Rural under-development- An analysis

[brahmtewatia]

Hi Braham,

Thanks for your very positive and sensible comments. I was in hibernation since my registration on this forum way back in 2006 and you were the motivating force behind my coming out of hibernation. Do you really need my permission to start a new topic captioned as "urban development" ? You are a very serious and mature member of this forum. Sharminda mat karo. Please go ahead

singh sahab,

you got me wrong... 'rural development' has to go with 'rural under-development'... i've no intention to start this topic under different thread, but the idea was to carry out the discussion with a slight discourse to the main theme, and on this very thread... thats all. well, anyway that's obvious as well.

honestly, speaking i am also very impressed with your writing skills. its never too late at JATland... this 'dystopia' (ahahaha) will always remain for you [ ;-) ] as i hope to see more of your participation and the very best from you... and off-course i would love to digg out your platonic thoughts (as said earlier) as well... though at a later stage. (again ahahaha)

now me... serious (if not senior) and mature ??? ahahaha... not at all... this is just an eye-wash

[kapdal]

Brahm,

I agree that we can't really ape any country's developmental model. India has its unique set of conditions, and any solution has to keep that in mind. Having said that, one can always learn from others' experiences. A car may need some different features keeping in mind Indian roads, but one doesn't need to reinvent the engine from the scratch.

The key point, in my opinion, is that you can't have more than 70% of population contributing to only 20% of GDP. I fully agree that the infrastructure for rural India needs to be improved by leaps and bounds. Better roads, information on prices, availability of seeds/fertilisers, etc. is going to give the agriculture sector a boost. But only till a point. The huge labor oversupply would mean that:
1. The wage of a laborer working in agriculture is going to be low.
2. Land holdings would become even smaller, making farming more inefficient. Successful farmers have huge tracts of land that give them economy of scale.
3. Outright unemployment, or disguised/seasonal unemployment (You have 5 people working on a piece of land where 1 is enough.) Apart from depressing income, unemployment also leads to other social problems as the unemployed youths' energy gets diverted to less desirable areas (crime, alcohol, drugs, etc.)

So even if you remove all other bottlenecks that are stifling agriculture right now, you can't go beyond a point as long as you have this huge labor oversupply. On the other hand, you have the manufacturing/service sector that is constrained by labor undersupply. There is a huge shortage of skilled work force in India, be it, engineers, doctors, scientists, teachers, etc. Even the govt. sector is hugely understaffed in police, defence, health, education, etc. The obvious conclusion is that labor needs to shift from rural agrarian society to the maufacturing/service sector. If you don't plan for it, it'd happen anyways leading to urban slums, congestion, crime and the associated jazz. The problem is not urbanization, but not doing it in a planned way.

My point about civilization and cities was to stress that any organized industry needs a critical no. of people and resources to come together and that is not possible in a standard sized village. So, yes, urbanization is the solution. But that doesn't mean mega-cities only. In fact mega-cities like Delhi and Mumbai become inefficient due to governance issues. However, we still need more metropolitan cities than we have right now. But more than that we need towns and smaller cities like Jamshedpur set up by TATAs (never been there, but heard it is very well planned). Is there any town/city that GoI has planned since independence? We need to develop Rohtak so that people don't land up in a Delhi suburb hunting for opportunities. Or much worse, from Azamgarh to Dharavi.

A town like Rohtak can act as nerve center for villages surrounding it (It already does to an extent but the scale needs to be much bigger). For example, food processing industry bordering Rohtak can provide employment to the surrounding population; while benefiting from the availability of raw materials. The farmers can then grow what is needed in the industry rather than growing what is going to be bought by the govt. at Min Support price. Once you have a big enough industry employing a large no. of people, you need all kinds of services from restaurants to schools to shopping complexes, which employ more people. The govt. having to spend less on subsidies to the farmers in form of MSP and making additional money from taxation of industry can use that money to hire teachers, police and doctors and build roads, hospitals and schools. So you systematically take care of the labor inequilibrium and unemployment, while improving the standard of living of everyone. The above is a very crude representation of how urbanization can transform rural landscape, but the attempt is to convey the basic idea.

[sanjaymalik]

Resurgence Rural India.

Forget those images of raveged villagers, kid with distended bellies and ragged cloths and future as girm as the cracked sun baked earth. Island of poverty still exist but most of rural India is transformed beyond imaginations and thanks to a host of factors like alternate crops, water managing technique and Land pricing boom, which has put inpresedence wealth into the hand of farmer across the country and turns it into a huge consumer market. Latest statics show that agriculture growth and rural income has largerly beeen unaffected by economic slowdown, despite the fact that the contribution of agriculture to total rural income has actually comedown.Instead we have growing service industry and alternate revenue channels for horticulture, polutry, fishers and other activities which are less rain dependent and were vitually non existent a decade ago .India's 6,38,000 villages which harbour 72.2%, once the albatross around its neck are now signpost to its future..Call it new adventurism or enterpreneurship but most farmer have gained from these new techniques .Rising price may be pinching the pokect of urban consumer, but it has brought new affluence to farmers who have already their income in recent years, alongwith aspiration.Peoples owns new expensive mobils in villages and new bikes and even cars( not struck to Maruti 800 only as before 7 or 8 years back).they have nothing to do with recessions.
New innovaton apart from crop chages innovative farming technique are boosting productivities,encouraging new enterpreunership and having huge social impact.
Much of the prosperity is to do with connectivity and new channels of communications. Rural road projects have made it easier and faster for farmers to get their produce to markets which communication tools have given them e-choupal reaches 3.5 mill farmers giving them instent acess to new varieties of crops, pricing and markets.Bardhaman in WB became first in country to became fully internet connect with panchayat organising video conference across distt. Modern management technique like drip immigration give farmer water to irrigate three crops.
Rural Land price boom- this sigle biggest reason for the kind of money visible in rural India in skyrockting prices of land which increased their wealth and those who are wise enough have invested,their income in alternative resources.
Nothing can illustrate the remarkable changes in rural India.Today women wear decent sari, suit gold rings and other ornaments and having given jobs at local centre for family health care, education and privat institutions. People are spending as much as they can on their kids education in convent schools.Those deparates days of starvation and near death are distant memory.
Although i have already mentioned in begining of my post that island of poverty is still exist.its the phase of resurgence. Revamping Face of rural india.
Regards
Sanjay

[singhvp]

VP singhji,

There is no denying the fact that development of rural India leaves much to be desired. Though some good developments did take place post independence like land reforms and the green revolution, but the cumulative effort has been much less than what was required. Having said that, I consider your diagnosis of the problem in "urban vs rural" terms as flawed. Rural India is not under-developed because the emphasis has been on urban India. It is underdeveloped because there are far too many people subsiding on land than is possible.

I'd instead argue that the problem with rural India is because of the failure to develop urban Indian properly. Can we name one planned city that the govt. has come up with since independence? The likes of Gurgaon are extensions of existing cities. I am talking about stand alone cities built from the scratch. Through out the history of mankind, development has taken place around cities. All civilizations built cities which became the nerve centers for economic action for them. A village in itself just doesn't have the numbers for making any big project economically feasible. Just imagine a big hospital or a big mall or a university opened in a village. Where would the demand be to justify the investment? These things have to come up in the nearest town/city, which need to be well connected to the villages through roads, telephones, etc.

Population of India is 1.2bn, of which more than 70% live in rural India. Majority of these are involved in agriculture. This is more than 3 times since independence. So number of people living off the land has tripled, while the amount of land has remained almost the same. This is just not sustainable. When a peon earns more than a farmer, it just tells you that there are far too many farmers than is economically feasible. People understand that and hence you see mass scale migration to the cities.

.
[URL]http://www.csrees.

Dear Kapil,


First of all I am taking the liberty of addressing you by first name as you look much younger than me in your profile picture.

Thank you for acknowledging the fact that all is not well as far as development in rural areas is concerned and much more is desired to be done. I also found your argument convincing that my diagnosis in terms of “rural vs urban” was flawed. Though it was well intended without any bias to city-dwellers, you may not find the presentation in an articulate and coherent manner . Thank you for correcting me.


As far as pressure and labour inequilibrium is concerned, the onus, perhaps, lies on the State for taking corrective measures by creating new employment avenues. As you must be aware it is almost impossible to get a jobs in government sector in many states (at least in Haryana ) unless you are a relative or a crony of some Minister or MLA or have the purchasing power. As far as private sector is concerned, the position seems to be dismal. Inspite of substantial growth in manufacturing and service sector, over the years, only those having some technical knowledge, vocational diploma or degrees viz. B.E. , MBA etc. stand a chance there and not average village folks. So how the pressure on agriculture sector will be eased.? A paradigm shift in economic module is needed. In my view a reasonable portion of wealth generated by the much-hyped growth of GDP should be diverted to the countryside for making better infrastructure viz. power houses, highways, Engineering and technical institutes, research centres, hospitals and also some industries like food processing depending upon availability of raw material an requisite facilities. This process will generate employment for rural people and create congenial conditions for increased economic activity like trade and auxiliary services viz. banking, insurance and recreational centres which will ease pressure on cities also. Anyway it is a matter of prolonged and unending debate. Thanks again for offering your views.



Also I have found your post in reply to Shri Braham Tewatia very subtle and convincing.

[singhvp]

Resurgence Rural India.

Forget those images of raveged villagers, kid with distended bellies and ragged cloths and future as girm as the cracked sun baked earth. Island of poverty still exist but most of rural India is transformed beyond imaginations and thanks to a host of factors like alternate crops, water managing technique and Land pricing boom, which has put inpresedence wealth into the hand of farmer across the country and turns it into a huge consumer market.
Sanjay

Sanjay Bhai,

Only yesterday, there was a news item carried by Zee News (also may be carried by print media) narrating a money distribution ceremony in Bhadoi constituency in UP where the Minister of Higher Education was shown distributing money (Rs. 50 each). The ceremony was attended by an odd number of about 5000 poor villagers consisting of ladies in majority. The poor ladies were shown touching the "smelly" feet of the Minister for such a meagre amount ( 50 Rupees). Isn't it pathetic. It is a testimony, how desperate the situation is. How can we be so complacent and oblivious of the abject poverty afflicting millions and millions of people living below poverty line. Another documentary proof is the exercise of making BPL cards undertaken by various State governments including Haryana. If our villages are so prosperous, where is the need of all this exercise. By government's own admission, the number and percentage of people living below poverty line is quite high (I do not have the authentic figures at the moment). It is ironical that instead of contributing our bit to this cause, we are not even willing to acknowledge this.

[sanjaymalik]

Sanjay Bhai,

Only yesterday, there was a news item carried by Zee News (also may be carried by print media) narrating a money distribution ceremony in Bhadoi constituency in UP where the Minister of Higher Education was shown distributing money (Rs. 50 each). The ceremony was attended by an odd number of about 5000 poor villagers consisting of ladies in majority. The poor ladies were shown touching the "smelly" feet of the Minister for such a meagre amount ( 50 Rupees). Isn't it pathetic. It is a testimony, how desperate the situation is. How can we be so complacent and oblivious of the abject poverty afflicting millions and millions of people living below poverty line. Another documentary proof is the exercise of making BPL cards undertaken by various State governments including Haryana. If our villages are so prosperous, where is the need of all this exercise. By government's own admission, the number and percentage of people living below poverty line is quite high (I do not have the authentic figures at the moment). It is ironical that instead of contributing our bit to this cause, we are not even willing to acknowledge this.

Dear Sir,
With due respect i acknowledges your views as i have had candidly admit the factum of island of povety still exists in my post.But i have been witnessed a lot of transformation in rurual India since last one decade or at a fast ratio in 5 or 6 years.Peoples are spending more on health, education, and for thier own development at least specially in Hartyana. It's a phase of revamping not totally revamped. Education systems or quaility of education is improving due to surge of private schools or convent schools. But still rural youth lacking some skills which need to improve and make them to fetch some good jobs.
Regards
sanjay

[malikdeepak1]

Dear Sir,
With due respect i acknowledges your views as i have had candidly admit the factum of island of povety still exists in my post.But i have been witnessed a lot of transformation in rurual India since last one decade or at a fast ratio in 5 or 6 years.Peoples are spending more on health, education, and for thier own development at least specially in Hartyana. It's a phase of revamping not totally revamped. Education systems or quaility of education is improving due to surge of private schools or convent schools. But still rural youth lacking some skills which need to improve and make them to fetch some good jobs.
Regards
sanjay

True bhaisaab! Par iska kshetr seemit hai. Haryana me Mahendergarh, Rewari me ja ke dekho. Saher bhi gaam barga laage se. Unke gaama ki haalat to fir soch e sako ho. Development hua hai par har jagah nahi. Rajasthan situation, which VP ji told in his post, is correct to a great extent. Major part of rajsthan rural area has not developed to that extent where children will(should) be knowing essentially about Pen drives/DVDs. Khaan ne daane nahi hote unke ghra me, pen drive to jab chalani seekhe the. Kayi gaon me to jane ke liye sadak bhi nahi hai. It needs LOADS of improvement there to enhance their living standards.

Rohtak/ Sonipat side I would agree with you that most of the villages are now well connected and have got basic amenities within their reach. They have progressed well in the reign of Hooda. Same for Sirsa in term of Chautala. But it won't give you the actual picture of Haryana as a whole. I can't assume that all the villages have got all the basic amenities and their living standard has been raised just based on these few districts, since I reside nearby it and everything I see around me looks good.
The situation needs to be assessed as a whole and not in parts only!

[singhvp]

True bhaisaab! Par iska kshetr seemit hai. Haryana me Mahendergarh, Rewari me ja ke dekho. Saher bhi gaam barga laage se. Unke gaama ki haalat to fir soch e sako ho. Development hua hai par har jagah nahi. Rajasthan situation, which VP ji told in his post, is correct to a great extent. Major part of rajsthan rural area has not developed to that extent where children will(should) be knowing essentially about Pen drives/DVDs. Khaan ne daane nahi hote unke ghra me, pen drive to jab chalani seekhe the. Kayi gaon me to jane ke liye sadak bhi nahi hai. It needs LOADS of improvement there to enhance their living standards.

Rohtak/ Sonipat side I would agree with you that most of the villages are now well connected and have got basic amenities within their reach. They have progressed well in the reign of Hooda. Same for Sirsa in term of Chautala. But it won't give you the actual picture of Haryana as a whole. I can't assume that all the villages have got all the basic amenities and their living standard has been raised just based on these few districts, since I reside nearby it and everything I see around me looks good.
The situation needs to be assessed as a whole and not in parts only!

It is a very pragmatic evaluation of the situation.

(Deepak Bhai halat to jyada Sonepat ke gaman ke bhi achchi konya. Par Bhai meri Sasural hai sonepat district mein Dahiya Khap mein. Ye Dahiya Badshah naraj ho jyange aur pher Bhai Sonepat mei rahna muskil kar denge. Isliya Sonepat ka jikar nahi kiya. Aar halat Rohtak ke gammon ke bhi itni achch nahin sai. Hooda Sahab ke an te pehle Rohtak ke pas me Bohar gam dekhya tha, bhai galiyan mein ganda pani bhara tha aur gobar bhi kafi parya tha yehan vehan. ye bhai log vaise hi "Switzerland" se compare kar rahen hain apne aak ko. Inko yeh nahin pata ke is "Bagri Jat" ne Switzerland bhi Ghoom ke dekh rakhya sai, Kora Bagri nahin sai).

Anyway, it was in a lighter vein. I hope friends from Rohtak and Sonepat will not feel offended. But it is true conditions in the villages of these districts also not that cosy as depicted by some distinguished and learned members earlier. I have travellled in so many villages of Rohtak and Sonepat districts. However, Hooda Sahab is now doing well in Rohtak and surroundings but pace in other parts is still very slow and the process need to be catalyzed. Thanks for the feedback and keep giving your valuable comments.

[jitendershooda]

you got me wrong... 'rural development' has to go with 'rural

http://www.ndtv.com/news/india/a-bag...woes-17537.php

[brahmtewatia]

http://www.ndtv.com/news/india/a-bag...woes-17537.php

भाईसाहब फेर त या प्रॉब्लम हो जायेगी
v
v
v
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSKnhCB0nEk

[brahmtewatia]

this is true that the development in rural villages hasn’t been up to the mark. reasons can be many, poor vision, poor implementation, lack of infra-structure, education, lack of energy resources, corrupt practices and last but not the least – our crooked politicians and the population.

we go round and round the discussion, with no concrete answer.

okay take urbanization to be the answer !… but, this is already happening today with the development of tier II and tier III cities, though with the by-product called ‘urban slums’. most indians living in villages would welcome the chance of living in well-designed efficient cities. they are already doing so as is evidenced by the fact that tens of millions of rural people migrate to cities, often choosing to live in urban slums. they are voting with their feet saying that life in an urban slum is preferable to life in a village... sad, but true !

again, for a moment i believe that rural population of india has to urbanize… and the correct answer might still lie in urbanization. that being said, it goes without mentioning that no doubt there is a need to have new urban centers to accommodate the hundreds of millions of rural people. now, imagine building absolutely new cities from scratch for say 500/600 or may be 700 million people. imagine 500/600 or 700 new large cities of one million people each. imagine building houses, schools, shopping centers, parks, factories, roads, public utilities, hospitals, libraries etc etc… and imagine doing that using the best urban planning known to humanity (<<< this may pls. be noted) can india afford that much ???

in my personal opinion this should happen naturally by improving the infrastructure and capacity of existing cities. forced development, as in setting up of new cities can be counterproductive. this is because it is more difficult and more costly to get water, drainage, jobs, correct location, people etc than it is to improve an existing city. plus this can have many bottlenecks like red-tape bureaucracy, corruption apart from proper planning and the cost involved, as mentioned earlier.

ok let’s start playing the blame game >>> politicians > over-population > lack of education > infrastructure > red-tape bureaucracy > poor implementation > corrupt politicians > education > ### (<<< you can add anything here, eventually the buck stops at the politicians)

… there you are… going round and round in the same vicious circle.

[vijay123]

You guys have very high expectations. The reality is that whether we like it or not, govt invests where she can get returns. Govt is investing thousands of crores of Rs in building several lane highways as they get private companies also in investing them. There will be a return in the form of toll tax, octroi etc. Same is not true in case of rural development, there is no tangible returns by building roads, providing water etc. I think you got the point what I am trying to say here. Only villages that has prosperous people living in it or ouside are developed. Going back 15 years I remember there were few villages in Punjab from whom every family has atleast one person abroad at that time. Those villages looked better than cities. Each house was a kothi better than you see in cities and has big cars parked inside. I dont think you will see govt building sewage system or water supply in any village, it's people who built them for their use.

[brahmtewatia]

vijay... who/what is govt?

[vijay123]

Kendriya or Rajya Sarkaar.

vijay... who/what is govt?

[brahmtewatia]

Kendriya or Rajya Sarkaar.

and who constitutes kendriya or rajya sarkar ?

now don't say our 'elected representatives'... the answer is politicians !... and the buck stops here !

correct ?

[annch]

And who elects these politicians?

and who constitutes kendriya or rajya sarkar ?

now don't say our 'elected representatives'... the answer is politicians !... and the buck stops here !

correct ?

[vijay123]

Gaam ka jo pardhaan ban jaa na uski bhi niyat paise khaan ki hi ho ja. Politicians ko to kya dosh do.

and who constitutes kendriya or rajya sarkar ?

now don't say our 'elected representatives'... the answer is politicians !... and the buck stops here !

correct ?

[upendersingh]

You guys have very high expectations. The reality is that whether we like it or not, govt invests where she can get returns. Govt is investing thousands of crores of Rs in building several lane highways as they get private companies also in investing them. There will be a return in the form of toll tax, octroi etc. Same is not true in case of rural development, there is no tangible returns by building roads, providing water etc. I think you got the point what I am trying to say here. Only villages that has prosperous people living in it or ouside are developed. Going back 15 years I remember there were few villages in Punjab from whom every family has atleast one person abroad at that time. Those villages looked better than cities. Each house was a kothi better than you see in cities and has big cars parked inside. I dont think you will see govt building sewage system or water supply in any village, it's people who built them for their use.

But they are paying very high price for this 'rural development'




Over 20,000 youths from Punjab attempt illegal migration every year to 57 different countries. The trend is also spreading to the neighbouring states of Haryana, Himachal Pradesh and Jammu and Kashmir, says a report “Smuggling of Migrants from India to Europe and in particular to UK from Punjab and Haryana” released by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC).


The report, released on Thursday, says forged visas of 41 countries are being used, and many instances of forged visas for Italy, Greece, France, Spain and UK have come to light.


Over one lakh Punjabi youths are behind bars in foreign countries and face deportation. In the last one year, 20 countries have approached the Indian government to deport 1,195 Punjabi youths, with Ukraine topping the list with 282 persons, adds the report.


While illegal migration is reported from Jalandhar, Hoshiarpur, Kapurthala and Nawanshahr districts of Punjab, in Haryana such cases are witnessed in Ambala, Kurukshetra, Karnal and Kaithal. As per the report, the reasons for illegal migration are varied: high unemployment rate, general attitude of youth that migration is the best alternative, potential illegal migrants consider other successful migrants their role models, and illegal migration not being a stigma amongst families.
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/20...-report/589810

[vijay123]

Rewards are always proportional to Risks. Go to a city in Punjab and then compare it with a city in UP and you will see the difference. Rest all are just arguments.

But they are paying very high price for this 'rural development'

[vijay123]

Anjoo ji, ek khoob padha likha aadmi bhi yeh soch rakhta hai ki MCD ya DDA mei lag jaon ya phir koi aisi nauri lage jisme 2 no ki kamai khoob ho. Pher hum kyun in neta logon ko single out karte rehte hai?

And who elects these politicians?