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Thread: Sorry not Hindus ...Religion of Jats

  1. #81
    A PIL will not necessarily solve the problem. It will be just one tool.

    The court can only interpret he law. The law is drafted by the Ministry, and passed by parliament. ( Parliament is simply another term for a Khap, is analogous to our Sarv Khap)

    Our question is what did this parliament intend.?

    Why did they draft and make a law that allows same goth marriage, and not only same goth, but 1st cousin marrriage (- marriage of mama- bhanji) under the flimsy claim that it is a local custom d e.g for South Indian Brahmins?

    That being the case why did the drafters of the law ignore the jat customs, and not codify them into the law.

    One reason is that the jats had no organized voice at that time. the South Indian Brahmins , mnay were working in the Ministry and were active in politics, and had the Act drafted to suit their customs.


    So we need to organize and have either the law clarified to include our customs, or have the law changed.

    The Jats have fought unjust laws,- made by rajputs, Muslims, the British.



    That is what will help avoid tragedies like Vedpalji. If the court had told him, they would not recognize his proposed marriage as a Hindu marraige- he would have thought twice.

    Those who still wish to marry can convert and become Muslims

    Our kids must have clarity, where they can marry and where they cannot.




    Law, (Dharam) must prevail. To prevail it must be just.

    Ravi Chaudhary
    Last edited by ravichaudhary; August 8th, 2009 at 08:46 PM.

  2. #82
    2 अगस्त को झज्जर में ढराना गौत्र विवाद के चलते सर्व खाप पंचायत का आयोजन किया गया | इस पंचायत में हमारे बड़े भाई नरेंदर जी खरब व भारती जी सिन्धु ने भी सिरकत की | सर्व खाप पंचायत में कई आवश्यक फैसले लिए गए | पंचायत द्वारा लिए गए फैसले :-
    1) कादयान खाप को तन - मन - धन से सहयोग का वचन |
    2) हिन्दू कोड में परिवर्तन के लिए न्यायलय तथा सरकार के सामने जाना होगा |
    3) जाट समाज के जो लोग गोत्र प्रथा का विरोध कर रहे हैं उन्हें चेतावनी देनी होगी कि वे इस दुष्प्रचार को बंद करे नहीं तो समाज उनके विरूद्व प्रतिबन्ध लगाने पर विचार करेगा |
    4) दुसरे समाज के लोग विशेषकर शाहनी जैसे खत्री जाति के व्यक्ति जो मानवधिकारों के बहाने हमारे समाज को तोड़ने का षड़यंत्र कर रहे हैं उनके समाज के खिलाफ जाट समाज को सख्त फैसले लेने होंगे |
    5) मीडिया जाट पंचायतो को तालीबानी कह रहा हैं और हमारे समाज के भाई - बहन बच्चों को प्रेमी युगल कहकर उनकी हत्या करवा रहा हैं जो इसके लिए जिम्मेवार हैं | मीडिया एक तरफी बात का प्रचार न करे | जाटों कि गोत्र प्रथा को पुर्णतः समझ कर ही अपना प्रचार करे अन्यथा जाट कौम ने भी मीडिया के विरोध में कोई फैसला लेना होगा |
    6) भांजी का मामला छोड़ दिया जाये |
    7) पूर्ण मुदे का निचौड़ हैं कि हिन्दू कोड में गौत्र प्रावधान न होने पर हिन्दू जाटों को छोड़ दुसरे 80 करोड़ हिन्दुओ को हिन्दू कोड से कोई शिकायत नहीं तो साफ़ अर्थ हैं कि हिन्दू जाट हिन्दू नहीं हैं | वह आर्य हैं और उसकी संस्कृति और धर्म वैदिक हैं |


    Think which become obvious in future

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by ravichaudhary View Post
    a pil will not necessarily solve the problem. It will be just one tool.

    The court can only interpret he law. The law is drafted by the ministry, and passed by parliament. ( parliament is simply another term for a khap, is analogous to our sarv khap)

    our question is what did this parliament intend.?

    Why did they draft and make a law that allows same goth marriage, and not only same goth, but 1st cousin marrriage (- marriage of mama- bhanji) under the flimsy claim that it is a local custom d e.g for south indian brahmins?

    That being the case why did the drafters of the law ignore the jat customs, and not codify them into the law.

    one reason is that the jats had no organized voice at that time. The south indian brahmins , mnay were working in the ministry and were active in politics, and had the act drafted to suit their customs.


    so we need to organize and have either the law clarified to include our customs, or have the law changed.

    The jats have fought unjust laws,- made by rajputs, muslims, the british.



    That is what will help avoid tragedies like vedpalji. If the court had told him, they would not recognize his proposed marriage as a hindu marraige- he would have thought twice.

    Those who still wish to marry can convert and become muslims

    our kids must have clarity, where they can marry and where they cannot.




    Law, (dharam) must prevail. To prevail it must be just.

    Ravi chaudhary
    रवि जी चौ.छोटूराम जी एक बात कहते थे की ' ऐ भोले जाट एक तो तू बोलना सीख ले दूसरा दुश्मन को पहचानना सीख ले ' इसमें बोलना सीख ले से चौ साहब का मतलब तहजीब से बोलना नहीं अपने हक के लिए बोलना सीख ले था जो जाट अब तक नहीं सीखे हैं |
    दूसरी बात संविधान की तो शायद चौ.रणबीर हूडा जी इस संविधान मण्डली का हिस्सा थे और मेरे ये समझ नहीं आई के चौ हूडा जी ने इसमें संसोधन क्यों नहीं करवाया वो तो अपनी संस्कृति से अच्छी तरह से वाकिफ थे ?
    " जाट हारा नहीं कभी रण में तीर तोप तलवारों से ,
    जाट तो हारा हैं , गद्दारों से दरबारों से
    |"

    " इस कौम का ईलाही दुखड़ा किसे सुनाऊ ?
    डर हैं के इसके गम में घुल घुल के न मर जाऊँ || "
    ...........................चौ.छोटूराम ओहल्याण

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by narenderkharb View Post
    We are not Hindus Historic declaration by Khap Panchyats
    Jhajjar 2 August.



    In a significant development Khap heads of various khaps from Haryana Up and Rajasthan clarified Jats are not Hindus .Speaking on this occasion veteran Jat Historian Professor Bhalle Ram Beniwal who wrote a book on Jat History clarified that we were Boddhs historically a religion destroyed by onslaught of Brahmanical Hinduism .Jats always fought against this Hinduism and became Muslim ,Sikh and even Arya Samaji in protest of this Varna Vayvastha advocating religion. When Swami Dayanand Visited Haryana and tried to bring back Jats under Hindu fold ,his move was opposed by Priests who declared Jats unfit for Thread as Holy thread is only for Divija and Jats are Adivija not twice born.

    Choudhary Jile Singh Dhankhard head of Dhankhar Khap exposed design of hindutava forces when he says first Jats are called Hindus than they are called Adivaija ,which leave us to lower rank vaisha and Sudra ,Since Jats were never Vaishy so automatically becomes Sudra in Hindu fold .We have been Kashtriyas and should see game plan of Hindutava agents to degrade us.

    Speaking on this occasion another historian who authored book on Jat History demanded Minority status for Jat community .He clarified since no ceremony was held to reconvert us from Buddhism we should not be treated as Hindus and Hindu laws under which Khap of Kadians is prosecuted does not apply to us.

    Call it by any name Jat religion or Jatissm but we are not Hindus and our custom and traditions are different from their custom and traditions (gotra exclusion, Kareva partha etc..)explained a majority of Khap Bujjargs at this occasion.


    Yes we are Hindus. Lord Krishna was Hindu. We are Hindu. Arya Samaj is Hindu.

    quit being ashamed of yourself.
    Last edited by sjakhars; August 31st, 2009 at 04:25 PM. Reason: Offensive sentence removed.

  5. #85

    Sorry not Hindus....Religion of Jats

    We are Hindus

    Prashant Ji,
    Please leep your cool (true to your cool name). We Jats are not only Hindus but the true representatives of what was and is called Hind or Hindustan. According to Majma-ul- Twarikh all Hindus were Jats. The main set was called Jat by the Arabs. It is a different matter that many groups have branched off to cquire seperate identitis and labels.
    What is quoted by Narender Ji was the voice of agony protesting against the treatment meted out to our traditions and customs which are true hinhuite. Let us not take offence against such well meant expressions of anguish.
    Thanks

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by SikarwarRaja View Post
    Yes we are Hindus. Lord Krishna was Hindu. We are Hindu. Arya Samaj is Hindu.

    quit being ashamed of yourself.
    Relax dude! Second post and such bitter reaction!! You may want to refer to this post on "civilized discussion guidelines":
    http://www.jatland.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28170

    And what sort of logic is this?
    Quote Originally Posted by SikarwarRaja View Post
    Yes we are Hindus. Lord Krishna was Hindu. We are Hindu. Arya Samaj is Hindu.
    Last edited by sjakhars; August 31st, 2009 at 04:41 PM. Reason: Sentence removed from quoted post.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by drssrana2003 View Post
    What is quoted by Narender Ji was the voice of agony protesting against the treatment meted out to our traditions and customs which are true hinhuite. Let us not take offence against such well meant expressions of anguish.
    Thanks
    Sir, I think you mean good intentions with "well meant" expression. While it is debatable whether it was an expression of good intentions or authority to prove one's relevance, even if we assume good intentions, how can a good motive be used to justify the action?

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by kapil.dalal View Post
    And what sort of logic is this?
    I will go with the answer "bad sort of logic". :D
    Last edited by sjakhars; August 31st, 2009 at 05:04 PM. Reason: Quoted post has been edited.

  9. #89

    Sorry not Hindus

    I think the current law needs to be amended to the extent that the degrees of prohibition are clearly stated to include at least the gotra of the father and gotra of the mother's father and the brotherhood of immedaiately next village (seemajod biradari) unless the custom and tradition of the relevant area do not disallow such unions in marriage. The current clause (3) and (4) do not help things.

  10. #90

    Adopt Jat Dharam

    May I request all my brothers & sisters to consider my this suggestion seriously, Why cannot jats come back to jat dharam which is any day batter than Hinduism, claim minority status & enjoy your traditions. Those in favour of same gotra marriages can stay with Hindu practices. with warm regards, forgive & forget Fateh.

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  12. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fateh View Post
    May I request all my brothers & sisters to consider my this suggestion seriously, Why cannot jats come back to jat dharam which is any day batter than Hinduism, claim minority status & enjoy your traditions. Those in favour of same gotra marriages can stay with Hindu practices. with warm regards, forgive & forget Fateh.

    Nice idea uncle ji...thought provoking.... why not.... Let us discuss further!
    Last edited by anilsangwan; June 28th, 2010 at 04:29 PM. Reason: minor

  13. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fateh View Post
    Why cannot jats come back to jat dharam which is any day batter than Hinduism, claim minority status & enjoy your traditions. Those in favour of same gotra marriages can stay with Hindu practices.
    I will appreciate is somebody please describe about the "Jat Dharam" and since when we discarded it ( As Fateh ji asking to come back that obviously means that we left it ).

    How and in what ways it is better than Hinduism ?

    Or is it just another thread on Khaps and Gotra issue ?

    Or is it a partition of Jat community on the basis of different ideologies on same gotra marriage issue ?
    Last edited by vijay; June 28th, 2010 at 05:29 PM.
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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  15. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by vijay View Post
    I will appreciate is somebody please describe about the "Jat Dharam" and since when we discarded it ( As Fateh ji asking to come back that obviously means that we left it ).

    How and in what ways it is better than Hinduism ?

    Or is it just another thread on Khaps and Gotra issue ?

    Or is it a partition of Jat community on the basis of different ideologies on same gotra marriage issue ?

    Is that not the very reason, it is suggested to readers,( Nay, they are encouraged) that they become educated in our culture, traditions, and the history thereof?

    If they understand the history of their people, the answers to these questions will come.


    Ravi Chaudhary

    P.S. Dharam does not equate to religion, but to a way of life.

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  17. #94
    Religion is a way of living. Jats are more sync with Arya Samaj philosophy. I never met an die hard jat who keep navratas or goes to temple everyday. Together with other castes of Hindus, we stand better chance to thrive. We can have our own customs and way of living life.

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  19. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by vijay View Post
    I will appreciate is somebody please describe about the "Jat Dharam" and since when we discarded it ( As Fateh ji asking to come back that obviously means that we left it ).

    aaj taahi to tanney koye appreciate naa karyaa , khood ke siwaaye

    How and in what ways it is better than Hinduism ?
    any ism is better then hinduism

    Or is it just another thread on Khaps and Gotra issue ?

    you dont belive in khap and gotra ,so why you are worring.


    Or is it a partition of Jat community on the basis of different ideologies on same gotra marriage issue ?
    yes,it is a one more partition jat sikh,mooley jat ,arya samaaji jat ,sanaatani jat ,jat jat aur jat who belongs to nowhere like you and me and some other

    :rockwhen you found a key to success,some ideot change the lock,*******BREAK THE DOOR.
    हक़ मांगने से नहीं मिलता , छिना जाता हे |
    अहिंसा कमजोरों का हथियार हे |
    पगड़ी संभाल जट्टा |
    मौत नु आंगालियाँ पे नचांदे , ते आपां जाट कुहांदे |

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  21. #96
    There is no ism in hinduism. Its defined for us by foreigners. Earlier hinduism used to refer a whole civilisation, an umbrella of different people and various tradition.
    Last edited by VirJ; June 29th, 2010 at 06:47 AM.
    जागरूक ती अज्ञानी नहीं बनाया जा सके, स्वाभिमानी का अपमान नहीं करा जा सके , निडर ती दबाया नहीं जा सके भाई नुए सामाजिक क्रांति एक बार आ जे तो उसती बदला नहीं जा सके ---ज्याणी जाट।

    दोस्त हो या दुश्मन, जाट दोनुआ ने १०० साल ताईं याद राखा करे

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  23. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by vijay View Post
    I will appreciate is somebody please describe about the "Jat Dharam" and since when we discarded it ( As Fateh ji asking to come back that obviously means that we left it ).

    How and in what ways it is better than Hinduism ?

    Or is it just another thread on Khaps and Gotra issue ?

    Or is it a partition of Jat community on the basis of different ideologies on same gotra marriage issue ?
    Brother, your kind attention is drawn towards post of Raviji, take action accordingly, please pay attention to the post of yudhvirji & still if you have some doubts left, please donnot hasitate to come back, I shall try my best to explaine my point of view. As per my personal view, you should not use words like ( I will appreciate ) such words generally used by very senior or elderly people. thanks, regards
    Last edited by Fateh; June 29th, 2010 at 03:26 PM.

  24. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by ravichaudhary View Post
    Is that not the very reason, it is suggested to readers,( Nay, they are encouraged) that they become educated in our culture, traditions, and the history thereof?

    If they understand the history of their people, the answers to these questions will come.

    Ravi Chaudhary

    P.S. Dharam does not equate to religion, but to a way of life.
    Ravi Ji,

    I don't think that Hinduism is restricting us from educating our folks about our culture, traditions and the History.
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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  26. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by yudhvirmor View Post
    Religion is a way of living. Jats are more sync with Arya Samaj philosophy. I never met an die hard jat who keep navratas or goes to temple everyday. Together with other castes of Hindus, we stand better chance to thrive. We can have our own customs and way of living life.
    Agree with you !

    Nobody is restricting us from following our customs and the way we want to live our lives.
    Survival of the fittest rule is effectively applicable everywhere. Progressive, adjustable and strong-willed community can survive and thrive anywhere.
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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  28. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fateh View Post
    Brother, your kind attention is drawn towards post of Raviji, take action accordingly, please pay attention to the post of yudhvirji & still if you have some doubts left, please donnot hasitate to come back, I shall try my best to explaine my point of view.
    Yudhvir believes ( as he stated above ) that we stand better chance of thriving while staying with other castes of Hinduism.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fateh View Post
    As per my personal view, you should not use words like ( I will appreciate ) such words generally used by very senior or elderly people. thanks, regards
    Thanks for the advice !
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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