassion and love, which has led to building stable families and our deep philosophy, has also led to forgiving and forgetting very easily. We have never really punished the perpetuators of the most heinous crimes in our history. Our strength has thus become our weakness. Too much of misapplied goodness is counterproductive. One should first analyze, who he is applying his good intentions to.
    I do not know the key to success but I can tell you the key to failure and that is trying to please everyone.’


    So there is no point in losing compassion or not believing in heroes if we have been disappointed in the past (I have met some great people here on Jatland and come across some real asses too. I am sure everyone has had that journey.)

    Compassion, after all keeps us fluid. And that is what I think it’s about. To be a successful Jat in today’s society, you have to be compassionate. If confidence is outer cover, compassion is inner material. You can’t fake it. That is all by the way from Leadership and Org. Behavior 101:-p.
    Last edited by sumeetmalik; September 22nd, 2008 at 01:16 PM.
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  15. #11
    dear sumit i have only read your last comment, and you have come out as a very mature person. your comments on your hero were heartbreaking. although u have your reasons for them, everyone has flaws and they should not become an excuse to tarnish their image. after all i feel your expectations were more on the selfish side.

    remember people can come out with similar comments for u in future.
    yours praveer

  16. #12
    Thanks Praveer for calling me out on that one. I didn't take enough time to explain the whole story.

    No doubt, I met this gentleman for solely selfish reasons in the hope that I can get in touch with some influential industry people. And I got all the help in the world from him. Now being a normal grateful person, I extended all the little help I could to him. Soon he trusted me well and I was always a phone call away for some of his small tasks. Meanwhile I could learn immensely just by being around him since he was such a great leader and communicator. He was an epitome of almost all the good visible qualities of a Jat. Tall, proud, compassionate towards people. I absorbed as much as I can. I mostly look for inspiration and this man could inspire me with his attitude. You get the drift.

    I almost gave him the status of my Grandfather (Ch. Raj Singh Dalal), who was the greatest Jat I have come across personally. He was a man who didn't have an ugly side. At least I couldn't see it in the sixteen years of my life that he was around.

    So this gentleman one day asks me for something that I have to draw a line and say no to him. And before not committing to him, I had a sensible discussion with my then girlfriend. And she was the one who thought the man was completely right in his request and that I shouldn't call him a fallen hero.

    In hindsight, I took away two things from that episode. One morals and ethics are different. I was mixing them up at that stage in my life and being judgmental. Like I said I was naive at that time.

    Secondly, like Pravir Singh Dalal also said, our greatest strength is also our greatest weakness. Passion can be strength if articulated well. Jats are passionate people. But if you don't know how to handle it, then it results in a conflict. This story also gets repeated everyday on Jatland in so many threads. It happened with me then.

    In fact, I wanted to discuss a little about it quoting from one of my favorite writer Hugh Mcleod.

    ‘Every media's greatest strength is also its greatest weakness. Every form of media is a set of fundamental compromises; one is not "higher" than the other. A painting doesn't do much; it just sits there on a wall. That's the best and worst thing about it. Film combines sound, movement, photography, music, acting. That's the best and worst thing about it. Prose just uses words arranged in linear form to get its point across. That's the best and worst thing about it etc.’

    Similarly speaking, non-verbal signs is also a medium. Some people are naturals at it while some acquire it. The good thing is that it gets better with learning and age.

    Hope I have explained a bit about the difference between judging well and being judgmental.

    And Praveer, don’t just read my last post. Read the thread and happily join the discussion. I think we are at a great point now where we have already talked about the obvious. The discussion from here will only get more interesting!
    Last edited by sumeetmalik; October 3rd, 2008 at 02:12 PM.
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  17. #13

    ... judging well and being judgmental.

    We all are judgmental to a certain extent and that's human. And yet, while it is in our nature to be judgmental, I don’t think it’s always useful to us. We look down on others, as if we are so much better… and that creates division between people. It takes more time and effort to really get to know a person before judging him/her. I’m not sure if we can totally override our preconceptions, which play a great role and at times can be deceptive. It is very easy to jump to conclusions about people based strictly on how they look, the fact is we all do it even though we don’t like to admit it.

    I think we must try to quieten our preconceptions while we delve deeper. The outlook of a person shouldn’t matter nor should their age, sex, weight, or what clothes they wear. There are many interesting, smart, and valuable people that don’t fit into the stereotype mold that our society has created. It is up to us to decide how we will judge people and that's where your personal experience can be instrumental in making your judgment. After South Africa got independence, in early 90's, I've come across some locals who have amassed a fortune over a short period of time and are filthy rich. Its no joke, as I say this to you... if you are a person whom looks matter a lot, then for this guy, whom you would think twice even to throw a penny... you'll get shock of your life when you see him/her coming out from a Merck CL or BMW 7 series. looks, indeed can be very deceptive.

    A judgment formed on basis of reasonable deliberation might actually help in timely recognition and correction of problems. Being judgmental, though, ought to be coupled with grace. Accept it when you made a wrong judgment and learn from it. In my brief experience at JATland, I remember very precisely the times where I was forced to be judgmental (off course for very obvious reasons) but realized very soon as to where I need to draw a line. Many thanks to some good advises which I got while interacting with some fellow and senior members.

    some people have this natural tendency of judging people at very early stage, oftentimes as good as in their first meeting. I must confess that I am very poor in judging people, as such I have to rely on thumb rules which I have created/learned over a period of time, honestly speaking it has helped me a lot as I am never taken by surprise, and if I do, then its always me to be blamed.
    ! ... be BOLD in what you stand for !
    !! ... i've the simplest tastes, i'm always satisfied with the best !!
    !!! ... be yourself, everyone else is already taken !!!

  18. #14
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    Hi All,

    Sorry for a bit off ! Ofcourse sitting in these markets , you dont get much time , but I sure was following each and every post!

    Happy to see new faces joining in not only on this thread but otherwise as well.

    Infact once I thought of writing and main focus would have been that we must not let ourselves be case specific , but then I read Sumeet's first post twice and the message that "some practical tips" stopped me to comment! We can take these situation specific posts as case studies.

    I would try to be example based in my this post.

    Regarding knowing people/judging people , and specially if that you are doing professionally , I would advise against extreme behaviour. What I intend to put across is the message that dont be too pessimistic and at the same time , dont be too optimistic about how they behave. I have always advocated that ;human behaviour is something very complex and one cannot generalise on at least this! One has to be person specific , individualistic approach should do more good.

    What for a start? Absorb! Try and be neutral , dont assume , start with scratch. Find out more about him before taking liberties. I have found some very very nice people ( foreigners ) on job , who are very helpful and you can approach them personally. Also have come across some very shrewd guys who would not let an iota of opportunity to let you in their personal lives. Office over and you are a stranger. So you got to filter.

    Another thing that I would like to generalise ( Ooops! Did i say I am an individualistic approach follower above? ) , never take liberties against Indians settled abroad or who come across your life in professional set up.
    Barring exceptions , they are least helpful ( or at least you would percieve them that way!) Reason : Well ofcourse being the intelligent strata some are arrogant and also they being Indian you try for a bit too much than what professionally is feasible! So its not their fault , it's yours if you are being too assumptive about them!

    Let me take an example: A senior colleague (Indian) has come into a new role in our organisation and by coincidence I am his resource. Now on emails he was sounding so arrogant but in person he is soft guy and did tell me on why and how of things ? He was being true to himself , helped me understand my role , helped me in justifying the crap work that I was doing for him :D! Good that I did not assumed too much about him , because once I tried to reach him personally and he was being rude and harsh and I realised at once that I have to be professional and cannot assume ( though the hypothesis was a strong one , not only he is an Indian , he comes from the same Institute as I am , so a senior as well)!

    =============================

    Bottom Line : Be very stable , emotionally strong , controlled in a professional set up!


    PS: Come up with substantiation and/or critic of what I am saying. Ofcourse may be personally on my visitor message/email so as to discuss and also at the same maintaining the sanctity of the Editorial Section.


    Regards,
    Anil
    Last edited by anilsinghd; October 3rd, 2008 at 11:29 PM. Reason: Spell Checks!

  19. #15
    dear sumeet excuse for not going through the whole thread. reading the theread i got the perception that the main topic is "how to cultivate good communication skills?" the discussion also revolves around the necessity of cultivating this skill.
    their have been digressions when members have expressed the apprehension that
    the necessity of this skill is overemphasised.
    then their is the spatial discussion where we veer off the point and human personality
    is discussed in the context that everything is not what it seems.
    the most fruitful are the contributions by bramh p tewatia and anil dalal.
    whereas one warns us not to assume things by peoples apppearence, the other
    advises us to filter people and then let them enter your lives.

    these two contributions can definitely help in building good social skills.
    dear sumeet your greatest quality is that you recommend moderation.
    we need to give space to people before pronouncing judgment on them.

    dear friend since you are from media and i from literature we both know that truth comes in different colors. people just pickup the one they have been conditioned to all their lives.

    all the participants and especially mr dalal believes that the realisation of us being unique pieces of creation goes a long way to improve our personality.

    somerset maugham's novel 'Moon and Sixpence' has almost explained version of this discussion. personality is something very difficult to explain and typecast.

    yours

    Praveer

  20. #16
    Thanks Praveer, Brahm and Anil. Bhram thanks for sharing your experiences about not judging the book looking just at the cover; Anil you are quite right in your assessment about Indians settled abroad. Last year, this young Indian couple that has been settled for a while in US, told me that they see fellow Indians with most skepticism when they are approached for a friendship. So it is wise to take it slowly in those relationships.

    I love this discussion as I am learning a lot. I being me, love to philosophize a bit and get into storytelling. But I will try to get to the point as soon as I can. So bear with me.

    Also no doubt we need to balance between the abstract and real in this discussion. Since we are dealing with Human nature, the discussion will get a bit abstract. So please do not hesitate to share personal experiences (to the point you are comfortable) if it helps the discussion since the ultimate aim is to build something for other members.

    One more thing, we wouldn't be able to build a rich discussion without different points of views. So please do not hesitate to criticize any IDEA.

    In fact, this is the key to greater social and communication skills. Ideas. The most important work lesson that I acquired in Media is that ideas are what need to be judged in a professional environment. This might hold true in your personal life as well if you are too cerebral. This will save you from all professional and most personal fights. Just remember to never criticize people but criticize the idea. And I mean look at both the positive and negative sides of it. This will eliminate the ego i.e. the person will not take it personally and you will come across as a person who can speak his/her mind and be liked generally.

    Of course petty mentality will prevail at times and some people will take the remarks personally but donít get swayed by it, as the people who matter to you will understand.

    And lastly, it will make the end result of the project/task you are working on better.
    Do more, love more

  21. #17

    My humble submission !

    When I first went through the title post, I was a bit confused as to what exactly is the line of discussion? This thread being in our newly started 'Editorial Section', I ensured myself to be very specific by reading all posts several times, before stamping my 1st post. In order to be specific and not deviating from the line of discussion, honestly speaking I was initially, a bit nervous too. The reasons were very obvious, since a lot has been talked in our other forums about the topic getting derailed. Also, I immediately realized my folly, when Sumeet requested not to use SMS type language in this section, which otherwise I enjoy writing.

    Many thanks Praveer and Sumeet for the words of appreciation. I myself feel more comfortable after above summarization by Praveer, where-in he has talked about the digressions and has very explicitly picked them up without going through the entire thread. Digressions are a bit obvious if we are talking on subjects like these. Its like a group of thoughts which are revolving around but ultimately converging on the main line of discussion. I guess, Sumeet has already explained this in his above post, the reasons for the discussion to get a bit abstract.

    I may be a bit off-topic, but I guess I have communicated what I want to say and that is the subject we are talking off !!!
    ! ... be BOLD in what you stand for !
    !! ... i've the simplest tastes, i'm always satisfied with the best !!
    !!! ... be yourself, everyone else is already taken !!!

  22. #18
    Interesting interaction going on

    Here's a little thought from my side.

    Jats today are striving to make the best and creating an indispensable identity of their own. And as discussed by the members, eminently required thing is to socialize more and more. They(Jaats) being very shy/introvert by nature, restricted in approach, sometimes make it difficult for themselves to bring out their basic instincts and thus affects directly to their personality.

    But with the expanision of knowledge and opportunities, many have attained high and created a better image for the entire community, which earlier was not regarded like that. Communication and social skills are still on the process of development among many, but that's fine as learning takes place till death.

    As taken the example of Vijender Singh, I agree that he was not feeling comfortable and pleasing enough while talking with media, as it might be for the first time that he was insisted to make use of this commonly used language, English. Some of you didn't appreciated that much, but I feel that what all he experienced or we observed, happened something bright for his future. At that time he felt a little hesitant and must be very confused to present himself in front of many, using his words in broken language but that might given him a thought to learn this as another language.

    It can't be denied that he made the whole community proud by his best performance and it would be more pleasing when we'll all watch again this young lad with greater achievements including a fluency of english words spoken with full confidence and charm- quality which is very much inherent in all Jats.

    But, mannerism needs to be filtered/ refined. This will add more to the personality.

    Just because of mannerism, still I find people have bad notions for us. A little narration of the same due to which I felt like that. While commuting to our college alongwith my other friends in cab, one among us belonging to Aggarwal community most of the time behaved like bratty and all the absurd kind language/words she made use of, which I always observed quietly but others were annoyed by that(not only in cab but also in college). And then another girl commented, 'Priya(name changed here), Neelam sitting here is Jat, but by behaviour you look more of that kind'. Though they used very appreciable words for me which I didn't mentioned to shorten the statement, but even after hearing beautiful words for myself I was little disappointed to know that what sort of image is being created by Jaat people in the society.

  23. #19
    I experienced a similar incident to the 1 neelam ji mentioned, i overheard one girl say "u know that Akanksha she is jat..." I felt so pissed off i told the girl that Im also jat and gave her a speech about what proud and successful, hardworking beautiful people we are and ended by calling her cow. A lot of the pandits seem to think we are a lower class or something, I never knew until that day. This was an indian probably brahmin girl from queenstown, south africa. I suspect she's one of those jealous, insecure type of girls who cannot appreciate a good person, as I know Akanksha, she's also from queenstown, and is a very decent, intelligent and pretty girl plus she's jat.
    Jats are amazing people, and people try to put us down many times cos they cannot accept the fact that we're better people than them.

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  25. #20
    Pahan puje hari mile tu mey puje pahar
    isse tu chaki bhali pise khaya sansar

    Kabir in the above lines would really have descibed the jats, who are by nature simple and practical folks. Swami dayanand said in his book satyatrpraksh that he saw the seeds of revolution only in one community in India and that was the jats. Jats by nature are simple and straight forward and complicated. What you see is what you get

    We however have our shortcomings. I have heard a saying of the banias " the day the jat stop loosing his temper, and the muslim learns maths that day will be the end of us". Not to generalize but be as specific and focused as i can possibly be. We need be more in control of our emotions. To understand emotions is one thing but to be emotional is a very negative trait, which leads to loss of valuable time and resources.

    We need to develop sambhav through the practise of vishad yog. doing our karm without attachment to the result of our actions. And lastly never trust anyone, till you have tried him over and over through a great length of time. People are hardly what they appear to be. Make yourself strong because it is easier to conqueror the world than to conqueror yourself.

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