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Thread: Central Asian Origin or Jats and Gurjars. Gotras Khar/Khari

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    This also means that not all the people of "Magi" tribe of "Medes" were into religion preaching only some. This might explain as to Why we have some common similar family names with some priest people. The ancestors of some of these "Magi" people took to preaching religion to earn their livelihood and thereby have a common family names with Jats. This can also mean that not all the priest people trace their ancestry to these tribes. As Hinduism has its root in India, it is probable that most of the priest people are from indigenous stock leaving aside those who came from outside from other faiths and started preaching the local religion.
    bro kindly
    share your views on mitanni kindom also.from where they came and what happend to them aftere aussrins attack thanks
    Last edited by agodara; June 16th, 2014 at 12:04 AM.

  2. #62
    The "Medes" were the breeders of the first Nisean horses.
    Last edited by maddhan1979; June 16th, 2014 at 07:18 AM.

  3. #63
    If the points, i have stated in this thread are wrong kindly add the correct version to the stated fact, without argument. I would also like other people to add more matter to this thread, related to their clan, tribe, identity or other tribal identities that they are able to find.

  4. #64
    Scythian art from Siberia indicates that Akhal-Teke horses may have been in development at this time, although the depicted heads were not as fine as they are now.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akhal-Teke

    This might explain why "Jats and other northwestern tribes" have common family names with Turkish origin people.
    Last edited by maddhan1979; June 16th, 2014 at 07:28 AM.

  5. #65

  6. #66
    Interesting:

    Exiled tribes of Israel got place to live in Media.

    Researches into the Physical History of Mankind, gives evidence of a different origin. He quotes a language expert named Von Hammer and states, "...there were two distinct dialects in Persia from remote times, the eastern or Deri, and the Western or Pelvi. The Deri was spoken beyond the Oxus [in Central Asia]...The Pelvi was in use in Media proper, in the towns of Rei [Rages], Hamadan or Ecbatana, Isfahan, Nehawend, and at Tabriz, the capital of Aderbeijan [area northeast of Habor where Israelites were also exiled]." (i:15) Pritchard then indicates that the modern Anglo-Saxon languages of Europe show affinity to the Pelvi language used in areas of Media where the exiled Israelites dwelled; Pelvi "having acquired all the characteristics of modern languages." (i:34)


    http://www.hope-of-israel.org/citymedes.html



    Last edited by maddhan1979; June 16th, 2014 at 09:06 PM.

  7. #67
    Humans have come out of wild. There have been various phases starting from Hunters/food gatherers to organized Agriculturist. As all human activities heavily depended in nature, humans would create totems to recognize themselves. Besides that they heavily depended on animals to assist them to carry out their daily livelihood for this they domesticated or connected with different animals to carry out their daily activities often these animals formed totem for them to be recognized.

    The very first humans were living in wild areas and were into pure hunting and food gathering from the wild.

    So the progression goes something like this:

    1. The very first Humans were into hunting and food gathering from wild: It has been proved in history that the first animal that humans domesticated was wolf. Humans who hunted with wolves or the very pure humans who were living in wild and depended on nature for food inform of hunting and food gathering recognized themselves with wolves and used the totem "wolf", as their recognition symbol, identity and totem. These were also the people of pure human instincts and origins.

    2. The next progression of humans was in the form of animal domestication: The animals to be domesticated were sheep's, goats, so groups of people who moved out of "Hunting and food gathering", started rearing small animals. Sheep and goats were the main group of small animals that these people kept, this can be seen from the proliferation and extent of their spread. Where ever u look in ancient history or even in present day history, u find the concept of shepherds, which extends from the plains of central Asia to middle east and everywhere else. Such people recognized themselves with totem of sheep's, goats and other small animals, as their lives depended on such animals. As these animals were easy to domesticate and handle in human physical terms, they were the first to be domesticated. As sheeps and goats and grazed over a vast area of land, often these sheep and goat grazing people will move the livestock in the middle of the night , they also used stars and moon for this navigation and these "Shepherds" were the root of "Moon and Star" totem, as moon and stars played an important role in their migration to newer grazing areas. This "Shephard root" carried on to "cattle rearing people", who in their memory started using "moon" as their totem as well. These shephard people will carry their rituals based on the location in space, size, shape of moon or stars. This can be seen from both Islam and Christianity. In Christianity we have "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_of_Bethlehem" and we know that Islam also follows the shape of "Moon" for the religious ceremonies. Some, quality of sheep and goats made them successful for domestication by humans was their ability to graze in any kind of land from desert to lush green areas and their ability to breed prolifically. As in old times it was not possible to keep the wild predators away from the livestock, so humans depended on animals which breeded fast and provided them food at a fast pace.If we look at middle east there is always a talk of "Shepherds" from the very start of central Asian plains nomadic lifestyle to birth of Christ and beyond. There is rarelyany mention of cows, people rearing cows and cattle herding.

    3. The next progression of humans was in the form of domestication of bigger animals such as cows and other cattle. Some groups of people moved from domestication of sheep's, goats to cattle rearing. These people come late in history and their totem were cows and other cattle.

    4. The next domestication was that of horses, which happened on the Eurasian plains.

    5. In the last came the agriculture, domestication and use of Oxen and other heavy animals.

    It is probable that all these events happened on Eurasian plains which were also the cradle to IndoEuropean languages.


    http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/...57&gtrack=pthc

    So, the cow/cattle rearing and agriculture came very late in history and connects with "Fertile Crescent".

    Domestication of Horses happened on central Asian plains, so the concept of "Han" might have started from the use and domestication of horses. This also relates with people and their movements, tribes which carried on the life of "Nomadic Shephards" lived on central Asian plains as their ancestors did and the tribes which used moved in middle east started rearing cattle and doing agriculture in later stages of history. This can be seen from the fact that the tribe "Mede" was still into "Shepherding" but moved to "North Western Iran in very late history". All the above stated facts have been archaeologically proven.
    Last edited by maddhan1979; June 17th, 2014 at 08:34 PM.

  8. #68

  9. #69
    The religious beliefs of the Scythians was a type of Pre-Zoroastrian Iranian religion and differed from the post-Zoroastrian Iranian thoughts. Foremost in the Scythian pantheon stood Tabiti, who was later replaced by Atar, the fire-pantheon of Iranian tribes, and Agni, the fire deity of Indo-Aryans. The Scythian belief was a more archaic stage than the Zoroastrian and Hindu systems. The use of cannabis to induce trance and divination by soothsayers was a characteristic of the Scythian belief system.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    The religious beliefs of the Scythians was a type of Pre-Zoroastrian Iranian religion and differed from the post-Zoroastrian Iranian thoughts. Foremost in the Scythian pantheon stood Tabiti, who was later replaced by Atar, the fire-pantheon of Iranian tribes, and Agni, the fire deity of Indo-Aryans. The Scythian belief was a more archaic stage than the Zoroastrian and Hindu systems. The use of cannabis to induce trance and divination by soothsayers was a characteristic of the Scythian belief system.
    did sythians had any laguage in written forms.just curious toknow

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by agodara View Post
    did sythians had any laguage in written forms.just curious toknow
    do some reading yourself and add on this thread what u learn.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    The religious beliefs of the Scythians was a type of Pre-Zoroastrian Iranian religion and differed from the post-Zoroastrian Iranian thoughts. Foremost in the Scythian pantheon stood Tabiti, who was later replaced by Atar, the fire-pantheon of Iranian tribes, and Agni, the fire deity of Indo-Aryans. The Scythian belief was a more archaic stage than the Zoroastrian and Hindu systems. The use of cannabis to induce trance and divination by soothsayers was a characteristic of the Scythian belief system.

    It is interesting to see, how religious communities or the people so called preachers of local Indian religion, quickly adopted/absorbed the original concepts of these migrating tribes for the use of local religion. In one sense this was finishing the original identities of these migrating tribes.
    Last edited by maddhan1979; June 19th, 2014 at 03:08 PM.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    It is interesting to see, how religious communities or the people the preachers of local Indian religion, quickly adopted/absorbed the original concepts of these migrating tribes for the use of local religion. In one sense this was finishing the original identities of these migrating tribes.
    We must remember that there was no fixed preacher community for Scythian people, only some individuals performing soothsaying, etc. This was one of the reason, as to why Scythians never got trapped in the religious crap.

  14. #74

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    It is interesting to see, how religious communities or the people the preachers of local Indian religion, quickly adopted/absorbed the original concepts of these migrating tribes for the use of local religion. In one sense this was finishing the original identities of these migrating tribes.
    Friend,

    What is the timeline of the incident/event alluded to in this post.

    Thanks and regards
    History is best when created, better when re-constructed and worst when invented.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    We must remember that there was no fixed preacher community for Scythian people, only some individuals performing soothsaying, etc. This was one of the reason, as to why Scythians never got trapped in the religious crap.
    Friend,


    For example you say in a post that the identity of the invading hordes was lost because the locals adopted their religious beliefs. Then you also add that Scythians never got trapped in the religious crap !

    Kindly elaborate further what do you want to conclude in this post.

    Moreover, we would be interested to know the start of migration and immigration from one place to other right from the beginning. Without mentioning the time line of the migration of these Central Asian Tribes at different points of times --wave after wave -- in various direction, the discussion remains vague and incomprehensible for readers.

    Thanks and regards,
    History is best when created, better when re-constructed and worst when invented.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by maddhan1979 View Post
    do some reading yourself and add on this thread what u learn.
    http://www.allempires.com/forum/foru....asp?TID=17151

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to agodara For This Useful Post:

    maddhan1979 (June 20th, 2014)

  19. #78
    One interesting point is migration and emergence of languages. It seems, that migration to this part of the world (Indian subcontinent) was happening much earlier then people realize. This migration was happening from central Asia and from (IndoEuropean roots) the later stages of migration happened from east side of Afghanistan i.e. Iranian sides (IndoIranic side). The main crux that i want to say is that there were direct ancient migrations from IndoEuropean tribes and IndoEuropean linguistic roots. Out of IndoEuropean tribes came later tribes.

  20. #79
    Interesting point is "Medes" were also of "Scythic origin". If u study about "Scythians", "Scythians were into different kind of work from nomadic life style, animal grazing to agriculturists.

    Some of the tribes of "Mede" were: "Buddi" and "Arizanti".


    The capital city of country Hungary, is called Budapest.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest

    This city was made by combining two ancient cities "Buda" and "Pest".

    "Budapest became a single city occupying both banks of the river Danube with its unification on 17 November 1873 of Buda and Óbuda, on the west bank, with Pest, on the east bank"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pest,_Hungary

    According to Indian knowledge country "Hungary" is derived from "Hun ki grahi" or "Fort of the Huns".

    These might very well the same tribe that are called "Hephthalite"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hephthalite_Empire


    "Medes" appear very late in north west of Iran and come down from central asia or from the IndoEuropean roots, while most of the "Scythian tribes were still in central asia at that point of time, this also means, the migration of these central asian tribes of IndoEuropean roots kept on happening till very late in history.

  21. #80
    Last edited by agodara; June 21st, 2014 at 08:08 AM.

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