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Thread: Justice of Khap Panchayats on within same gotra/village marriages, how far good/fair?

  1. #1

    Justice of Khap Panchayats on within same gotra/village marriages, how far good/fair?

    Disclaimer: This is my personal opinion on what should be and should not be in a civil society of mera samaaj…so should not be taken or applied on or to a society, justice body or person. Purpose is to put views and suggestions on the desk of mera samaaj ofcourse…because “Change is the rule of Time and the societies or particular groups of people who follow it create the new society of new generation who knows how to nurture mera samaaj with the beautiful combination of traditional customs and advanced current global social development.

    So I start now on my real topic: “Justice of Khap Panchayats on within same gotra/village marriages…how far fair, how far wrong?”

    Well ofcourse there is no need to tell whom I am calling here if taken on general then it could be applied to any part of India where such Panchayats rule and decide the norms for living in society. But in particular the incidents and reasons which intend me to write are happening around almost 200 KMs radius taking New Delhi as center.

    In this radius as far as I know, there have been some thumb rules not just rules but golden rules which defines the very higher and I would say perhaps the most developed standards of living a healthy and prosperous peaceful and respective life. Ofcouse when these rules were defined there have been many considerations including scientific as well as religious and social harmony traits.

    One among these is:
    “In your home village and Gotra…every girl is a sister and every boy is a brother…doesnt matter of which caste if he or she is from same village…doesnt matter if he or she is from same gotra from around the world, in short and standard “Gaon aur Gout mein sab bhaai-bahan.”

    Note: We Jats are forgetting to follow one pricipal given by Swami Dayananda Sarswati that I am giving the principles of Arya Samaaj but these would require time to time attention and discussions, to nurture and keep them enrich and demanding in future societies. The only thing we will need to do is to reform them, restructure them but not to forget or throw-out from society like a wound because these are our identities. But how...???

    For me, in such cases of same gotra/village marriages giving punishment of excile is ok because it has been the standard and our holy vedic adaptation too but converting the husband and wife to brother-sister is like there is no respect or status of the holy relation of brother and sister....and anyone can be brother and sister..there should be a boundry in defining the relations....to me excile is a better solution than converting them into brother-sister. How far it is good that to teach some one a lesson for their mistake, make the joke of brother-sister relation (sibling relation)...give them excile if they are in mistake but dont insist boundryless decisions. And that is why perhaps the Highcourt of Punjab and Haryana is angry with Panchayats.

    I will put more details on this topic in my next edition with explanations and consequences happening around this rule in our mera samaaj and how this rule is losing the identity and how it could be saved if it deserve so with an analysis on its relevancy to current system and society where these traits not only have to fight with their own people but the reasons because of which these traits are on halt to starve and survive and how can Khaps and Panchayats could be useful and could do favorable to society.

  2. #2
    Thanks Jatland Form for approval and publication of this article.

    I hope you make agree with me that in any society around the world, we cant put on halt or throw the priceless ancestor's traditions and customs but in parallel we cant also close our eyes from changes happening around the socieities.

    Keeping this vision in mind I have started this thread, so I would like to welcome and discuss views, feedbacks and comments from you viewers and thinkers (youngers, matures and elders all) on this open discussion platform.

  3. #3
    How can Khaps play a vital role in standardization and reformation of societies, some suggestions?

    First scenario: Under the dark shadows of increasing cases of honor killings, I was talking with few of my friends from Punjabi community in Haryana on marriages norms defined in their societies to see if really Jats are the only who are still following the so called orthodox traditions. They said that yes we also leave the surname of our father and in special cases the surname of our mother too but not compulsory but we hardly or perhaps not at all go for self-defined decisions and courts (these were their comments as per their best knowledge so if by chance these are not real, I do sorry but such comments makes the discussion healthy and enrich ourselves with surroundings, citation is needed from readers if someone could or might better known and explain any of the other societies views under such scenarios).

    So if I try to set a resemblance in their norms and Jat community norms (sound on big scale but can be any community) differences are not big but their norms seems much better flexible, revised and adjusting to new generation. Jat community also has a good set but seems they have lost compatibility or forgotten the necessity for setting up the compatibility. So one good scope where community khaps could be contributive is investigating and reading these traditions and norms accepted in other societies, particularly on marriages and compare them. Go for open discussions and get the involvement of all communities and also the representatives of Punjab and Haryana High court.

    I am totally against the honor killing, converting already married couples to brothers and sisters because these kinds of decisions are either seen as time killing for the decisive bodies or carry some personal jealous or ego issues. Such decisions can never carry a real spirit of true justice.

    Second Scenario: Young generation is unknown and unable to set compatibility between what they see outside the village (in cities) or through televisions and ground level village community traditions and norms. They don’t find themselves comfortable when facing the new life of cities or town because either they may have not been made informed with or told about it. But they find the relevancy what is shown on TVs to city lives so consequently starts considering it as the standard without knowing the bad and negative impacts of it on their life following their societies. Village culture is put on halt by some high aspirant people living in cities and is criticized as known good for nothing. Consequently this gives a negative impression of their mother culture to new entrants in city life and they intend or decide to follow the city trends not only in terms of earnings but as social too. Overall saying is this that we have to make the villages’ culture, customs and values as standardized and shouted as the cities one. The city one is nothing but the reformed and revised set of village culture itself. The only need is of a mediocre who could pass the good of both cultures to new and young generations. And this is where Khap Panchayats have the vital, wide and really very respect gaining and good will creating role for them.

    It is really ridiculous that there is hardly seen a serial on Haryanvi culture which shows the real Haryanvi values of national level (SAB TV is showing one such serial called “Na aana laado is desh”) as has been enhanced by our neighbors. Panchayats should come on this platform, start conferences, discussions and request TV channels, producers, TV serial directors to produce something relevant to our society and custom. Encourage such people on moral bases as well as supporting them financially so that at least there should be one serial on TV channels like Star TV, Zee TV, Sahara TV and all other such national level channels. Jat communities are known for social reforms; remind yourself of Arya Samaaj, you people only have opened Gurukuls, throughout India (North India in specific) and that too without any governmental aid with your own charity. So now is the time to do this charity for these kinds of activities.

    Today every home in Haryana has either its on TV set, computer with Internet accessibility or in the worst case if you don’t have TV in your home, your next door neighbors must have it. TV is the most entertaining and knowledge gaining medium for children. So Khaps panchayats can unite on this platform, there is no better medium other than TV to make you children of modern age knowing your custom and traditions too. This is not only the way of emphasizing Khap Panchayats role and good will to society but many more too like in schools through moral classes, in families through grand-parents, in villages through respective and honorable elder. All these have to come ahead and take their responsibility and then see there would not be any such case in future neither from side neither of young generation nor from the Khaps Panchayats.

    There is nothing done yet but a lot is to do. I will keep discussing in my next editions on such ways and reforms. In the mean time your views and feedback are expected and important to give a horizontal direction to this discussion.

    Phool Kumar

  4. #4
    Khaps should be totally abolished.They are of no use. More than 99% judgments are made under ego/jealousy/ self satisfaction/externally motivated/influenced.
    First of all khaps leaders should start from their family first.

    Same gotra marriage are no big issues that could justify murders at any point..
    Every khaps/panchayat or any other such stinking systems should try to remember that in their age at night how many houses they have jumped in their village itself or how long they have waited in the fields ... ..:rock .It seems most of the boys/girls from a same village are of same gotras....HAHAAAAAAAA
    In todays world most of the peoples are not remembering their castes gotra is a too big deal..
    Instead of circling the HOOKAH & giving ridiculous judgments ,Go and try to educate some poor kids or clear the Nalis(drainage systems) & prevent mosquito breedings, Summers are coming or else die with malaria/dengue.
    Initially I thought JATS are great being/culture/tradition/attitude but now i feel they too are becoming just like other castes.
    Its still time there we can change & give back the original glory to JATS.
    Lets start from our home..

    Note: Please don't try to show Jat attitude here on jatland.com.All peoples are jat here, so A monkey calling A monkey is of no use..

    Regards..
    I wish to born & die again as JAT.

    तू छोड़ रहा है तो ख़ता इसमें तेरी क्या,
    हर शख़्स मेरा साथ निभा भी नहीं सकता।


  5. #5
    I have been quoting the following from Wiki:

    Hindu Mythology:
    ===========
    In the Mahabharata, one of the two great Hindu Epics, Arjuna took as his fourth wife his first and cross cousin Subhadra, the sister of Krishna. Arjuna had gone into exile alone after having disturbed Yudhisthira and Draupadi in their private quarters. It was during the last part of his exile, while staying at the Dvaraka residence of his cousins, that he fell in love with Subhadra. While eating at the home of Balaramaji, Arjuna was struck with Subhadra's beauty and decided he would obtain her as his wife. Subhadra and Arjuna's son was the tragic hero Abhimanyu. Abhimanyu himself married his first cross-cousin Sasirekha, the daughter of Subhadra's brother Balarama, meaning that first-cousin marriage occurred in the same family for two consecutive generations. Later, Abhimanyu and his other wife Uttara had a son, Parikshit, who eventually succeeded Yudhisthira as the emperor of the Pandava kingdom after Abhimanyu was killed at Kurukshetra.

    Hindu Marriage Act:
    =============
    In Hinduism marriage within the same gotra is prohibited, where a gotra is believed to be the group of descendants of a sage who lived in the remote past. Two persons in the same gotra cannot marry even if they come from different linguistic areas. However, same-gotra marriages have been legal under Indian civil law since the Hindu Marriage Act of 1955. Additionally, marriages within certain degrees of consanguinity are considered sapinda and banned in Hinduism. Hindu lawgivers differ in the definition of sapinda: at one extreme, according to some sources marriages are prohibited within seven generations on the father's side and five on the mother's side. In contrast, other sources allow cross cousins to marry, including first cross cousins. The Hindu Marriage Act bars marriage for five generations on the father's side and three on the mother's side, but allows cross-cousin marriage where it is permitted by custom.

    Genetic Impact:
    ==========
    Cousin marriage has genetic aspects that do not arise in the case of other marriage-related political and social issues like interracial marriage. This is because married couples possessing higher than normal consanguinity have, on average, an increased chance of sharing genes for recessive traits. Consanguinity means the amount of shared (identical) DNA, the genetic material. The percentage of consanguinity between any two individuals decreases fourfold as the most recent common ancestor recedes one generation. To cite some examples, first cousins have four times the consanguinity of second cousins, while first cousins once removed have half that of first cousins. Rare double first cousins have twice that of first cousins and are as related as half-siblings.

    Jat Customs:
    ========
    In order to avoid the second cousin marriages, we drafted the rule of marriages in community called lineage exclusion rule (called as gotra exclusion rule). Earlier it was strictly a lineage exclusion rule as we used to have closed paternal relations within the same gotra, closed maternal relations within the mother's and grandmother's gotra. It was drafted to avoid the second cousin marriages in the community.
    Over the times the community grew, so did the gotras. But more worryingly, we forgot about the core issue and associated it with shallow honour, as we grew treating girl as inferior in the society and girls' family as inferior to boys' family in marriage functions. This has lead us to current problem, where we don't know if the issue is genetic or honour issue.
    My suggestion as solution to the problem is following:
    a. Same gotra marriages should be discouraged, not because it affects the honour of the family, but it risks genetic disorder to the offspring of the couple. (we are already doing the same)
    b. If in case we get to know a potential same gotra marriage, rather than being hostile and repulsive, we should get the boy and girl (possibly with their family) counselled with doctors, only if they are first or second cousins. Our society needs to be honest towards the problem.
    c. For the same gotra couples (who have already married), get them counselled through doctors as well, if they happen to be first or second cousins.
    Regards,
    Jitender Singh Gahlawat

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  7. #6

    Traditions and rituals are bound to change as we evolve !

    tradition is generally defined as long-standing beliefs, practices or customs that have been handed down from one generation to the next. every culture, every race or group of people have their own rich customs nd traditions. in thinking about the importance of tradition, traditions are practiced throughout every civilization known to man nd have several key elements. in specific nd with JAT’s in particular… i would focus on only two aspects of our traditions...

    (1). traditions have guardians such as historians, panchayti’s, khandwe wale khap chaudharies that have access or suppose to have the knowledge or the truth of tradition's sacred rituals.

    (2). tradition stirs emotion within individuals to bring about a greater sense of self-awareness. in some cultures, like ours these rituals are important to one's self-identity within the context of a larger society.

    that being said, the problem comes when these two belief’s of tradition come in way of changing times. you can treat the global age today as a battle between modernity and tradition. family traditions are, unfortunately, one of the great casualties of modern times. as families become more fragmented nd disconnected, there is less time nd opportunity to enjoy the simple traditions that were once a natural part of family life… sad, but true !

    many of us remember nd miss the little rituals that formed the basis of our own childhood, yet don’t see a way to fit them into a life that is so different from that of our parents when we were growing up.

    traditions nd rituals change with the passage of time as we evolve. new traditions nd ways of living come in force every single day to ease out complexities of our erstwhile traditions nd for the betterment of our lives. sometimes, we even chose them as per our convenience. there is no "one size fits all" solution to today’s increasingly complicated family situations, instead fit your traditions to your family situation and the people in it.

    the law of universe gives everyone equal opportunity to embrace this world nd you only live once.

    this however, can never negate the existence nd importance of our century old traditions nd rituals. but a dictatorial attitude, as that of khaps does no good, but to remind us of our barbarous past, when we were evolving. every parents try their utmost to inculcate the very best of virtue’s in their sibblings. if we find few off-beat couple choosing their destiny against our customs, so be it… let them live their own life. these are just few cases that you can count on tips nd by no means will disturb the genetic dna code of jats.
    Last edited by brahmtewatia; April 7th, 2010 at 12:00 PM.
    ! ... be BOLD in what you stand for !
    !! ... i've the simplest tastes, i'm always satisfied with the best !!
    !!! ... be yourself, everyone else is already taken !!!

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by jitender.singh View Post
    I have been quoting the following from Wiki:

    Hindu Mythology:
    ===========
    In the Mahabharata, one of the two great Hindu Epics, Arjuna took as his fourth wife his first and cross cousin Subhadra, the sister of Krishna. Arjuna had gone into exile alone after having disturbed Yudhisthira and Draupadi in their private quarters. It was during the last part of his exile, while staying at the Dvaraka residence of his cousins, that he fell in love with Subhadra. While eating at the home of Balaramaji, Arjuna was struck with Subhadra's beauty and decided he would obtain her as his wife. Subhadra and Arjuna's son was the tragic hero Abhimanyu. Abhimanyu himself married his first cross-cousin Sasirekha, the daughter of Subhadra's brother Balarama, meaning that first-cousin marriage occurred in the same family for two consecutive generations. Later, Abhimanyu and his other wife Uttara had a son, Parikshit, who eventually succeeded Yudhisthira as the emperor of the Pandava kingdom after Abhimanyu was killed at Kurukshetra.

    Hindu Marriage Act:
    =============
    In Hinduism marriage within the same gotra is prohibited, where a gotra is believed to be the group of descendants of a sage who lived in the remote past. Two persons in the same gotra cannot marry even if they come from different linguistic areas. However, same-gotra marriages have been legal under Indian civil law since the Hindu Marriage Act of 1955. Additionally, marriages within certain degrees of consanguinity are considered sapinda and banned in Hinduism. Hindu lawgivers differ in the definition of sapinda: at one extreme, according to some sources marriages are prohibited within seven generations on the father's side and five on the mother's side. In contrast, other sources allow cross cousins to marry, including first cross cousins. The Hindu Marriage Act bars marriage for five generations on the father's side and three on the mother's side, but allows cross-cousin marriage where it is permitted by custom.

    Genetic Impact:
    ==========
    Cousin marriage has genetic aspects that do not arise in the case of other marriage-related political and social issues like interracial marriage. This is because married couples possessing higher than normal consanguinity have, on average, an increased chance of sharing genes for recessive traits. Consanguinity means the amount of shared (identical) DNA, the genetic material. The percentage of consanguinity between any two individuals decreases fourfold as the most recent common ancestor recedes one generation. To cite some examples, first cousins have four times the consanguinity of second cousins, while first cousins once removed have half that of first cousins. Rare double first cousins have twice that of first cousins and are as related as half-siblings.

    Jat Customs:
    ========
    In order to avoid the second cousin marriages, we drafted the rule of marriages in community called lineage exclusion rule (called as gotra exclusion rule). Earlier it was strictly a lineage exclusion rule as we used to have closed paternal relations within the same gotra, closed maternal relations within the mother's and grandmother's gotra. It was drafted to avoid the second cousin marriages in the community.
    Over the times the community grew, so did the gotras. But more worryingly, we forgot about the core issue and associated it with shallow honour, as we grew treating girl as inferior in the society and girls' family as inferior to boys' family in marriage functions. This has lead us to current problem, where we don't know if the issue is genetic or honour issue.
    My suggestion as solution to the problem is following:
    a. Same gotra marriages should be discouraged, not because it affects the honour of the family, but it risks genetic disorder to the offspring of the couple. (we are already doing the same)
    b. If in case we get to know a potential same gotra marriage, rather than being hostile and repulsive, we should get the boy and girl (possibly with their family) counselled with doctors, only if they are first or second cousins. Our society needs to be honest towards the problem.
    c. For the same gotra couples (who have already married), get them counselled through doctors as well, if they happen to be first or second cousins
    .
    Dont forget these same gotra marriages are Love marriages mostly and love is blind. Love doesn't pay heed to any doctor, society etc

  9. #8
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    Significance of these Khaps was obvious in the past when law and order system was not that good and most of the social issues used to be settled at the village and Khap level. Even court used to substantiate their decsion at first hand.

    If we look at the contribution of Khap Panchayat's since last 50 years or so, they are not doing justice to their existance for which they used to be known in the past. For an educated youth, these khaps seems an orthodox structure where some people are forcing their thousand years old traditions on the mass, with or without reasons.

    These days, generally, the Khaps are mainly involved in declaring fatwas and are being used as vote banks by the politicians. Morever, the political penetration in almost every shpere of our lives making the scenario much worse than it should be. Power games are being played between the diferent Khaps as well as within the respective Khaps. The decision made by these Khaps are not universally accepted within the Khaps leave aside the mass acceptance. Influencive people in the Khaps try to impose their power on the less influencive people and people who felt being neglected or unheard goes to the court.

    These Khaps remains in the News only for the Honor Killings and FORCED brother sister relationships. Did they ever made any headline by putting up their efforts to eradicate any other social sickness prevailing in the area. End of the day these Khaps just criticize the Media for fabricating their so called false image. It is quite obvious for the Media to portrait them like this because these Khaps are not doing anything expect declaring Fatwas against the married couple ( rightly or wrongly .. that's another matter ). By supporting the Honor Killers these Khaps are confirming that media is not fabricating anything but the THINGS are for REAL.

    Same gotra marriage is not appreciated in any Jat Family. But then exceptions are everywhere. Every now and then, people break the laws and so the traditions. There are so many ways to punish such people but nobody have any right to KILL anyone. Neither do anybody can change someone's feelings for others. The Reverse Engineering of forcing them to behave as Brother Sister is more dangerous and may result in spoiling/disgusting the Brother Sister relationship in future.

    Youth always believe in the change or modification of the tradition with respect to the advancement of technology, urbanization, education, nucleus families and globalization. But these Khaps seems reluctant to change their views which are based upon the moral values of ancient times and most of that seems insignificant in today's world.

    In the present scenario of Globalization, these khaps need some modification in the thousand years old traditions and should amend the certain rules by inducing some flexibilities according the norms of present society to make them more significant and more acceptable to the mass.
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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  11. #9

    Bringing khaps to justice

    Look at article posted by Mr. D.R. Chaudhry that came in Tribune on April 11, 2010.

    Politicians’ fear of losing vote banks is misplaced as khaps have no following in villages, says D.R. Chaudhry

    KARNAL Additional Session Judge’s judgement giving death sentence to five persons, life imprisonment to one and seven years’ jail to another in a case of honour killing in Haryana’s Kaithal district will serve as a strong deterrent on the depredations of khap panchayats.

    Honour killing is the most grotesque and barbarous manifestation of gender discrimination in the male-dominated society. In such an ethos, woman is a commodity possessed by the male and the family’s honour is associated with her. If she deviates from social mores, she is supposed to bring dishonour to the family whose prestige is restored by killing her. If her male partner too meets a similar fate, it is only a collateral damage unavoidable in given circumstances as it happened with Manoj who married Babli, a girl of his own village, in the present case.

    The practice of honour killing is prevalent in a feudal set up with tribal hangover — Haryana, Delhi dehat, western Uttar Pradesh and Punjab and some areas in Rajasthan near Delhi and in Islamic countries. About 300 women are killed every year in Pakistan and the corresponding figure in Bangladesh is more than 200.

    Yemen, a small country, had about 400 cases of honour killing in 1997. According to one estimate, about 10 per cent of murders in Punjab and Haryana falls in the category of honour killing.

    The institution of khap panchayat, largely prevailing in areas around Delhi is the site where honour killing is executed to perpetuate gender discrimination in its most revolting form. It is a medieval institution when people were divided into clans. Its primary aim was to provide security to its members in an age marked by lawlessness and to settle disputes among its members.

    The khap panchayat is either gotra-centric or a territorial entity. The Sarv khap panchyat is a council of different khaps in a particular area held to deliberate on some important issue. The institution covered different caste groups in the past.

    Sorem in Mujaffar Nagar district of western UP, is supposed to be the headquarters of the Sarv khap panchayat since the medieval times when Haryana was a much larger entity. The records of the institution maintained by a family of this village and consulted by this writer while doing fieldwork on khap in this area, reveals that this institution encompassed different caste groups. In one of the panchayats at Shikarpur during Allaudin Khilji’s reign to oppose zazia — a tax imposed on Hindus — was attended by representatives of all castes — Jats, Gurjars, Rajputs, Raves, Sainis, Tagas, Brahmins, Banias, Dalits, etc. It maintained militia for defence in which women warriors too had their place. In another panchayat at Sorem in 1954, a Gurjar was unanimously elected as president, a Rajput as a vice-president and a Jat as its general secretary. Thus, there was no discrimination on grounds of caste or sex earlier in this institution.

    Khap today is a pale replica of its past, undemocratic in its structure and functioning. Women, who constitute about half the population, have no place in it. Such panchayats often issue edicts having vital impact on lives of women but they have no right to have their say. Similarly, weaker sections are kept out of its ambit. It has no electic principle. Its headship is either hereditary or some one is asked to preside over the meeting on the spot.

    It has emasculated the democratically elected panchayats in which women and weaker sections have due representation. It casts a larger than life shadow by issuing outlandish and barbaric fatwas like declaring a married couple as siblings, expelling families from their native habitats and ordering killing of couples.

    Khap panchayat today has become an exclusive preserve of the Jat community. Some elements in the landed Jat peasantry try to perpetuate their hegemony in rural hinterland by using khap as a cover. The task is facilitated by the patronage extended to them by political leaders who treat them as vote bank. This nexus explains the studied silence maintained by top political leaders in Haryana on khap atrocities irrespective of the party affiliation.

    The only exception is Samsher Singh Surjewala, a senior Congress leader, who has taken a forthright stand against khap. The CPM and its women wing have been consistently crusading against khaps. The fear of losing the vote bank is largely misplaced as the self-styled custodians of social mores in khaps no longer enjoy large following in villages.

    Bhaichara (brotherhood) has been the raison d’etre of khap. All the khap members are supposed to be blood relations. This led to several marital taboos like ban on the same-gotra marriage, same-village marriage and marriage in the immediate neighbourhood. Inter-gotra marriage is frowned upon even if the bride is from a distant place if some families of her gotra reside in her in-laws’ village as they treat her as a daughter.

    The concept of bhaichara is a myth now. Improved means of communications, transport, mass media and spread of modern education have exposed the rural youth to the outside world and have led many of them to reject the norms of tribal society. Intimacy between two sexes is quite common. So long as this relationship remains behind the scene, no body takes notice of it. When it results into marriage, this is taken as a threat to the hallowed tradition of khap and invites barbarous punishment.

    These norms should have undergone some relaxation in tune with the changing times but their rigid observance at present is the root cause of the problem.

    It is ignorance of the symbiotic relationship between tradition and modernity which has led to rigidity. Tradition untouched by modernity starts stinking and becomes a drag on society while modernity cut off from tradition is shallow and spurious. It is the harmonious blend of the two that takes society forward.

    The Balian khap comprising 84 villages in Mujaffar Nagar district in western UP has shown some relaxation. If there are two gotras of Jats in a particular village, say Balian and Rathi, Balians can bring a Rathi bride from a distant village in the same khap and vice versa. This is an anathema to Jats of Haryana in the khap belt and this gave rise to serious problems in several villages — Meham Kheri in Rohtak district, Samaspur in Bhiwani district, Dharana in Jhajjar district, to give the latest examples.

    A more disturbing dimension has been added to the phenomenon today. Some elements have an eye on the property of the family in dispute and manage order of its expulsion from the village to grab its land and house.

    The observance of all marital norms of a tribal society has become impractical in modern age.

    There are many villages in Haryana’s khap belt which have a plethora of Jat gotras — Samchana village has 15 gotras of Jats in it. Avoiding all these gotras in matrimonial alliance has become a nightmare. However, khap leaders cling to antiquity irrespective of the sea change in society.

    Relaxed norms in the Balian Khap have made it progressive in some ways. It has thrown up a powerful peasant movement under the leadership of Mahendra Singh Tikait. Marital disputes hardly find place in the records of this khap.

    As late as March 7, 2010, a Sarv khap panchayat at Shamli resolved to launch a campaign in villages to apply a curb on wasteful expenditure in marriages, community feast on the death of an elder, increasing use of liquor and other intoxicants by the youth, female foeticide, etc. Such a reformist exercise is unthinkable in Haryana’s khaps as the marital relationship is the only agenda they take up in all seriousness, perfunctory talk of other things notwithstanding.

    Haryana is projected as a progressive state and rightly so. However, there is an ugly flipside too. Sex ratio in Haryana (861) is the worst along with Punjab. Even the sub-Saharan countries of Africa have a better record. To meet this deficit, girls are bought from distant places and sold in Haryana like chattel. While inter-caste and inter-religious marriage is not permissible in the khap belt — and often it leads to bloodshed — no body is bothered about the caste or religion of these hapless girls, who in some cases, are resold after the satiation of the lust of the first buyer.

    Charles Darwin made an important discovery in his theory of Evolution of Species. Those species which were rigid and did not adapt themselves to changing times and were devoid of helpful attitude towards each other became extinct while their counterparts who were flexible and caring and compassionate towards each other — ‘compassion’ is the word used by Darwin — flourished. (How far compassionate are the khap stormtroopers is for readers to decide).

    Similar is the fate of the hardbound khap elements. They are physically present but phenomenologically extinct. They are the deadwood who act as bottleneck for the flowering of the great potential the Jat community, especially its youth, has. The sooner the community gets rid of them, the better it is.

  12. #10
    I remember Navin Gulia wrote in one post that "The only constant thing in the universe is change"
    Hum jitna jaldi isko samjh le achha hai ...
    I dont support any of the parties but still change is required very much.
    Jo samay ke saath nahi chala woh nast ho gaya ...
    How many such traditions we had which needed a change and were changed either by consent or forcefully ... Sati pratha, bal vivah, now caste system also etc etc ...

    I heard, Jats used to avoid Nanni's ( maternal Grandma) also but now most of them do not. They have made this amendment in the rule. Similarly, change is required everywhere.

    Again I say I do not advocate any of the parties but my general suggestion to jats is to avoid being so rigid and stubborn and accept the change else 'Change' will forcefully make u accept it

    Jai Jat Jai Gadhe ki poonch .... Jaiiii ho

  13. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by MayankKp View Post
    Look at article posted by Mr. D.R. Chaudhry that came in Tribune on April 11, 2010.

    Politicians’ fear of losing vote banks is misplaced as khaps have no following in villages, says D.R. Chaudhry

    KARNAL Additional Session Judge’s judgement giving death sentence to five persons, life imprisonment to one and seven years’ jail to another in a case of honour killing in Haryana’s Kaithal district will serve as a strong deterrent on the depredations of khap panchayats.

    Honour killing is the most grotesque and barbarous manifestation of gender discrimination in the male-dominated society. In such an ethos, woman is a commodity possessed by the male and the family’s honour is associated with her. If she deviates from social mores, she is supposed to bring dishonour to the family whose prestige is restored by killing her. If her male partner too meets a similar fate, it is only a collateral damage unavoidable in given circumstances as it happened with Manoj who married Babli, a girl of his own village, in the present case.

    The practice of honour killing is prevalent in a feudal set up with tribal hangover — Haryana, Delhi dehat, western Uttar Pradesh and Punjab and some areas in Rajasthan near Delhi and in Islamic countries. About 300 women are killed every year in Pakistan and the corresponding figure in Bangladesh is more than 200.

    Yemen, a small country, had about 400 cases of honour killing in 1997. According to one estimate, about 10 per cent of murders in Punjab and Haryana falls in the category of honour killing.

    The institution of khap panchayat, largely prevailing in areas around Delhi is the site where honour killing is executed to perpetuate gender discrimination in its most revolting form. It is a medieval institution when people were divided into clans. Its primary aim was to provide security to its members in an age marked by lawlessness and to settle disputes among its members.

    The khap panchayat is either gotra-centric or a territorial entity. The Sarv khap panchyat is a council of different khaps in a particular area held to deliberate on some important issue. The institution covered different caste groups in the past.

    Sorem in Mujaffar Nagar district of western UP, is supposed to be the headquarters of the Sarv khap panchayat since the medieval times when Haryana was a much larger entity. The records of the institution maintained by a family of this village and consulted by this writer while doing fieldwork on khap in this area, reveals that this institution encompassed different caste groups. In one of the panchayats at Shikarpur during Allaudin Khilji’s reign to oppose zazia — a tax imposed on Hindus — was attended by representatives of all castes — Jats, Gurjars, Rajputs, Raves, Sainis, Tagas, Brahmins, Banias, Dalits, etc. It maintained militia for defence in which women warriors too had their place. In another panchayat at Sorem in 1954, a Gurjar was unanimously elected as president, a Rajput as a vice-president and a Jat as its general secretary. Thus, there was no discrimination on grounds of caste or sex earlier in this institution.

    Khap today is a pale replica of its past, undemocratic in its structure and functioning. Women, who constitute about half the population, have no place in it. Such panchayats often issue edicts having vital impact on lives of women but they have no right to have their say. Similarly, weaker sections are kept out of its ambit. It has no electic principle. Its headship is either hereditary or some one is asked to preside over the meeting on the spot.

    It has emasculated the democratically elected panchayats in which women and weaker sections have due representation. It casts a larger than life shadow by issuing outlandish and barbaric fatwas like declaring a married couple as siblings, expelling families from their native habitats and ordering killing of couples.

    Khap panchayat today has become an exclusive preserve of the Jat community. Some elements in the landed Jat peasantry try to perpetuate their hegemony in rural hinterland by using khap as a cover. The task is facilitated by the patronage extended to them by political leaders who treat them as vote bank. This nexus explains the studied silence maintained by top political leaders in Haryana on khap atrocities irrespective of the party affiliation.

    The only exception is Samsher Singh Surjewala, a senior Congress leader, who has taken a forthright stand against khap. The CPM and its women wing have been consistently crusading against khaps. The fear of losing the vote bank is largely misplaced as the self-styled custodians of social mores in khaps no longer enjoy large following in villages.

    Bhaichara (brotherhood) has been the raison d’etre of khap. All the khap members are supposed to be blood relations. This led to several marital taboos like ban on the same-gotra marriage, same-village marriage and marriage in the immediate neighbourhood. Inter-gotra marriage is frowned upon even if the bride is from a distant place if some families of her gotra reside in her in-laws’ village as they treat her as a daughter.

    The concept of bhaichara is a myth now. Improved means of communications, transport, mass media and spread of modern education have exposed the rural youth to the outside world and have led many of them to reject the norms of tribal society. Intimacy between two sexes is quite common. So long as this relationship remains behind the scene, no body takes notice of it. When it results into marriage, this is taken as a threat to the hallowed tradition of khap and invites barbarous punishment.

    These norms should have undergone some relaxation in tune with the changing times but their rigid observance at present is the root cause of the problem.

    It is ignorance of the symbiotic relationship between tradition and modernity which has led to rigidity. Tradition untouched by modernity starts stinking and becomes a drag on society while modernity cut off from tradition is shallow and spurious. It is the harmonious blend of the two that takes society forward.

    The Balian khap comprising 84 villages in Mujaffar Nagar district in western UP has shown some relaxation. If there are two gotras of Jats in a particular village, say Balian and Rathi, Balians can bring a Rathi bride from a distant village in the same khap and vice versa. This is an anathema to Jats of Haryana in the khap belt and this gave rise to serious problems in several villages — Meham Kheri in Rohtak district, Samaspur in Bhiwani district, Dharana in Jhajjar district, to give the latest examples.

    A more disturbing dimension has been added to the phenomenon today. Some elements have an eye on the property of the family in dispute and manage order of its expulsion from the village to grab its land and house.

    The observance of all marital norms of a tribal society has become impractical in modern age.

    There are many villages in Haryana’s khap belt which have a plethora of Jat gotras — Samchana village has 15 gotras of Jats in it. Avoiding all these gotras in matrimonial alliance has become a nightmare. However, khap leaders cling to antiquity irrespective of the sea change in society.

    Relaxed norms in the Balian Khap have made it progressive in some ways. It has thrown up a powerful peasant movement under the leadership of Mahendra Singh Tikait. Marital disputes hardly find place in the records of this khap.

    As late as March 7, 2010, a Sarv khap panchayat at Shamli resolved to launch a campaign in villages to apply a curb on wasteful expenditure in marriages, community feast on the death of an elder, increasing use of liquor and other intoxicants by the youth, female foeticide, etc. Such a reformist exercise is unthinkable in Haryana’s khaps as the marital relationship is the only agenda they take up in all seriousness, perfunctory talk of other things notwithstanding.

    Haryana is projected as a progressive state and rightly so. However, there is an ugly flipside too. Sex ratio in Haryana (861) is the worst along with Punjab. Even the sub-Saharan countries of Africa have a better record. To meet this deficit, girls are bought from distant places and sold in Haryana like chattel. While inter-caste and inter-religious marriage is not permissible in the khap belt — and often it leads to bloodshed — no body is bothered about the caste or religion of these hapless girls, who in some cases, are resold after the satiation of the lust of the first buyer.

    Charles Darwin made an important discovery in his theory of Evolution of Species. Those species which were rigid and did not adapt themselves to changing times and were devoid of helpful attitude towards each other became extinct while their counterparts who were flexible and caring and compassionate towards each other — ‘compassion’ is the word used by Darwin — flourished. (How far compassionate are the khap stormtroopers is for readers to decide).

    Similar is the fate of the hardbound khap elements. They are physically present but phenomenologically extinct. They are the deadwood who act as bottleneck for the flowering of the great potential the Jat community, especially its youth, has. The sooner the community gets rid of them, the better it is.
    One more neo-liberal whinny mouth but ask him the reason beneath the lampooned article. I just do wonder that author has himself got married in the same village and questioning the bhai-chaara.
    "All I am trying to do is bridge the gap between Jats and Rest of World"

    As I shall imagine, so shall I become.

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  15. #12
    मै एक छोटे से गाँव में पैदा हुआ वहां मै नौ साल की उम्र तक रहा फिर बाहर पढने चला गया पर मेरा परिवार वहीँ रहा और में छुट्टियों में आता जाता रहा ! मेरा लगाव गाँव के साथ ही रहा दोस्त मुझे शहरो में ही मिले मेरा एक अलग सर्कल बन गया ! मैंने अपने परिवार को भी शहर में ही रख लिया और गाँव में आना जाना कम हो गया !अब में दो तीन महीने में एक बार गाँव जाता हूँ एक या दो दिन के लिए पर गाँव जाने के बाद मेरा वापस आने से मन आज भी कटता है मन आज भी नहर में कूदने का करता है ! आज भी मै जोहड़ में नहाना चाहता हूँ , पींघ पे झूलना चाहता हूँ , खेत में लस्सी गुड और आचार के साथ आम के नीचे रोटी खाना चाहता हूँ ! पिछली बार होली पे घर गया था कोर्डो के निशान मिटने में १५ दिन लगे और जब तक वो दिखे मन अपने आप खुश हो जाता था बहुत साल बाद होली खेली थी ! नीम की चाय में चारपाई दल के सोने में ए सी से ज्यादा मज़ा आता है ! मेरे समझ नहीं आता की ये क्यों है जब मेरा गाँव में सिर्फ एक दो दोस्त ही हैं मेरा सर्कल यहीं है फिर वहां ख़ुशी क्यों मिलती है ?
    मै जाटलैंड पर आया और ये देखा "अरे यु तो मेरा गाम ए बटला हो रहया है कत्ती घी सा घल गया" चौपाल में कति वोहे देशी नजारा था वोहे सींग फस रहे थे लोग के खामखा की बात पे ! एक माचना सा शहरी बालक आया और कुछ महारथी उसके पाछे कसुती ढाला पड़ गए और उस ताहि गोसे खुवा के माने! मै कई दिन तक जाटलैंड के पन्ने पढता रहा लोग का लिखा होया देखा वोहे सब तो था जो मेरे गाम में होवे है कई इसी बात भी पढ़ी जो मन्ने भी नहीं बेरा थी कुछ इसी लिखी जो किसे ने नहीं लिखी थी अलगोजा सुनके गाम में फेरी आले याद आ गए अर कत्ती कंप्यूटर के आगे बैठा बैठा गाम की गाल में पहुँच गया ! वो सब जो मेरा खू गया था वो मन्ने उल्टा मिल गया बिना चेहरों वाले दोस्त बने कुछ के साथ कहासुनी भी होई कति सारा कुछ तो वोहे था जो म्हारा समाज था ! अल्बदी बालक भी आड़े थे अर समझदार और शांत बुजुर्ग भी लोग आते चले गए और इस मंच को छोड़ कर जाने वालो की गिनती भी कम नहीं थी ! मेरा आधा कॉलेज भी आड़े पा गया पहलाम जो टेम याहू पे ख़राब करा करता वो बंद हो गया ! समय के साथ कुछ चीजो से दो चार में भी हुआ आज लगभग चार साल हो गए उन बातो को और कुछ समझदार और शांत बुजुर्ग गायब से हो गए नए नए बालक आ गए जिनमे ज्यादातर गाँव के समाज को जानते भी नहीं !
    मै जिस गाँव को यहाँ ढून्ढ रहा था उसका शेहरीकरण हो गया और नए विचारधारा वाले लोगो का बोलबाला हो गया ! मै बहुत छोटा था तब से एक बात जानी की मै जाट हूँ और मेरे अन्दर दुसरे लोगो से ज्यादा ताकत और हिम्मत है मेरी बोली में शेर की दहाड़ है और मुझमे मुस्किलो से झूझने की क्षमता आम लोगो से ज्यादा है ! कई बार देखा की सिर्फ बोलते ही रास्ता साफ़ हो जाता है जहाँ मजदूर किसी की नहीं सुनते थे वो सिर्फ बोली सुनते ही काम करने लग जाते हैं ! कुछ अच्छी जगहों पर बैठे इंसानों से बात करने का मौका मिला और कुछ देर के बाद उनका ये सवाल की क्या आप जाट हो छाती चौड़ी करने के लिए काफी है ! एक अनजान आदमी से खड़े खड़े रिश्ता बनने में कुछ ही पल लगे सिर्फ एक बात पर की में भी जाट हूँ ! मार्केटिंग की जो काल सुनते ही दीमाग ख़राब हो जाता है उनसे १० १० मिनट बात हो जाती हैं सिर्फ इस लिए की वो भी जाट है !
    ये जाट कौन है? क्या ये मैंने बनाया या सिर्फ मै ही जाट हूँ ?ऐसा मैंने क्या किया जिसके कारण लोगो में एक अलग सी भावना आ जाती है (चाहे वो दर या दबाव की है चाहे वो इज्ज़त की या फिर एक अपनेपन की ) ?मै उस भावना का कारण समझ नहीं पा रहा हूँ पर ऐसा मै सोचता हूँ की वो भावना मेरे उन बुजुर्गो के कारण है जिनका सवभाव निश्चल और सीधा था जो सही को सही और गलत को गलत कहने में भगवान के आगे भी नहीं हिचकेंगे ! उनके नियम और उसूल जान से ज्यादा मायने नहीं रखते ! इज्ज़त के लिए जिन्होंने जान लेने और देने में कोई समय नहीं लगाया !आज उन बुजुर्गो को एक नया ही नाम मिल गया खंडवाधारी! मेरे पिताजी १९८० में जींस टी शर्ट पहनते थे जब यहाँ आने वालो में से ५०% भी पैदा नहीं हुए होंगे !और २००० में उन्होंने वो छोड़ कर खंडवा धारण कर लिया बिजली बोर्ड में बास्केटबाल टीम में खेलने वाले ने इस खंडवे में के देखा ? क्या ये खंडवाधारी किसी संस्था का हिस्सा हैं? क्या इनको सरकार से कोई पैसा मिलता है फैंसले सुनाने के लिए ? आज आड़े बात होवे हैं की उन लोगो के लिए ये लोग चंदा इक्कठा कर रहे हैं क्यों नहीं ये पैसा कोए एक आदमी दे देता ? इसका सिर्फ एक ही जवाब है की ये जापानी सिस्टम (वन पॉइंट lesson ) जैसा है १० रुपये में किसी का कुछ नहीं जायेगा पर एक बात जो सबको समझनी चाहिए वो बात हर कान तक पहुंचेगी ! पंचायत या खंडवा किसे की जागीर नहीं ना इसपे किसे पिस्से आले का जोर है की वो इसे जब चाहे अपने फायदे के लिए इस्तेमाल कर ले ! ये सिर्फ उन आदमियों का समूह है जो सिर्फ अपने समाज अपनी पहचान और अपने नियमो को जिंदा रखना चाहते हैं जो नहीं चाहते की विकसित देशो की तरह यहाँ भी वो सब होने लगे जो हमारे यहाँ परदे में होता है ! कुछ चीजे परदे में ही अच्छी रहती हैं और जब वो परदे से बाहर आयें तो सिवा इज्जत के कुछ नहीं जाता ! मैंने एक ये बात भी सीखी थी कि मेरे गाँव की(चाहे किसी भी जाती या गोत्र की हो )हर लड़की मेरी बहन है , मेरे गोत्र की हर लड़की मेरी बहन है मेरी माँ के गोत्र की हर लड़की मेरी बहन है और मेरी दादी के गोत्र कि हर लड़की मेरी बहन है वो हर लड़की जिसके दादी और माँ के भी गोत्र कहीं मिलते हैं वो लड़की मेरी बहन होगी ! मै आज यही सिक्षा अपनी संतान को देना चाहता हूँ जोकि आज एक साल का ही है पर आज जाटलैंड पर आये इस मानसिकता के बदलाव को देखते हुए डर सा लगने लगा की आज ये हाल है आज के बीस साल बाद क्या मेरे बच्चे की मानसिकता भी ऐसी ही होगी ? क्या वो कल किसी मेरे ही गोत्र वाली लड़की से शादी कर लेगा ? मै आज ये बात सोच कर डर रहा हूँ की मेरा(जाट का ) आने वाला समाज कैसा होगा ? क्या ये वही समाज होगा जिसे ढूँढता हुआ इस वेबसाइट पर आया था ?
    Dream is not what you see while sleeping. Dream is that which won't let you sleep

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to rakeshsehrawat For This Useful Post:

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  17. #13
    What about you? Mujhe to lagta hai ki tum hi doodh ke jale huey ho, kahin najdiki mei to kisi ne aisa kaam nahi kar diya? Agar kuch points nahi hai kisi ke arguments ko disprove karne ke liye to bakwaas likhne ki kya jaroorat hai?

    Quote Originally Posted by Samarkadian View Post
    One more neo-liberal whinny mouth but ask him the reason beneath the lampooned article. I just do wonder that author has himself got married in the same village and questioning the bhai-chaara.

  18. #14
    I dont understand why you are commenting sense less instead of making some points against what is written in article by DR Chaudhary. Unlike you he has taken some pain to research and then write an article. If you dont have something to counter his arguments then stay silent. Kisi par keechad uchalne se kuch nahi hoga ulta tere upar hi girega.

    Quote Originally Posted by Samarkadian View Post
    One more neo-liberal whinny mouth but ask him the reason beneath the lampooned article. I just do wonder that author has himself got married in the same village and questioning the bhai-chaara.

  19. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by vijay123 View Post
    I dont understand why you are commenting sense less instead of making some points against what is written in article by DR Chaudhary. Unlike you he has taken some pain to research and then write an article. If you dont have something to counter his arguments then stay silent. Kisi par keechad uchalne se kuch nahi hoga ulta tere upar hi girega.
    Good, I dnt mind Kichaad show unless it is from a biased mind. As far as his article is concerned, he has been lampoonising this issue since long. You may search it over net. Generally one need some reason to write against centuaries old practised and biologically applauded system and Mr Chaudhary has that reason. He belongs to Sirsa reason of Haryana. More precisely the village Chautala. I didnt say anything untrue. That side people get married in the same village and so does Mr Chaudhary. That part don't follow this Gotra Bhaichara with in a village. Why this tradition gives him pain if it is not practised in that part of state? Why he feels insecure about it? Why does he care so much when he has never been associated with it.? Same applies to Mr Chaudhary, has he researched the core issues/processes of Bhai-chara prevailing in other area.? Has he taken pain to understand the success of ''Bhai-chara'' in this region.? Has he any thesis in Social-Anthropology about the Bhai-chara of gotras? No issues if he doesn't have. I just find him insecure and may be jealous. Socially, he doesnt provide pragmatic solution except penning down what he dreams and you know dreaming is dreaming.

    As far as the jala hua dudh on my part, my dear friend, let me assure that, had it been the scene with in my family I would have not thought for a second to repeat what you and your kind of minds finds immoral/amoral act of honour killing. I dislike the political correctness of ''We Do Not Support the Same Gotra Marriage but We Dislike Killing as Solution''. Absolutely at base level people don't seek solutions in such matters they just want to amputate the infected part. When you come to stark reality of villages and their belief in it , you would understand that not a single person[including 100%females] have sympathy for incest couples. Why does it pain so much to your and your kind overly liberal mind ; to atleast accept that crores of people believe in turning immoral/amoral to save their honour which get tainted 101% by such acts.

    Further, if you dislike reading what I wrote for him and you, I hardly care what you think or don't think.
    "All I am trying to do is bridge the gap between Jats and Rest of World"

    As I shall imagine, so shall I become.

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  21. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Samarkadian View Post
    One more neo-liberal whinny mouth but ask him the reason beneath the lampooned article. I just do wonder that author has himself got married in the same village and questioning the bhai-chaara.
    DR Chaudhary is one of the most progressive and reputed writers of Haryana and I do not find anything illogical or offensive which might warrant such uncouth remarks. If you do not agree with his arguments come with your counter-points in a decent manner. Majority of educated youths with progressive attitude (including on this portal) disapprove the autocratic, feudal, self-styled and outdated Khap leaders who simply use their respective clans as a means to pursue their political carriers and tend to brow-beat the clans which are in minority. Mr Chaudhary has rightly observed, these khaps try to emasculate the democratically elected Panchayats to perpetuate the feudal system where there is no place for individual freedom and civil liberties. You can not expect the reply of your choice form everyone.

  22. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samarkadian View Post
    Good, I dnt mind Kichaad show unless it is from a biased mind. As far as his article is concerned, he has been lampoonising this issue since long. You may search it over net. Generally one need some reason to write against centuaries old practised and biologically applauded system and Mr Chaudhary has that reason. He belongs to Sirsa reason of Haryana. More precisely the village Chautala. I didnt say anything untrue. That side people get married in the same village and so does Mr Chaudhary. That part don't follow this Gotra Bhaichara with in a village. Why this tradition gives him pain if it is not practised in that part of state? Why he feels insecure about it? Why does he care so much when he has never been associated with it.? Same applies to Mr Chaudhary, has he researched the core issues/processes of Bhai-chara prevailing in other area.? Has he taken pain to understand the success of ''Bhai-chara'' in this region.? Has he any thesis in Social-Anthropology about the Bhai-chara of gotras? No issues if he doesn't have. I just find him insecure and may be jealous. Socially, he doesnt provide pragmatic solution except penning down what he dreams and you know dreaming is dreaming.

    Is it his fault that he born in Sirsa and more precisely Chautala ? Is this your point of arguments ? What you want to talk about ? If he don't have any right to lamploosening ( according to you ) then what right do you have to claim some rubbish about the people of specific region.

    Is it really necessory to follow just your style of Bhaichara to be a Jat or Jats do have their own traditions and value system ?

    Let me tell you ceratin things before start blabbering some other rubbish things about the region. Jat people in this area avoid at least three gotra with all their will and happiness. Nobody marries in the same villege. Not only his own villege but people avoid their Mother's and Grandmother's villege. These traditions are practiced by Jat people without any fear of any Barberian bodies. because there are no such Barberian Bodies to impose stupid decisions. There are no INCEST relationships ( marriage ) unlike the REGION where people shout about bhaichara at their rooftop but so vulnerable to nasty relationships even after barberian hunting adventures.

    Moreover, if some odd case of such type happens, the families of those subjects decide their punishment as par their mindset. There are no Khaps and no so called 'Khamkhas' people who just jumps into it to make a state level issue and to provide some spicy feed to media. There are no such people who tries to gather people from many states to have a bash at the victims. They don't call it a National Emergency. They don't raise this issue as a question mark for Jat existance. They don't try to get political mileage from the mishappenings of someone's family. They tries to help the parents to come out from their bad time. This is really disguting when two families are facing some problems and these so called WISE people gathers here and there and everywhere to get political mileage from it.

    These Khaps are appreciating honor killing but the number of such cases are increasing inspite of all the killings. Is it not a ringing bell for you to decide some alternate solutions as killing is not helping to solve this problem.

    If you are talking about traditions, then there is need for you to know and understand that traditons can never be imposed but traditions are those which are followed by the community by their own will and happiness.

    I think you should clear up your mind before posting and give it a thought before posting. Because one day you start talking about community and next day you just say 'I don't care'. If you are talking just for yourself then feel free to post or do anything you want but if you are talking about Jat community then first of all come out from your attitude of 'I don't care'.

    After all, community is all about 'How much I care' instead of 'I don't care'.
    It's better to be alone than in a bad company.

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  24. #18

    Exclamation Warning!

    Guys, let me jump in and say that this is the editorial section. We don't want you to be making fancy fonts etc. Only serious discussions and limited use of smilies, colors etc. If you have something to say, you can say it without these extravagances. We will not be posting anyone's post who is in violation to this policy.
    There is a place in Delhi named "Rani Bagh". I say its irony at it's fullest!

  25. #19
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    Can you give few examples in this regard, Each Goaat has one khap, so there got be plenty of khap politicians, please name few. How many are MLAs and MPs ?

    Quote Originally Posted by vpsingh View Post
    DR Chaudhary is one of the most progressive and reputed writers of Haryana and I do not find anything illogical or offensive which might warrant such uncouth remarks. If you do not agree with his arguments come with your counter-points in a decent manner. Majority of educated youths with progressive attitude (including on this portal) disapprove the autocratic, feudal, self-styled and outdated Khap leaders who simply use their respective clans as a means to pursue their political carriers and tend to brow-beat the clans which are in minority. Mr Chaudhary has rightly observed, these khaps try to emasculate the democratically elected Panchayats to perpetuate the feudal system where there is no place for individual freedom and civil liberties. You can not expect the reply of your choice form everyone.
    "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent..."

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  27. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by rsdalal View Post
    Can you give few examples in this regard, Each Goaat has one khap, so there got be plenty of khap politicians, please name few. How many are MLAs and MPs ?
    Those who can not make it to Assembly or Parliament, try to acquire some nuisance value for their personal aggrandizement. They could not become MP and MLA because that would have needed sufficient support from other communities as well which make sizeable chunk of electorate in any given constituency. Also they are usually not able to muster adequate support/votes from the "neo-liberals" (in Samar's parlance). Another important factor is that the more shrewd politicians in power, usually foil the designs of Clan leaders to become MLA/MP riding on the crest of their popularity, whatsoever among Khaps, by gerrymandering the constituencies where these clan leaders have pocket boroughs/vote bank. But by remaining associated with certain pressure groups/clans(khaps) of the society they are able to demonstrate their political clout and acquire some political significance in the eyes of the local leaders viz. MP/MLA/Ministers. By virtue of their influence in some particular clan they acquire a good bargaining power and can achieve some of their personal goals, to cite an example - employment for the relatives etc. It is, however, neither advisable nor necessary for me to single out any particular community leader to substantiate my point. Several other young and bright members have written a lot about this. In your spare time you may devote some of your energies to go through all those posts. I remember, someone has submitted a thesis also on this subject as quoted by a Jat journalist while writing about the honour killings recently ( mentioned by Shri Samar Singh Kadiyan in one of his post). That was worth reading.
    Last edited by singhvp; April 21st, 2010 at 09:13 AM.

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