History of origins - Myth?

[amans]

Most of this so called Indian history including jat history - the one describing the origins seems to be mythical. For instance, people claiming chandravanshi, suryavanshi origins all seem to be fantasies. It seems lot of all this is cooked up just like some fictional novel. What do you think? Jat is not a race just like rajput or yadav. There are only 3 races - caucasian, black and mongolian. And in India all of them are present. Most people in India are mixed. Jats are probably mixture of different people's - dravidian(are they related to africans?, possible?), as claimed scythian(caucasian race?), persian or aryan(caucasian race?), and others. There are jats with varying degrees of black skin color, light brown(fair), wheatish(whatever that means) etc. That in itself proves that jats are not a race. Just view of someone who is not an expert. Any experts?

[Samarkadian]

Most of this so called Indian history including jat history - the one describing the origins seems to be mythical. For instance, people claiming chandravanshi, suryavanshi origins all seem to be fantasies. It seems lot of all this is cooked up just like some fictional novel. What do you think? Jat is not a race just like rajput or yadav. There are only 3 races - caucasian, black and mongolian. And in India all of them are present. Most people in India are mixed. Jats are probably mixture of different people's - dravidian(are they related to africans?, possible?), as claimed scythian(caucasian race?), persian or aryan(caucasian race?), and others. There are jats with varying degrees of black skin color, light brown(fair), wheatish(whatever that means) etc. That in itself proves that jats are not a race. Just view of someone who is not an expert. Any experts?

I was wondering that how much time one(acknoweledged historians here) would take to reply here.Quest is very much valid from author's point of view and it turns more depressive when biologists owe the evolution from a single cell division of amoeba or oldest blue green algae. I have started doubting over the idea of 'Ethnic race' as a whole concept owing the evolution from a single pair of man and woman.May be we can call different people grouped geographically.Morever,I'm curious to know and learn about our own evolution and justification of Jats as 'ethnic race'.I hope someone would definitely solve it in a convincing manner.

[kapdal]

Most of this so called Indian history including jat history - the one describing the origins seems to be mythical. For instance, people claiming chandravanshi, suryavanshi origins all seem to be fantasies. It seems lot of all this is cooked up just like some fictional novel. What do you think? Jat is not a race just like rajput or yadav. There are only 3 races - caucasian, black and mongolian. And in India all of them are present. Most people in India are mixed. Jats are probably mixture of different people's - dravidian(are they related to africans?, possible?), as claimed scythian(caucasian race?), persian or aryan(caucasian race?), and others. There are jats with varying degrees of black skin color, light brown(fair), wheatish(whatever that means) etc. That in itself proves that jats are not a race. Just view of someone who is not an expert. Any experts?

Aman ji, bura mat maaniyega, but at this rate, you can pretty much become the question bank of Jatland...:D

[narenderkharb]

Most of this so called Indian history including jat history - the one describing the origins seems to be mythical. For instance, people claiming chandravanshi, suryavanshi origins all seem to be fantasies. It seems lot of all this is cooked up just like some fictional novel. What do you think? Jat is not a race just like rajput or yadav. There are only 3 races - caucasian, black and mongolian. And in India all of them are present. Most people in India are mixed. Jats are probably mixture of different people's - dravidian(are they related to africans?, possible?), as claimed scythian(caucasian race?), persian or aryan(caucasian race?), and others. There are jats with varying degrees of black skin color, light brown(fair), wheatish(whatever that means) etc. That in itself proves that jats are not a race. Just view of someone who is not an expert. Any experts?

I wished some expert to reply but in absence I hope you won't mind my contribution...

Surya and Chandervanshis are not fake terms they do mean something ,They represent different groups that arrived at different times .

Ancient Indian History is almost fake just made delibrately confusing as real people were masked under general and non clear Aryan and Indus Valley people identities .

Jats are a Caucasian Race and we have among us different Jat groups who came/moved at different times and reunited here.


All Jats are decendants of a Single Father not some mixed Gyati Sangh of Mahabharata that was simply a theory advocated by Thakur Desraj but fails on every test . Difference in genotype or phenotype is due to its resuffling with different jat groups coming and merging with their people at different times and possible marrying with native indian women when there was scaricity women in their society.

Shiva lock theory as well is allegory but does carry a historical truth of assosiation of Jats and Shiva .
Rest for experts....

[prashantacmet]

I wished some expert to reply but in absence I hope you won't mind my contribution...

Surya and Chandervanshis are not fake terms they do mean something ,They represent different groups that arrived at different times .

Ancient Indian History is almost fake just made delibrately confusing as real people were masked under general and non clear Aryan and Indus Valley people identities .

Jats are a Caucasian Race and we have among us different Jat groups who came/moved at different times and reunited here.


All Jats are decendants of a Single Father not some mixed Gyati Sangh of Mahabharata that was simply a theory advocated by Thakur Desraj but fails on every test . Difference in genotype or phenotype is due to its resuffling with different jat groups coming and merging with their people at different times and possible marrying with native indian women when there was scaricity women in their society.

Shiva lock theory as well is allegory but does carry a historical truth of assosiation of Jats and Shiva .
Rest for experts....

So as per your say, whether jats migrated from central asia to india or from india to cental asia...are Jats native of India..... As far as i think most advocated theory of jat origin is from scythian race who migrated from scythia to india....aryan is a group of scythians??..jats are aryans...?.aryans are native of India?....what is your say?.. I believe only you and mr. ravi chaudhary, others historians link each and everything stupidly with jats

[prashantacmet]

Most of this so called Indian history including jat history - the one describing the origins seems to be mythical. For instance, people claiming chandravanshi, suryavanshi origins all seem to be fantasies. It seems lot of all this is cooked up just like some fictional novel. What do you think? Jat is not a race just like rajput or yadav. There are only 3 races - caucasian, black and mongolian. And in India all of them are present. Most people in India are mixed. Jats are probably mixture of different people's - dravidian(are they related to africans?, possible?), as claimed scythian(caucasian race?), persian or aryan(caucasian race?), and others. There are jats with varying degrees of black skin color, light brown(fair), wheatish(whatever that means) etc. That in itself proves that jats are not a race. Just view of someone who is not an expert. Any experts?

mr. aman sahab ji..if you go for physiscal structure and skin color...jat is the purest race of India..aur iske proof bhi hai...........samjhe sarkaar......khamakha ki baat mat na karo aade....thaamne jaato tai koi thaddi ranzish deekhe...jo aade naam badal ke inki beizzati ke paacche laag re......waise thaari race/caste kaun si hai.......eibb to aa jaao khul ke saamhi .....

[narenderkharb]

Hi Parshant

Jats are Scythian and if we go by today's Geography not Indian in strict sense .They didn't move out of India as some historians try to present but moved freely from Scythia .Aryans were Just Scythians ,their real identity was Scythian Aryan was just an honrary word used for a noble person.However first wave of Jats came even before vedic period.

But Scythia is not far away and even included in ancient India's geography Uttar Kuru ,Uttarpath Dakishan path etc were parts of Scythian geography And as per Greeks (periplus of Eurythrian Sea ) even Indus Valley area of Pakistan and Northwestern India was part of this Scythian Jat Nation.A well florished trade existed all along the silk route and carvan moved constantly before muslim invasion these cities had all indian cultural influence noted by various historical authors who travelled along these routes.

Jats were a warrrior Scythian race that travelled vast areas on their swift horses .They travelled between Scythia ,Sogadia,Caspian sea and later even migrated towards west .They came in India in four waves of migration about three I am sure and fourth I am not certain but do have suggestion for and against .One wave came from caspian sea another from tarim basin .This is a long ...long story and I am planning to write and sell it so wait for some time

So as per your say, whether jats migrated from central asia to india or from india to cental asia...are Jats native of India..... As far as i think most advocated theory of jat origin is from scythian race who migrated from scythia to india....aryan is a group of scythians??..jats are aryans...?.aryans are native of India?....what is your says

[prashantacmet]

Hi Parshant

Jats are Scythian and if we go by today's Geography not Indian in strict sense .They didn't move out of India as some historians try to present but moved freely from Scythia .Aryans were Just Scythians ,their real identity was Scythian Aryan was just an honrary word used for a noble person.However first wave of Jats came even before vedic period.

But Scythia is not far away and even included in ancient India's geography Uttar Kuru ,Uttarpath Dakishan path etc were parts of Scythian geography And as per Greeks (periplus of Eurythrian Sea ) even Indus Valley area of Pakistan and Northwestern India was part of this Scythian Jat Nation.A well florished trade existed all along the silk route and carvan moved constantly before muslim invasion these cities had all indian cultural influence noted by various historical authors who travelled along these routes.

Jats were a warrrior Scythian race that travelled vast areas on their swift horses .They travelled between Scythia ,Sogadia,Caspian sea and later even migrated towards west .They came in India in four waves of migration about three I am sure and fourth I am not certain but do have suggestion for and against .One wave came from caspian sea another from tarim basin .This is a long ...long story and I am planning to write and sell it so wait for some time

A great thing which binds us and make us proud is that we (all Jats are

Thanks for the clarification kharab ji

[amans]

I believe jats are mixture of many different people that migrated/forced their way into India and plus the native dravidians - the descendants of the indus valley people. That is very clear by looking at the physical aspects of a jat. An example of a jat family - both parents are fair/brown skin with say 3 children - One is black skin, second is wheatish, third is light brown(fair).

Just like all other people of India, Jats are a mixed people. In fact, I believe they are a people formed from mixture of different races. In my opinion the Dravidians are related to Africans. They are an African people with straight hair, broad nose and a thin bone structure.

Who are the other people who mixed with the dravidians to form jats? Were they aryans, scythians, huns, persians, aryans, mongols, turks, greeks, afghans, kushans, and other invaders? It could be a few of these people, some of them or all of them in different degrees of assimilation. The question is when did this term - jat came into existence - exactly at what date or century?

Just like jats, all people in North India are a combination of the Dravidian people and the invaders who entered India at different times in the course of Indian history.

[sachinb]

clear bata ne pher Jats ne kunsi category mein khadyaa karna chaave se

I believe jats are mixture of many different people that migrated/forced their way into India and plus the native dravidians - the descendants of the indus valley people. That is very clear by looking at the physical aspects of a jat. An example of a jat family - both parents are fair/brown skin with say 3 children - One is black skin, second is wheatish, third is light brown(fair).

Just like all other people of India, Jats are a mixed people. In fact, I believe they are a people formed from mixture of different races. In my opinion the Dravidians are related to Africans. They are an African people with straight hair, broad nose and a thin bone structure.

Who are the other people who mixed with the dravidians to form jats? Were they aryans, scythians, huns, persians, aryans, mongols, turks, greeks, afghans, kushans, and other invaders? It could be a few of these people, some of them or all of them in different degrees of assimilation. The question is when did this term - jat came into existence - exactly at what date or century?

Just like jats, all people in North India are a combination of the Dravidian people and the invaders who entered India at different times in the course of Indian history.

[anilsangwan]

Same thing we asked him few weeks back Prashant bhai.... Laagey sei koi BHEDDIYA badd ra sei BHEDD ki khaal mein.... :D

mr. aman sahab ji..if you go for physiscal structure and skin color...jat is the purest race of India..aur iske proof bhi hai...........samjhe sarkaar......khamakha ki baat mat na karo aade....thaamne jaato tai koi thaddi ranzish deekhe...jo aade naam badal ke inki beizzati ke paacche laag re......waise thaari race/caste kaun si hai.......eibb to aa jaao khul ke saamhi .....

[sachinb]

Bhai manne to yu vohe laagge se,,,,Respected Member:D

Same thing we asked him few weeks back Prashant bhai.... Laagey sei koi BHEDDIYA badd ra sei BHEDD ki khaal mein.... :D

[amans]

Jat is purest race in India? I asked that question to numerous older jats of a and they all laughed - according to them in caste system jat is considered to be a little bit above chuddas. Of course like you maha-rathis claiming jats to be the purest race in India, I too was upset. Then I gave up my ego, jat akad and acknowledged what I see. Some of that I tried to describe a little bit in my previous posts. But hey you can claim whatever you want jats to be. But it looks like you have nothing to offer to support your crap, so buzz off.

[sachinb]

Bhai tu ke haade ke Patwaari laag rhaa se ke tanne supporting document ke naam pe ugaahi ki raseed deekhaava,,,,,,,

Jats are purest of pure,,,,,and it doesnt require any proof:rock

Jat is purest race in India? I asked that question to numerous older jats of a and they all laughed - according to them in caste system jat is considered to be a little bit above chuddas. Of course like you maha-rathis claiming jats to be the purest race in India, I too was upset. Then I gave up my ego, jat akad and acknowledged what I see. Some of that I tried to describe a little bit in my previous posts. But hey you can claim whatever you want jats to be. But it looks like you have nothing to offer to support your crap, so buzz off.

[narenderkharb]

I believe jats are mixture of many different people that migrated/forced their way into India and plus the native dravidians - the descendants of the indus valley people. That is very clear by looking at the physical aspects of a jat. An example of a jat family - both parents are fair/brown skin with say 3 children - One is black skin, second is wheatish, third is light brown(fair)..

Aman you have to start from the beginning .Indus valley people were a majority Caucasian race not Dravidian who have a deep peninsular origin (not the norther Indus Valley origin)confirmed by genetic reports of Sanghmitra and craniometric studies of Hemphill and others.So by the time of Indus Valley civilization, people who are called Jats today were already present here .




But long before Indus Valley Civilization Jats from Northern side decended on Indus Valley plains and took women from negroid (Dravidian if you want to say )and austroasiatic races . But vice verse didn't happen.

So let us be clear that Jats are not mixture of different people but descendants of those Jats who came here and took many native women as their wives.

Now what about many later invading groups like Scythian yeuzhis etc ,they were a later wave of Jat immigration not some other group mixing here with jats.

Just like all other people of India, Jats are a mixed people. In fact, I believe they are a people formed from mixture of different races. In my opinion the Dravidians are related to Africans. They are an African people with straight hair, broad nose and a thin bone structure..

Dravidians are Africans(ethiopians ) we can say in general terms though Dravidian as such is not some distinct ethnic group but a majority of them are indeed descendants of African race but Jats are not a mixture of different groups as No other group mixed in Jat identity who were not Jats earlier .

Who are the other people who mixed with the Dravidian to form jats? Were they aryans, scythians, huns, Persians, Aryans, mongols, turks, greeks, afghans, kushans, and other invaders? It could be a few of these people, some of them or all of them in different degrees of assimilation.

Jats are not a Later derived identity I pointed out earlier also .
Aryans were Scythian and represented second wave of Jats migration.Persian and afghan are not racial words but Makran Sakasthan(persia) Zabulistan Udayan Tokharistan (afghanistan)Turkmenistan etc are recorded under the possession of Jats at various intervals of time.In fact term Indo Iranian is only relevant for Jats if we see in larger historical perspective.

[ARVINDJANGU]

भाई अमन किम्मे गनी दुंगे की सोचन लाग्या , गन्नी गहराई म न चला जाइये ना तो फांसी खाए पंडा छूटेगा | बाकी इतना सोचे पाछे बी तू जी व स या बी एक कमाल की बात स , म तो इतनी गहराई में जाये पाछे फांसी खा जाऊ |
राजपूत के बारे में न्यू बतावे स अक वे असली क्षत्री स और वे एक यघ में पैदा हुवे चार आदमी सोलंकी परमार पर्तिहार और चौहान की औलाद स | म न्यू कहू सु अक भाई तू यघ म आदमी तो छोड़ एक भुंड ऐ पैदा करके दिखा दे , या बात तने मिथ कोणी लागी |

[amans]

Aman you have to start from the beginning .Indus valley people were a majority Caucasian race not Dravidian who have a deep peninsular origin (not the norther Indus Valley origin)confirmed by genetic reports of Sanghmitra and craniometric studies of Hemphill and others.So by the time of Indus Valley civilization, people who are called Jats today were already present here .




But long before Indus Valley Civilization Jats from Northern side decended on Indus Valley plains and took women from negroid (Dravidian if you want to say )and austroasiatic races . But vice verse didn't happen.

So let us be clear that Jats are not mixture of different people but descendants of those Jats who came here and took many native women as their wives.

Now what about many later invading groups like Scythian yeuzhis etc ,they were a later wave of Jat immigration not some other group mixing here with jats.






Dravidians are Africans(ethiopians ) we can say in general terms though Dravidian as such is not some distinct ethnic group but a majority of them are indeed descendants of African race but Jats are not a mixture of different groups as No other group mixed in Jat identity who were not Jats earlier .




Jats are not a Later derived identity I pointed out earlier also .
Aryans were Scythian and represented second wave of Jats migration.Persian and afghan are not racial words but Makran Sakasthan(persia) Zabulistan Udayan Tokharistan (afghanistan)Turkmenistan etc are recorded under the possession of Jats at various intervals of time.In fact term Indo Iranian is only relevant for Jats if we see in larger historical perspective.

When did anyone ever find any human remains from indus valley to do a dna study? Even if they found 1-2 human remains from indus valley cities how can they be sure they are remains of native inhabitants of the indus valley people?

What was the language of the people of the indus valley?

When did the term "jat" began to be used? Where is the mention of "Jat" term in vedas or even in later day hindu religious texts like ramayana/mahabharta/geeta?

If jats took women of dravidian(negroid race) and austroasiatic race = then we the latter day jats - who are their descendants - are a people who are of mixed races obviously! Like I have been saying all along.

That is why you see jats who are light brown skin, wheatish? skin, and black skin.

Just like I said - example of a jat family - 2 parents both light brown skin but their children say 2 of them - 1 black skin and other wheatish skin or black skin or both black skin or 1 light brown skin and other wheatish skin.

Or another example of a jat family - 1 jat male light brown skin, 1 female black skin - their children say 2 - both black skin.
Therefore jats are a mixed people.

You agreed that Dravidians are African people thereby that makes us jats who are descendants of Caucasian Male jats, Dravidian(African women) and austroasiatic women as part dravidians(negroid), part caucasian and part austroasiatic.

Jats are mostly located in northern India and not too long ago they were in Western(sindh) India too - directions from which all invaders came into India. It is thus reasonable to say that they also mixed with them. The invaders just did not just disappear and died all by themsleves. They mixed with the people who were already there just like the Jat Caucasian males did - marrying dravidian and austroasiatic women(as you said).

[sachinb]

I agree with you bhai,,,,,,,are nyu Yag mein kudan te chhatri bange te pher ek be aapna Aman bi kud jyaa ke bera yu bhi ban jyaa chhatri

भाई अमन किम्मे गनी दुंगे की सोचन लाग्या , गन्नी गहराई म न चला जाइये ना तो फांसी खाए पंडा छूटेगा | बाकी इतना सोचे पाछे बी तू जी व स या बी एक कमाल की बात स , म तो इतनी गहराई में जाये पाछे फांसी खा जाऊ |
राजपूत के बारे में न्यू बतावे स अक वे असली क्षत्री स और वे एक यघ में पैदा हुवे चार आदमी सोलंकी परमार पर्तिहार और चौहान की औलाद स | म न्यू कहू सु अक भाई तू यघ म आदमी तो छोड़ एक भुंड ऐ पैदा करके दिखा दे , या बात तने मिथ कोणी लागी |

[narendersingh]

It's really amazing.West above East. Pandaa above all.Maulvee above humanity.We have no record in the history.Why???
Khaandaa,Kamaandaa kisee nai konee suhaav.Sachey aur achhey insaan sey sab bachtey aur kheejtey hai
Kyaaa saaree duniyaa Europe kee taraf thee.
For the kind attention Arab was nomadic.Europe was/is struggling for survival since ages.ismey khaaney ko hai kya.
Hindustaan kee sanskriti ,civilisation aaj takk kyaun jeendaa hai.sansar kee baakee sanskreetiyaan lupt ho gayee.No doubt Hindustaan mein Hinduataan ko khaaney waaley bahut hai.uskey baavjud iskaa vaajood hai.
USA bhee Hindustaan kee taraf bhaag rahaa hai jaise pahley Europe sey trading key leeye aaye they.Hum hindustaaniyaun mein kuch kachar key beejo kee vajah sey desh kaa haal buraa huaa.ek kachaar saarey teemann kaa naash kar deeya karr.

we are a martial kaum. jat is not a hybrid.Jaat is pure breed.











QUOTE=narenderkharb;198975]Hi Parshant

Jats are Scythian and if we go by today's Geography not Indian in strict sense .They didn't move out of India as some historians try to present but moved freely from Scythia .Aryans were Just Scythians ,their real identity was Scythian Aryan was just an honrary word used for a noble person.However first wave of Jats came even before vedic period.

But Scythia is not far away and even included in ancient India's geography Uttar Kuru ,Uttarpath Dakishan path etc were parts of Scythian geography And as per Greeks (periplus of Eurythrian Sea ) even Indus Valley area of Pakistan and Northwestern India was part of this Scythian Jat Nation.A well florished trade existed all along the silk route and carvan moved constantly before muslim invasion these cities had all indian cultural influence noted by various historical authors who travelled along these routes.

Jats were a warrrior Scythian race that travelled vast areas on their swift horses .They travelled between Scythia ,Sogadia,Caspian sea and later even migrated towards west .They came in India in four waves of migration about three I am sure and fourth I am not certain but do have suggestion for and against .One wave came from caspian sea another from tarim basin .This is a long ...long story and I am planning to write and sell it so wait for some time[/QUOTE]

[amans]

भाई अमन किम्मे गनी दुंगे की सोचन लाग्या , गन्नी गहराई म न चला जाइये ना तो फांसी खाए पंडा छूटेगा | बाकी इतना सोचे पाछे बी तू जी व स या बी एक कमाल की बात स , म तो इतनी गहराई में जाये पाछे फांसी खा जाऊ |
राजपूत के बारे में न्यू बतावे स अक वे असली क्षत्री स और वे एक यघ में पैदा हुवे चार आदमी सोलंकी परमार पर्तिहार और चौहान की औलाद स | म न्यू कहू सु अक भाई तू यघ म आदमी तो छोड़ एक भुंड ऐ पैदा करके दिखा दे , या बात तने मिथ कोणी लागी |

I believe Rajputs cooked up fancy stories about their origins.
They are supposed to be descended from the hun(hunnas) invaders of india in reality. Some say they are related to persians too. I have seen lots of black skin rajputs. Obviously they have a lot of dravidian in them too.